[QUOTE=counsel wolf]
Whereas i stopped arguing when you obviously didn’t read my posts.
I said that what was actually happening was that people were being ganked by single cruisers cos they wouldn’t fit a minimalistic tank. You then talked about turning up with your mates in battleships. If you want to bring a single cruiser to 0.6 spec space and try blow up a hulk of mine, I’ll consider taking up the offer.
[/QUOTE]
Disclaimer: I can’t fly a Procurer, let alone a Hulk.
Disclaimer: I’ve never been suicide ganked, use a blockade runner to move small valuable cargo in high sec, don’t load over about 500M into my freighter, etc, etc, etc, etc.
Hulk with a standard high sec fit (T2 strips and MLUs, small C5-L, named EM & thermal resistance amps, named cap charger) has ~12k effective hp and tanks a further ~75hp/sec, assuming near max skills. The only way to do substantially better is to use a Gistii A-type small booster and faction hardeners, but that doesn’t qualify as a minimalistic tank. Or I guess we could drop the MLUs, but why the hell are we mining in high sec if we’re going to give away 20% of our yield?
If we give CONCORD 20 seconds to show up, that’s 13500hp meaning we need about 675dps to kill it, or 475dps if CONCORD takes 30s. A gank 'rax puts out about 600dps with realistic skills (T2 guns, faction ammo). Rupture is similar, Omen comes in around 500, and let’s not talk about Caldari dps. Note that this damage comes in a full spread of types, so we can’t reasonably load up on specific resistances. Seems to me that a well-piloted suicide gank T1 cruiser has pretty close to even shot at blowing up a tanked Hulk before CONCORD shows. Make it two cruisers and the Hulk doesn’t have a chance. Heck toss in a destroyer, or switch to 3 destroyers and no cruiser, and the Hulk is toast.
If you don’t like the T2 guns, we just need two cruisers or four destroyers, and maybe not even that if CONCORD is a bit slow - which they often are in .6 belts. Any which way you slice it, it is trivial to gank a Hulk in high sec at minimal expense, even if the Hulk pilot does everything right short of warping out the instant he sees anyone on the overview - which in high sec means he won’t get any mining done, so isn’t a viable option.
Note well, I’m not complaining. I would like it if CCP would institute some way of defending against suicide ganks that would actually be feasible, but I don’t see any such way without either seriously changing mechanics or dramatically buffing CONCORD response time, neither of which I’d really like to see. So I’m really not bitching about the current situation. But it is just incredibly naive to say that it’s easy to counter suicide ganking. It isn’t. It’s pretty much impossible. The only good way is to get out of crowded core systems and find some reasonably quiet backwater, get to know the locals, and become very twitchy when strangers are in local. Thing is, even in relatively remote high sec systems there’s most often strangers in local. Remember that the guy mining with a Hulk in high sec is wanting to kick back and relax after work. If he wanted to be on the edge of his seat, he wouldn’t be bloody high sec mining. So he’s not going to be twitchy, and if someone does come along looking for a gank he’s not likely to warp out before being tackled. So this isn’t even a counter to high sec ganking, it’s just using best odds to avoid it.
So yeah, maybe some of those guys in the video might not have died to that Catalyst if they’d had a bit of tank on (though a Catalyst puts out pretty serious damage, and it was probably mostly Retrievers and Covetors it was attacking, so probably not much chance at survival). But if the ganking was the least bit organized, they had someone doing passive target/scan and knew exactly which of the barges had tanks, and used the appropriate dps level for the specific job - which makes it likely that the miners would have died anyways, the gankers would have just lost an extra ship to do it.
Go ahead and blame the victim when someone AFK autopilots a T1 hauler with 500 mill in cargo aboard from Oursulaert to Jita, but there just isn’t any practicable defense against an organized group suicide ganking.
