I should start off by saying that I am a Christian and pro-life in most cases. However, I also think that the dictates of my religion should not hold sway over anyone who does not subscribe to my set of beliefs. So… I’m middle of the road on abortion, inasmuch as that is possible, in that I would never have one (moot point, since I’m a lesbian) but I don’t think that other people should have their right infringed. I know this is wishy-washy, but that’s not what I want to debate. This situation actually happened to me some time ago, but I’m curious to see what the dopers have to say.
I have a friend who, when she was thirteen, had been dating a fifteen year old for quite some time. She lost her virginity to him when she was twelve. She confessed to me that they didn’t use condoms or other birth control, and it ended up almost ruining our friendship because I got so angry at her. I ended up supplying her with condoms and instructions for use. Which, apparently she didn’t follow, as she became pregnant.
She ended up asking me for advice, and after wrestling with it, I told her that I thought she should get an abortion.
This makes me wonder if there should be a different set of morals for minors. I mean… She was 13, the father ditched, and I doubt she’s going to finish high school with a kid.
I’m still wrestling with my own views on abortion because of this incident. She ended up having the child, but I’ve had almost the exact same situation arise recently. The girl this time didn’t ask for my advice, but she informs me that the only option she sees is to drop out.
So, dopers, any thoughts on the morality of teen abortion?
Oooo, this is a toughie.
I’m a (mostly) straight Christian teenage female. I happen to be a liberal in some aspects, but not when it comes to abortion.
I am glad she had the child, I probably would have too (but you never really know). I don’t want kids, now or ever, so the thing I probably would’ve done was to give the baby up for adoption, so it could (hopefully) have a better life than I, a young teenager out of school, could give it.
But that’s just IMHO.
DISCLAIMER My views are not your views, therefore there’s no need to call me on them unless you’re truly curious.
And I do believe that a mother has the final choice, and no one else. I may not like it, but I can live with it.
Difficult Q. Back in high school we discussed the idea of unwed mothers going to special schools. The ostracism involved in being pregnant in high school is, from what I hear, not something you want to deal with.
I’m opposed to killing people. Capital punishment, abortion, war, all of it. I know that’s not a terribly reasonable belief/opinion, but that’s me.
I’m also damn glad I’m not in your position. I don’t know that I’d be able to offer an explanation of my belief beyond “I don’t believe that killing a person is the right thing to do in any situation.”
And no offense meant to anyone here, at all, but I’ve found that reasoning with a pregnant woman about her child is not the most fruitful thing in the world. In the same way it’s not fruitful for people to argue about the lack of merits of sports or my academic team with me, FWIW.
So what I’d do . . . try to get her to see that killing someone doesn’t change much. And try to educate her as much about abortion as possible. If she’s going to do it, the more she knows the better off she’ll be. [wistful] Maybe she’ll even change her mind [/wistful].
I’m going to ignore the ‘killing’ remarks as abortion seems to be a pov that is immutable and there is little point discussing it with someone who has their mind set.
I can on the other hand talk about high schoolers with a bun in the oven. My mother was date raped at 16 by her then boyfriend. She was constantly harassed by her classmates.
She was called a whore, and had to endure the narrow minded slings and arrows of a bunch of uninformed pigs. She left high school, got her GED, and moved on. This was in 1970.
1985… I’m in high school at the same school she went to.
Pregnant mothers of that time were treated far better.
They were not stigmatized in the same ways, and many were supportive. Of course, this did NOT stop one of my teachers from saying in front of a class that I was a bastard.
Some people never mature or grow tolerance.
I don’t see myself as having an immutable opinion so much as I don’t believe killing a person is right. I haven’t yet seen an argument presented that would change my mind on abortion. When I do, I might well change my stance.
In a situation like that, one has to ultimately follow one’s own moral compass, and also take the entire situation in to account. When it comes to unplanned and/or unwanted pregnancy, be it teen or adult, there is no easy choice. There is only “what is right for those involved at the time.” Sometimes, having and keeping the baby is the right chioce. Sometimes, relinquishing for adoption is the right choice. Sometimes, abortion is the right choice.
Having made all three of those choices myself throughout my life, I can say that every decision I made regarding my pregnancies was the right one for me, at the time I had to make it. I do not regret any of my choices.
Your friend is ultimately the one who has to live with her decision. All you can do, really, is help her make sure she’s comfortable with whatever choice she makes. Best of luck to you and your friend.
I think she meant that unplanned pregnancies are rare among lesbians, but they do happen. Rape cases account for their share of pregnancies.
Rapists often don’t care if the woman is homosexual or heterosexual. Sometimes they don’t even care if the woman identifies herself as a woman (witness the Brandon Tina case, made into the movie Boys Don’t Cry).
An unplanned preganancy of this sort is something all woman should consider in the hypothetical. I suppose it is difficult to anticipate how any woman would react to this situation, since it is so far outside the experience (thankfully) of most women. I’m not suggesting that all pro-life woman would have an abortion under these circumstances, but I think some would.
As far as the abortion debate, I think it should be legal because of the extenuating circumstances that always arise in situations like the one listed above and in the OP. However, our goal, as a society, should be one of limiting unwanted pregnancies so as to reduce the number of woman who feel there is no other option but abortion.
I understand that you have compassion for the fix your thirteen-year-old friend has put herself in. However, the fetus in her uterus is no different than the fetus in the uterus of, say, a 22-year-old. If you believe that the latter having an abortion is murder (as your post seems to indicate), then there’s no way to believe the former isn’t as well.
There are adoption agencies out there for people like your friend. If abortion for an adult woman goes against your morals, don’t recommend it to a minor.
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Well, time for me to come off as the local hard ass. Had you advised my child to get an abortion, presumably behind my back, I’d attempt to do anything within my legal rights to make your life miserable. In fact I’d probably try to get you for supplying condoms and advice, assuming you were an adult.
I don’t have ethical problems with minors having condoms or abortion. But you weren’t qualified to counsel this teen and obviously this teen wasn’t responsible to make her own decisions. Next time reccommend that they talk to someone with experience in this area. A school councelor or something.
Hmm. I am not sure where to go with this. The most common reasons people consider abortion immoral is that it is either a) forbidden by their faith, or b) the taking of an innocent life. I can see no way in which either of those would be affected in the slightest by considering the age of the mother. If you think that a certain amount of hardship endured by the mother could possibly tip abortion from the immoral side of the scale to the moral side, then I am confused as to why you would believe it to be immoral in the first place.
Yes, lesbians can get pregnant, but barring really scary or extremely planned out circumstances, they won’t.
MGibson, In the case of the first girl, I was fifteen at the time. I should have made this clear in the OP, but don’t think that all I did was hand her condoms and say that I thought she should have an abortion- I referred her to the school counselor, gave her a bunch of information on teen pregnancy, and was as supportive as I could be. I was very much aware at the time that I was in over my head, and I made sure she was referred to people who knew how to handle this sort of thing. Also, I see nothing wrong with supplying condoms and advice on how to use them, but that’s an entirely different debate.
I should point out that this girl wasn’t going to have an abortion based on my opinion- she asked almost every one of her friends what they thought she could do, and among us we ended up endlessly debating the options.
I guess that my biggest qualm with teenage pregnancy is that it more ofen leads to sterility in the mother, the mothers are more likely to drop out, and the kids are at higher risk for birth defects, ect. I couldn’t get out of my head that the girl had only hit puberty a year and a half before pregnancy, and that there were most likely going to be health consequences beyond what an older pregnant woman would face.
What it comes down to is that I can’t reconsile my view that being a pregnant teenager- especially in the early teens- is extremely detrimental to the health of the mother with my view that abortion is wrong.
cmkeller, You do make a good point. I am beginning to think that if the situation ever rises again, I would just give the girl a list of options and a list of qualified people to talk to and not bring in my own moral views.
I went to high school in the early 70’s. Pregnant teens happened, they would “move away” for a while and then come back, thinner, some time later. Yea, I’m sure folks were jerks to them.
I have no ethical dilemma re; the abortion issue for younger moms, since my belief system allows for them.
My son is currently a high school student, and I’m not at all certain that we’ve improved the lot of pregnant teens. Instead of either abortions or adoptions (the 2 things that seemed to happen back in the 70’s ), most seem to be opting for keeping the baby, so you have at the football games, all these young women bringing their babies (and in some cases children…) to the games, and everybody ooohs and ahhhhs over how cute they are.