In the case under discussion, the uncharitable assumptions were made before any questions were even asked. I hadn’t hidden anything before the assumptions had been made.
When I did subsequently irately hide it, I explained very clearly the reason I was hiding it. Again, people had to make uncharitable assumptions to conclude I was lying (or something). Not at all the way I would have reacted had I seen the situation third-personally.
I think my way is better.
It’s unfortunate that you can’t expect this. It’s unfortunate that people would jump to conclusions based on a single sentence when they should know that there can very plausibly* be plenty they don’t know here.
I would have probably wondered about the reason for taking off the top, to be sure. But if it were any of my business, I’d ask first–along with verbiage designed to ensure I wasn’t being confrontational–rather than saying, basically, “Wow you’re way off base here. Now prove you’re not!”
I like my way better. I think I’ll keep it.
*I’ll admit it seems less plausible than “it can be reasonable on some occasions to let a kid jump on a couch” but even so, one should maintain awareness of just how much it is possible not to know about a situation where one has heard just one single sentence about it.
It is (exaggerated) in mine. But I also agree that, to some degree:
I only agree to some degree, because there are some red flag behaviors that indicate things like hearing loss or autism that are best identified, diagnosed and given professional intervention as early as possible. No amount of DIY is going to give your kid a cochlear implant.
Gotta go with your gut, I think. This isn’t something that can be answered for anyone else’s family. But I do think that at 8, and reading the books you’ve said you’ve read, you’ve either tried a whole lot and it hasn’t worked, or you haven’t figured out how to apply it. I think maybe you are edging past the exhaustion of your own resources, and it’s time to call in some support. I can’t be sure of course, but that’s my opinion at this point in the thread.
“I am not going to explain or justify that sentence because I’ve seen far too many such threads on the SDMB to do anything so stupid. I’m simply going to make the assertion, and leave it at that. No, this should not convince you–but nothing will convince you, so that is no concern of mine.”
“I am bothering to [assert without explicit evidence that it was reasonable] just in hopes of jogging in people the realization that they’re making a lot of unjustified assumptions. That would be nice, if people realized that in general. But your opinion of my parenting is the furthest thing from my mind in any of this.”
"It is irrelevant to me what anyone here thinks about whether or not I’m a good parent.
“I’d like to just leave it at that, but people keep insisting on demanding explanations, and indeed, making up stories in order to “support” actual assertions that I’m not a good parent. I’m not sure how to make my point about the irrelevance of your opinions without either simply repeating the above, or else by using sarcasm to get you to discover the irrelevance of your opinion for yourself. Any sustained logical argument over the matter would presume I do care about your opinion–and my very point is that I don’t and shouldn’t. There’s the correlated point that you guys are making a great number of false statements based on unjustified assumptions, and I’ve been trying to get you to see that as well,…”
“…A) I don’t care what you think [about whether I am a good parent or not], and B) no one ever wins those discussions at the SDMB.”
Those are just a few of the times I’ve explained it.
These paragraphs are not difficult to read, nor do they make any logically difficult points. If you read them and don’t understand my reasons for having hidden the story originally, that is entirely your problem. I cannot help you with it.
But according to you that missing piece of information was the whole point–it was the explanation for why it was okay to allow your son to jump on the couch. I’m as confused as I ever was.
Yes…I don’t even understand what you mean by “self-understanding.” Are you saying that you don’t want to label the kid as having a problem, because you think that might affect their self-esteem? I think you don’t realize how sophisticated interventions are these days and how common. Therapy isn’t just to treat severe mental illness, it’s there to help people with coping skills, which is where your daughter seems to need help. Oftentimes it can be provided in school. Many kids in our school have “pull-outs” for all kinds of things…speech therapy, occupational therapy, help with organizing skills, help with anxiety. It’s really not a big deal and no one thinks anything of it.
It can be either, depending on the problem and the severity. If what you’re doing isn’t working, or you don’t know what to do (both of which seem to be applicable here), there’s no shame in getting help.
Thanks I appreciate that advice and the spirit in which you offered it.
To be clear about one thing,I’ve said I’ll look into the books mentioned here, but I haven’t read any of them except some of the Love and Logic stuff.
I said somewhere (in this thread I think?) that the feedback I’m getting from here and multiple other resources seems, on average, to indicate what I’m describing is within the realm of normal. Those insisting otherwise seem, on average, to be outliers. Right now my gut is that this isn’t clinical, but I’m on the lookout.
I think people have the impression that this has been going on ever since the other post a year ago, but that’s actually not the case. It was like a “flare up” back then, and then it’s been kind of a “flare up” in the past couple of weeks or so. There’s the added stress of the move (for her and for me) and other things like that which could easily be the best explanation.
Basically, I’m continuing to monitor, and I’m adding to my efforts to watch myself just as much. I should confess part of what led to the OP was that, indeed, I basically did lose my shit with her that day. It was unfair to her, was wrong of me, made me feel like utter crap about myself, and just basically gave me a sleepless night. (Two of em in fact.)
Not quite. I expect she’ll label herself. Even if I go to every effort to avoid letting it be a “labeling” situation, the kid’s not stupid. She knows most kids don’t go talk to a doctor about how they feel.
A while ago we did broach the topic with her teacher and she was willing to help us with it but wasn’t sure it was necessary. Possibly we should have been more assertive about it but at the time we weren’t. If the problem continues (see prior post for clarification that this is something that flares up, not something that happens every day every week all year) we’ll pursue that again.
One thing is this is her last couple of weeks at this school district, so we may just need to wait and see how things are at the new school first.
Frylock, from what all you’ve said, it sounds like you and your wife are stretched really thin, both as to time and patience. This is not a criticism; just an observation (I totally get it – I’m 47 years old, and I have a toddler and a new baby). Also, didn’t your family just move?
These are reasons why your daughter might be feeling a fair amount of stress as well, and acting out. Is there any way you can get more help in your household, or simplify some of what you and your wife have going on, so that you’re not so much on a mental treadmill all the time?
with the caveat that I’m not a parent, I really, really don’t think Frylock is the only parent out there with a child they (for lack of a better term) “don’t like so much.” it’s just that society has made it taboo to ever admit that.
not that it qualifies as a cite, but I’ve read a few of those “anonymous confessions” types of sites (my little brand of voyeurism) and I’d seen more than a few posts like this. e.g. “I looked at my son’s Twitter feed and I can’t believe what an asshole he is.”
My kid’s not stupid, either, but she doesn’t feel bad about her therapy. Maybe the idea is to help her understand that there’s nothing WRONG with talking to a doctor about how she feels. And, anyway, talking about feelings isn’t all it is, it’s really teaching coping skills for when you feel stressed. And that’s probably something everyone could use help with. Don’t put your issues on your kid…she’ll only feel bad about it if she gets the feeling from you that she should.
Also don’t call me a bullshitter or accuse me of failing to “step up” in the future please. That was ridiculous, as the later reasonable conversation has shown.
We’ve been to therapy a number of times with my kids. They were fine with it because we were fine with it. We used to prevent more problems and to give us a outsiders perspective on the situation. It helped out family’s communication and my child heard from a neutral source when we were in the right! Therapy isn’t a route of last resort. It prevents damage being to the child and the family relationship. I can tell you taht the stress in your family can affect the other kids as well, and they seeing you taking it seriously and trying to get help makes them feel better too.
You’ve never done therapy with your kids- listen to those of us who have. I have no crystal ball for you to know if therapy would be valuable to your family, but don’t assume you know what it’s all about because you don’t.
Right, this is how I see it too. The kid is showing signs of not being able to manage stress very well. She might outgrow this quirk on her own, but why gamble on that happening when a professional might be help?
If she’s hungry for attention, she might see therapy as a positive thing. When I was 8, I remember envying other kids who had broken arms or chronic illness, because they were treated as special. The idea of having a disorder was a prospect that crazy me would have actually relished in. How we view mental health as adults has little bearing with how kids view these things.
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If the kid’s behaving in a way that makes a parent not like them, the family can likely benefit from some kind of intervention, IMO.
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There I guess I disagree.
I have the two best kids in captivity, and there have been times I disliked them. Obviously I have no idea how similar Frylock’s family is to mine.
If I ever ask for relationship advice on the SDMB, or the Internet in general, do me a favor and shoot me.
What a bad parent you are for not asking for advice on the Internet! You’re going to screw up your kids beyond repair! Here’s what you need to do differently…
Look, if you’re going to dismiss reasonable suggestions out of hand because of bullshit reasons, I’m going to tell you they’re bullshit. And if it looks like you aren’t stepping up where you should be due to these bullshit reasons, I’m going to say that, too. Sorry if you don’t like it, but your kid’s well-being is more important than your delicate sensibilities.
