Tesla Model 3 anticipation thread

In My Humble Opinion
1

Well, the Tesla Model 3 has been officially launched, even if the only people currently getting them are Tesla employees or big investors.

To get non-Tesla fans up to speed: the Model 3 has been Tesla’s highly anticipated midrange model, starting at $35k, and with >215 miles range. In terms of price segment, it’s supposed to be competition for vehicles like the BMW 3-series and Audi A4. Not quite cheap, but within financial range for an average American. Especially considering the $7.5k Federal rebate and possible state rebates.

I’ve had a $1k deposit down for the Model 3 for over a year now (as a replacement for my 14-year-old 330i) and it looks like it’s going to happen within several months.

They announced the starting options packages, and opinions are somewhat mixed, but personally I think they sound pretty good. Basic rundown:

$35k base price (220 miles, 0-60 in 5.8 s, 15" main console, fabric seats, autopilot hardware (but not software), supercharging)
+$9k for large battery (310 miles, 0-60 in 5.1 s)
+$1k for metallic/multicoat paint
+$1.5k 19" wheels
+$5k premium package (synthetic leather seats, glass roof, etc.)
+$5k enhanced autopilot
+$3k full self-driving (not yet enabled)

More detailed specs here. The $9k for the big battery is steep, but man, 310 miles… that’s great. The cheapest Model S that beats that is >$100k. And no other electric on the road comes close.

I’ll have to think about the other options–one thing they’ve said is that they’re keeping the options bundled for now to simplify the manufacturing. So I may have to accept a few things I don’t care about to get the other things I do. But that’s not hugely atypical in this segment.

The delivery sate predictor says Nov 2017 - Jan 2018. I got in pretty early so I suspect this is about as quick as it gets for non-employees and non-owners. Current Model S/X may get theirs a month or two sooner.

I know a few others here have a deposit on a Model 3… thoughts on the latest?

2

Sounds like a winner to me: Exclusive: Tesla Model 3 First Drive Review

3

The first 30 going to employees/associates is their beta/prototype test. Despite their claims to the contrary.

They can’t make 20,000 cars/year at $60-130k a pop with any semblance of quality, I’ve no confidence they can try to make 500,000 which are any good.

4

I’ll let you know in a few months :).

They say they’ve learned their lesson with the S and the X. Neither of them had a focus on manufacturability. The Model 3–they claim–is simpler and easier to build. There are a few respects in which that’s obviously true: it’s made from steel instead of aluminum; it’s missing a lot of gimmicky features like the Falcon Wing doors and auto-presenting door handles; it has simplified, bundled options; the initial versions will simply not have certain features like all-wheel drive; and so on.

They aren’t going to 500k/yr instantly, anyway. They expect ~100 in August; ~1000 in September, and perhaps 20k in December. They won’t hit 40k/mo until next year sometime.

5

you realize Tesla is not the first company in the world to start designing and building cars, right?

When they ship garbage like this to customers on their expensive cars, I’m not confident in their ability to deliver anything resembling quality to a $35k price point. Sure, the Elon Musk Adoration Society will gladly take whatever they shovel out, but what happens when they get someone out of their Accord or Camry?

There’s a company right now making 3/4 of a million pickup trucks out of aluminum every year. Cop out.

6

I actually agree with this criticism. The Model 3 competes with entry-level European sedans, not Camrys. The Euro sedans cost more for what you get than the Asian vehicles. Already I’ve seen some complaints in this direction, such as that their Kia Shitbox has heated seats at $20k while the Model 3 does not at $35k; while true, it indicates that they’ve never tried to price out a 3-series with a decent options package. That’s not to dismiss their complaints, but there may be some adjustment of expectations that Tesla will need to manage. $35k is a hell of a deal, but only if you value the advantages that come with an electric and the general Tesla design aesthetic.

Personally, after test driving a Model S, I had a hard time going back to my gas car. It just feels so… janky.

Yeah, and they’re a century older than Tesla, so they have a bit more experience with manufacturing. The transition to aluminum for the F150 was still fairly painful as I understand it. The point is that steel is cheaper, has a longer history and even now is better understood than aluminum. It’s just one less obstacle that Tesla has to face when ramping up production.

As for that photo… well, that’s certainly bad, but then I’ve never heard of a manufacturer that’s never produced a lemon before. I hope they’ve fixed whatever defect they had in their QC process.

I do wish there were better competition for the Model 3. The Bolt is the only one that comes close in terms of range, but it’s inferior to the Tesla in basically every other way except those factors you get with buying from a more well-established brand. Not even close to worth it, IMO.

Everyone I know with a Tesla loves theirs. Call them fanboys if you want but I’m pretty sure the reason they put up with the annoyances is because the electric driving experience is so fantastic.

7

:dubious:

we’re not talking about a “lemon.” we’re talking about a significant defect in structural sheet metal which should have been caught before that panel even got to the body assembly line, nevermind to the end customer.

there were a few “teething problems” yet it was still managed within a ~4 year product cycle.

The Bolt is superior in one very, very critical way- you can buy one right now. But it’s languishing because you lot seem to have the end goal of not “buy an EV with usable range,” but “buy a Tesla.”

8

I want a car that:

  • Has decent range
  • Looks good
  • Has access to a high-speed and widely available charging network
  • Performs at a level roughly similar to my 330i
  • Has a smooth and well-designed head unit
  • Has some kind of self-driving feature. Highway lane-keeping at the least.

The Bolt kinda hits the first one (though they don’t offer a 300+ mile version), but none of the rest.

All that said, I think the Bolt would be a fine car for many people, but I don’t think Chevy dealerships know how to sell it, or even really want to sell it. Tesla doesn’t have the problem of competing with other models from the same manufacturer.

9

Nothing on your list mentions drivetrain. Buy a plug-in hybrid, say, a Fusion Energi, which has a great lane-keeping system and adaptive cruise control.

Or continue to wait for a Tesla. I think they’re overrated, but I can understand people who stick to brands, as I’ve been an Apple user since the Mac Plus, and we’re a bunch of idiots who buy something because it says Apple, and your criticism of Apple doesn’t phase me, and I still like my Apple products even when they screw up (Antenna Gate, Bend-Gate, no earphone connection, no floppy, etc., etc.).

10

Actually, although the press keeps saying nobody wants a Bolt, there is a waiting list: my Chevrolet dealer tells me the delay to get a Bolt is about 5-6 months. (Normal delay for a factory-ordered GM is 2-3 months.)

And the BMW dealer said the delay for an i3 was about 3 months. I didn’t ask about the i8. :slight_smile:

11

jz78817, this is a Tesla Model 3 anticipation thread. Is denigrating Tesla and the insulting the people who want one really productive here? There’s another, less pleasant word for that sort of thing.

For myself, it may be a couple of years before I get to buy a new car, but I read all of these kinds of threads about electric cars for information and in anticipation of when I can get into the market.

12

I’m keeping an eye out for the UK launch. Hopefully they won’t jack the price up too much and it will be similar to the i3.

13

I’m somewhat conflicted on the Model 3. On one hand, it looks really exciting, and my hats off to Tesla for maintaining schedule (so far).

On the other hand, there’s no way that I could buy one soon enough to get the full $7,500 tax credit, so I’m not all that hot to spend ~20% more than what I could probably get a roughly competitive offering in the 2019 timeframe when I expect to get a new car. Also, I am a little concerned about Tesla’s quality issues, even though they seem to generally have better customer service than many major car brands. And finally, I really think I need to actually see the car to assess whether the weird trunk size issue is a problem or not, and to get used to the one-panel center display. I think those are probably not dealbreakers, but I’m not ready to put down $1,000 for a reservation until I know they aren’t.

14

It’s languishing because it’s expensive ($37.5k for base) , the design aesthetics seem to be intentionally more along the lines of “quirky/weirdmobile”, and the DC fast charging network for the Bolt is nowhere near charging speeds or quantities of what the supercharger network is. This is maybe just personal preference, but while the bolt’s motor has a lot of pep, it should probably be on a RWD platform, as basic EV design (low battery pack along the floor, compact motor) lends itself nicely to that. Plus GM doesn’t market it, the GM dealerships don’t seem to know how to sell it, or even know it exists.

If GM had put out a sleeker RWD/AWD EV with a bigger motor, and put some effort into a fast-charging network, I’d probably be buying that car instead. I don’t care much about Tesla’s autopilot features, so I won’t even throw that into the mix.

Tesla’s aforementioned quality control issues are the only thing that worries me about the Model 3. I’d probably prefer to wait a few years to see how they manage to scale production while not sacrificing quality control. But I’m willing to risk it against the rapidly disappearing $7500 federal tax credit.

15

Time will tell whether Tesla can deliver on its promises. I think the Model 3 looks pretty sharp and one major advantage the Model 3 has over the Bolt is an established charging network. Most likely I trade my 2012 Volt in for a new model of Volt before putting money down on a Tesla in the near term. But hopefully there’ll be enough early adapters of the Model 3 to increase the size of their charging network.

16

Color me doubtful that this is a major consideration in people’s choice of EV.

First of all, I’m just not sure how much people actually use these fast charging stations. I think non-EV drivers tend to think of them as gas stations, but that’s a bad analogy for a few reasons – mainly, because they are SO much slower than gas stations. There was an article not long ago that raced a Model S (I forgot the battery capacity) against a Model T on a long drive, and frankly there wasn’t much difference between the two. If “filling up” takes the better part of a hour, it just plain isn’t good to take EVs on cross-country trips yet.

According to this, the number of fast charging sites (which may have multiple chargers) shows something interesting. If you’re looking for a fast charge, odds are that you should buy a Nissan Leaf, because there are like four times more fast chargers for that car than for Tesla. The main difference is that Tesla spreads theirs out far better, expecting that people want to take long road trips in EVs.

What I can’t find is any data that shows how much Superchargers or other fast charging plugs are used. If I had to guess, I would not be surprised at all that people actually need to use them quite infrequently, but might use them more if they are free.

17

While I was initially disappointed by some of the options packaging (I really want to get the glass roof, but don’t want to spend $5k on all the other “premium” features to get it), it was buoyed by some of the initial press coverage that has been pretty flattering, like this quote from the motortrend article linked above:

And this article from bloomberg

18

When car magazine reviewers say a car is “firm”, doesn’t that mean harsh and uncomfortable? Most people don’t want cars that rides like sports cars.

19

If I bought a Model 3 (or S or X or Bolt, etc), I would only be using it to commute and drive around town. Being plugged into a 240v socket overnight in my garage would be amply sufficient for 99.5% of my recharging needs.

20

Probably 99.9% of my mileage on my current car is round-trips of 100 miles or less. Personally, I doubt I’ll even use the superchargers at all, unless I want to start taking it on family road trips (that we currently use my wife’s SUV for). But there’s a mental block around purchasing a vehicle that doesn’t give me the freedom to do those sorts of things, that I don’t know if I can rationalize. I don’t mind the hassle of 45 minute stops to recharge, especially if we have to eat somewhere for lunch/dinner anyway. But 2 hours+ to recharge just seems something I’d rather have to do without, especially if its at an inconvenient location that may be completely inoperable once you get to it (I’ve heard reports of stations broken for weeks without anyone dealing with it), or located at a stall at a dealership that the salespeople have decided to completely block off overnight with other parked cars (I’ve heard Nissan is prone to doing this).