Teens, grades and extra curricular activities

In My Humble Opinion
21

In LIFE period he needs those as much as grades. Not everyone is meant to be super-achiever, and frankly there are way too many people who don’t get (but need) proper socialization. It sounds as if he’s doing fine.

As, Bs, and Cs? I have a question, what are the As, Bs, and Cs in? What your relative said about Alex is what teachers and others often said about me, “Shoes is really bright, but she doesn’t apply herself”. My good grades were in stuff I found really interesting, and the not-so-good grades were in stuff I wasn’t as interested in, (or actively hated…my math grades were almost never very good and I often barely passed).

Having my activities curtailed didn’t do a single blessed thing to encourage me to develop my grades, and I was a pretty typical teen. You might be better off to find out if this is the case with him, and then see if you can steer one or two of those extra-curriculars toward his academic interests.

I have a decent and interesting job and have a good life. Could I have more money if I’d have pounded the books and really learned math and higher math? Yeah… is money the be all and end all, and reason for an education in the first place? IMHO, that’s for each person to decide and it sounds like your son kind of has, at least for now (I also got much more serious about my career as I got older, as I’m sure most of us do).

22

You may also want to consider that his extracurricular activities might be what is keeping the lower grades from slipping.

In my high school we weren’t permitted to participate in any activities if we had anything lower than a C in a single class or below 2.66 (I think, it’s been a while) GPA total. Some coaches even went further. In particular the wrestling team required a minimum 3.0, otherwise you were put in a study group after practice.

If those things are taken away from him it’s possible those C grades could turn into a D grades.

23

take away his extra activities as then see his grades plummet, seen it so many times with kids I coach at a very high level of junior basketball. They get taken out of the rep team due to “poor” grades [b, c averages] and then they plummet. Not always but enough times for me to get concerned. Let him be a teenager and if he needs to catch up after high school at the local college then let him. I have seen kids in Australia go to the local TAFE college to do a VCE catch up and they may start work a year later but they have got wider interests.

24

You should refer to my MIT thread. LOTS OF GOOD ADVICE regarding this topic.

25

BTW, is Palo Verde the Younger, taking any AP/IB/honours classes and if so, are the grades you stated weighted or not?

26

I would encourage him to raise the C’s to B’s. He’s clearly not average and by his after school probably gifted in many and great ways. A’s & B’s isn’t a bad way to go through life without the pressure of always trying to be perfect.

And, with all due respect, he’s probably taking his lead from your attitude.

27

What classes are these Cs in?

28

Since I know you’re in Tucson, you’re likely talking about the U of AZ. If so, your kid really wants to get those grades up if he wants to do mechanical engineering. It’s definitely possible to get into the engineering program when you get to college, but it’s really obnoxious and prone to failure without those grades. I was thinking of picking up either computer or mechanical engineering as a second major once and their requirements are pretty annoying.

The process for high school students to get instant admittance into the major was something like (don’t take these as exact specifications, I’m going off memory) above-average scores on the new SATs (like 2000 or something? Can’t recall the new scoring systems since I was one of the last batch for the old 1600 scoring) and a GPA over 3.<mumble> (is was either 3.4 or 3.6 I think). I think they also only take the top so many, but in practice it’s not overly important to be THE BEST since they take a lot of students, you mostly just want to be in that range. This will get you acceptance into the program out of high school.

The process if you do not get admitted as an Engineering major was like: contact an Engineering adviser. If they’re not too busy, they’ll consider you on a case-by-case basis. If you pass in their eyes, they’ll add you to the basic, fundamental Engineering course – on a first-come first-served basis. But only AFTER all the pre-accepted Engineering students get in. This is a big bottleneck because this course only admits so many students (varies by semester) and must be taken by ALL Engineering, whether MIS, Mechanical, Aeronautic, Computer, whatever. As you can imagine, this makes it fill up very quickly – even only considering the students who make it in straight out of high school (and that’s a lot. U of A barely makes the Top 50 in engineering, but it DOES make the Top 50).

Now that you’ve done that, we’ll hope you did well in the course. At least a B – and from what I’ve heard that course curves like a bitch (meaning the curve is exactly distributed so certain percentages of students get A’s, B’s, and C’s) to weed out those who can’t cut it. Now they’ll give you list of about 20 courses (IIRC), you pick ones relevant for your major, with some wiggle room to gear towards you interests and take them. Some engineering, but mostly math and physics. You need at LEAST a B average in those courses to get admitted, and they still only take the top so many. This is a lot more difficult because they’re mostly just filling open slots from people who got in from high school but dropped out of the program for whatever reason. It’s a LOT more competitive. I can’t recall, but this method might also require interviews or essays or something.

Is it possible? Yeah, I know people who did it – mostly students who could have gotten in from high school but didn’t know they wanted to do Engineering yet. Some who sucked in high school but found they did better in a college setting. I didn’t do it because the Engineering idea was mostly on a whim and the hassle was too much for something I wasn’t really sure I’d be interested in in the long run.

But if your kid knows he loves Mechanical Engineering, for the love of god, which procedure would he rather follow? Them taking one look at his grades and scores and rubber-stamping him into the program or the god forsaken tedious error-prone process that you have to follow if you want to do it after you’re admitted?

29

Though personally I think his extra curricular activities are great and he should keep doing them. Pulling him out will likely make him lash out or give up. I’d recommend tutoring or something. It’s important to get the grades up, but I don’t think the “pull him from his clubs” is a good solution.

30

Kids will perform to your expectations. If you think his grades are perfectly fine, why would he try any harder?

I think you are doing him a disservice, and inadvertently telling him you don’t think he is capable of better.

I’m sure I’ll be dragged through the mud for this opinion, but I truly believe it. And I’ve got the five kids to prove it.

It also takes a lot of work on the parents part.

31

I realized that I didn’t answer the OP’s question.

Extra curricular activities are important. They do make a more rounded individual, teach them how to interact with new people in different situations, and give skills not found in the classroom. This makes a better person, not just a better college application.

I look at my job as a parent to produce highly functioning, decent, self sufficient adults. It takes work, and sacrifice. The adult can be anything from a welder, to an architect, to a nun, to a doctor, or to anything in between. Just so long as they are an asset to everyone around them, and to society at large.

As to how much a kid is capable of?

My two oldest are a senior and a junior in a college prep HS. 3.7 something, and 3.999 (she’s pissed because she’s not a 4.0 anymore, and she’s close.)

Both work part time at teen age jobs ( They each bought their own cars, have to pay their own gas, insurance and any social extras.)

One was in cross country this fall, both helped me coach their younger sister in volleyball this fall, just like they have for the last 3 years. They both are in nordic skiing that just started. National Honor Society. AP classes. Boyfriends take up time, too.

Lettered in Lacrosse, academic letters, 3 captains between them, organized a blood drive, etc. etc, etc.

They also have household chores that have to be done before they can go hang out.

All my kids are like this. They seem to be happy, have friends, boyfriends. Not overly stressed, just that’s the way life is-this is what their peers are doing as well, so this is what normal is.

I think it’s cool, and not quite sure how I got so lucky.

They also wreck stuff, steal my clothes, get in trouble with school on occasion, sneak around, and take way too many risks.

I don’t micromanage, or do their homework-I’m too damn busy myself.

But they know that we have expectations that they must fulfill if they want to have any of the good stuff. Grades are one of them, and non negotiable. Anything lower than a B and your freedom is greatly curtailed.

My 44 year old healthy husband suffered a stroke this summer, and was in the MICU for 8 days. He was expected to die-we had the chaplain and the private room at the hospital. It was terrible. He has since recovered pretty fully.

I was really glad during that awful time, and staring directly at impending widowhood, that the kids were taught from a young age to do what needs to be done. Whether it’s grades, or work ethic, or compassion. Even if the worst possible thing happened to our family, I knew we would be ok.

I digressed, but I guess my point is, it’s not just the grades, it’s the expectations.

Have high expectations for your children, you’ll be pleasantly surprised.

32

At the moment he has:

As
Honors History
Metal Working

Bs
Honors English
Algebra

Cs
Physics
Spanish

33

I don’t get why anyone would want to punish a kid for being “average” in anything.

34

If you’re going to be claiming you know what to do, then you’d need a story of how you had an underperforming kid that you pressured by means of higher expectations. As it is, you apparently have kids who naturally perform well, so you haven’t had to ever challenge your belief that parental expectations somehow motivate.

In my experience, the kids who got good grades in high school never were the same kids whose parents actually punished them for not getting good grades. And unless you are advocating punishment, I don’t know what you expect the OP to do. Withhold love?

35

If it’s just a teacher conflict, then whatever. However, if he’s legitimately struggling in these he really should get a tutor if he wants to do Mechanical Engineering. Especially the physics. Like I said, if he understands it but he’s just a bad test taker, or there’s a personality/grading conflict between him and the teacher, I wouldn’t worry about it (other than the concern in my post above), but if he’s legitimately having trouble I think he should get help if he really wants to follow through with ME.

36

I’d want him to cut back on some of the extracurriculars, not all. It seems to me that he’s over-extending himself, or not managing his time well enough. Marching band and track would have to go until he was free of Cs, and possibly the library as well.

Do it as carrot and stick.

37

He’s taking Physics at the same time as basic Algebra? I think I see his problem already. :stuck_out_tongue:

His A classes are lightweight fluff, academically speaking. The Bs are in solid classes and he’s passing the two hard ones. As long as he isn’t in danger of failing those classes, let him be. You can’t force him to learn, and it sounds like he’s plenty busy with good stuff for Life as it is.

College is over-rated.

38

Very rarely does anyone have children that ‘naturally perform well.’

If there is no tangible motivation to do well, or your parents go “eh, good enough” or your peers could care less, the likelihood of you excelling is minimal.

Parental expectations DO motivate. I have had kids that have scored poorly, and we have had a C at least once in middle school. Here’s what happened.

No TV/Screen time
No social activities

The rationale is obviously you can’t manage your time to handle all the extra things while maintaining our grade standards.

Extra organized curricular activity is still allowed, unless the grades did not improve, then that would be reevaluated.

Never had to get to that point. Usually only lasted a week or two.

I am completely and utterly advocating natural consequences with punishment. That’s part of expectations, duh.

I am heartily sick of parents throwing up their hands and giving up. They’re your kids, if you aren’t go to be their cheerleader, coach, who the hell is?

If you have told your child “good job” since they’ve been little when it really wasn’t a good job, they just happened to show up, you have taught your child that you don’t think they are capable of much, let alone something extraordinary.

If you don’t make them do chores, inadvertently you are expressing the idea they are not capable. If they don’t make dinner occasionally, you are not letting them contribute to the family. If they don’t do extra activities, they can’t figure out who they are as a person, and how to deal with new situations with new people and new rules.

Their job is to go to school, get good grades, and do what they are supposed to do. That’s the deal.

Tangentially, all my kids know that they are responsible for paying for their own college education. I pay for their schooling until their senior year of high school, they are responsible after that.

I have given them the tools and the opportunities they need to succeed in life, they have to choose where to go from there. Not surprisingly, they do really well in high school, because they know it matters. Additionally, I realize college is not for everyone, and there are many viable jobs that create a sense of satisfaction and contribute to the world.

It’s all about motivation. Usually it’s carrot, but they know I carry a big stick. That’s why I never have to use it. But you have to start this process from the very beginning-high school is a little hard to start putting this stuff in place.

39

I really don’t consider “Marching Band” an extracurricular. It’s more like “incredibly long homework for a class.” At least that’s always how it worked at my schools – you WERE graded on showing up to after-school practices, games, and competitions.

That said, band is an elective, so he could not take the class, but it’s not an extracurricular you can just up and drop like track is.

40

Not if you want to be or think you want to be a mechanical engineer or the like. Yeah, I guess there are some self taught rock star type mechanical engineers that never actaully went to college but I suspect they are somewhat rare.