Texas...where white trash get paid not to breed.

In My Humble Opinion
1

Project Prevention is what they call it. A program here in Texas where they’ll pay you $200 for a man to get his tubes tied. Now sure, some people like to go through the process because they just don’t want to have children. But this program is designed to reach out to those middle/lower class men who are habitual drug users or alcoholics and the like and say “Hey, you know you’re not ready to have kids, so come on in and we’ll fix the problem for you.”

Okay, so in some instances it sounds alright. But like I said, it’s best if it’s a decision made by a person on their own, without being goaded by some self righteous wealthy white woman telling them “You don’t deserve to reproduce.”

Maybe I’m just thinking too much and taking too much offense to this. What’s your opinion?

2

If it’s voluntary, I don’t see the problem at first pass.

3

Alberta used to have a law in which any Albertan with a low IQ would be forcubly sterilized. The law was eventually discarded. At least in Texas they get the choice :frowning:

4

I think it’s a great idea as long as it’s voluntary. What drug addict needs to be bring children into their madness?

5

It’s a brilliant idea. They should make it a national program.
I could use the $200…

6

Programs like this have been tried in the past with fecund welfare mothers and/or drug abusing mothers, and generally engendered calls of racism and race genocide by advocates for the poor who accuse these programs of taking advantage of desperate people (who are mostly black).

What makes this program different? You’re essentially bribing a desperate male drug addict to more or less permanently give up his right to breed. Should we do the same thing to poor people because of the burden their childen are likely to impose of the social welfare system? How about people with a genetic predisposition for mental illness. People with below 80 IQs. Violent criminals. Petty criminals. Women who are likely to get breast cancer. Diabetics. Everyone can use use a buck or two.

Rationally I can fully support restricting some people’s right to breed. I just don’t know where choice begins and coercion ends on this particular slippery slope.

Ask not for whom the tube is tied. It is tied for thee.

7

I think that if anyone can do it, and it is completly voluntary, there is no problem. No where does the law say you HAVE to be a drug addict or convicted felon, right? Or does it? I mean, Hell, if I ever decide to have a vasectomy I’m going to have it done in Texas where I get paid, and not the other way round. :slight_smile:

And, AFAIK, a vasectomy is not permenant, it can be undone in most circumstances (Hell, I’m pretty sure that it undoes itself a fair share of the time as well.)

8

Do you mean a vasectomy? Getting your tubes tied is what women get done, I thought.

At any rate, I don’t see what’s wrong with it, if it is voluntary. There are way too many kids born to parents who don’t want them or can’t take care of them. It does appear creepy, but it works both way. Society has one less person to worry about reproducing, and the guy gets two hundred dollars. Everyone wins.

9

I’ve had personal experience with those who should not breed, so the program sounds good to me. Can I provide a list of potential candidates?

I think that as a voluntary program it’s fine. Of course the argument could be made that an addict might make the choice simply to get money for the next fix, so it’s not completely voluntary. I, however, am not the one to make that argument.

10

If you already have children, can you still qualify if you want a vasectomy so that you don’t have any more kids?

11

If I’m not mistaken, this project sounds like a privately funded program started as an inducement to stop women giving birth to crack babies. The woman that began the program that has adopted 4 or 5 babies that were all born to the same drug addicted mother. Why are you automatically assumed that she is a:

?

If it is indeed the same person, she’s certainly neither self righteous or wealthy- just a woman who’s trying to stop irresponsible reproduction. I also recall reading that more [bold] white[/BOLD] female addicts have taken her up on the offer than any other race.

I think that you’re way off base here.

12

White women are getting vasectomies?

I may be off on the woman who started it, I don’t know much about her, only that she’s starting this project. I think the concept is good; reducing the number of babies addicted to whatever is a very good thing. But something about this program just bugs me.

I guess I take it more as a subtle assault on the lower class. As someone else stated, if someone is addicted, who’s to say they won’t just use this as a means to get their next fixed? And when the time comes that they do decide they’re ready to have children (whever that may be), who’s going to pay to have the procedure un-done? Sure it’s simple to say “If they’re ready to have kids, they should have enough money to undo the procedure,” but you know that’s not always the case. I don’t know how much a reverse vasectomy costs, but I’m sure it’s more than $200.

And it opens up a whole bunch of other odd situations. For instance, now there’s a bunch of steryle men going around. Suppose they have some type of disease (HIV, the clap, genital warts, what have you). They’re less likely now to use protection than they were prior to the procedure, so it could possibly lead to an epidemic amongst the lower class, or increasing already developed epidemics. Sexually transmitted diseases are a huge problem in many places, and I honestly don’t think this is going to help.

As for your implication that more white women are taking her up on the offer, there was no need for that. The subject head says White Trash. I already played the race card, thank you.

13

I understand your logic, but I don’t necessarily accept that as fact. Is there any hard evidence?

14

If it is purely voluntary, I see know problem with it.

But then again, to flip the question around how about this:

People with genetic physical/mental defects: Receive $200 and get sterilized. Purely voluntary.

What would people say to that?

15

I will have to direct some people to Texas for the good of the gene pool.

16

i can see a problem.

addict uses money to buy crack.
overdoses.
dies.

or

addict goes into rehab
stays clean
marries
wants kids
can’t have 'em.

and while tubal ligation for FEMALE addicts will reduce the number of crack babies, sterilising the MEN doesn’t necessarily do the same.

i don’t think you should use money as an incentive with people who will lie, kill, steal and prostitute themselves for drugs.
you may as well just hand them the crack.

17

What if it was $40 a “pop” for a woman to come in every 6 months and get a DepoProvera shot? Or Norplant (those rods under the arm skin). Or a similar (still non-existant!) male contraceptive that’s reversible? Would it then be more palatable? Eliminate the “genocide” cries? I think so. And I’d support it.

18

With all due respect, El Elvis Rojo, the OP referenced race orginally and that’s why I noted that more white women are accepting the offer.
This is not, to the best of my knowledge, targeted at any particular racial group-just junkies.
I think I understand your distaste-let’s face it, only poor people are going to sign up for this program and many of them will do it without regard for the long term consequences of giving up their reproductive rights. Anything for that next fix/bowl. However, I also think that anyone who would willing give up that right for chump change, probably isn’t making a reasoned choice on the whole birth issue anyway.

An aside:did anyone see see “Citizen Ruth” with Laura Dern?

19

According to the official site of the organization, http://www.cashforbirthcontrol.com/
they don’t HAVE to get sterilized…they can also go on a long term reversible b/c method like Depo-Provera, much like what wireless proposed. See here:
http://www.cashforbirthcontrol.com/program/index.html

I don’t think Barbara Harris, the program’s founder, is racist or self-righteous. Whether her program is actually helping or not, I think she has good INTENTIONS. She may be white, but her husband AND her adopted children are black.
This article gives more details about her:
http://dir.salon.com/mwt/feature/1998/07/cov_10feature.html

I don’t think this is any worse than those programs to provide clean needles to addicts. Both approaches are basically saying, “Okay, if you’re not going to stop doing drugs, at least try to limit the damage from your habit.”

As long as nobody is being forced to be sterilized, I see nothing wrong with this. We often can’t protect people from themselves, but we can try to prevent their actions from hurting innocent victims.

So, to summarize the points raised…
With LT b/c or sterilizations: Some people might later want kids. Some people might choose to have sex without condoms and contract an unpleasant, but not necessarily fatal, STD. Some people might choose to buy more drugs and hurt themselves.
Without the LT b/c or sterilizations: Innocent children might suffer and die through no fault of their own, just because of their parents’ drug habit.

I am sure it’s no fun to have herpes/genital warts/etc. or to regret being sterilized, but I doubt the pain and regret REALLY compare to the pain and suffering of a crack-addicted newborn. More importantly, I don’t think it’s fair to risk allowing more harm to innocent victims (crack babies) just because, otherwise, some people (drug addicts) might make a poor decision and hurt themselves in the process.

If the government were trying to sterilize people against their will, I would be outraged. However, as long as these people have the right to say “NO” to Barbara Harris’s offer, I see no problem.

20

Ah, Texas! As long as you are in the union, folk from Missouri will have a place to ridicule! :smiley:

As far as the program goes, I say, “Yo gets yo dime, you’se takes yo chances!”. The kind of people that would spring at the chance of "$200 free cash money!! are the kind of people I don’t want to be spewing out kids. Its a win-win! They get some drug money, and my car stereo is safe!

She said she loved me like a brother. Thats great, cause she’s from Arkansas!