The Great Ongoing Guitar Thread

Cafe Society
1161

I’ve found that you rarely need to play a chord with all 6 strings, even in rock. For that grip above, I usually play the middle four strings.

In jazz, things can get very economical, playing just 3 or even 2 notes of a chord, emphasizing the 3rd and 7th. Then you add in any alterations, particularly flat and sharp 5th and 9th on a dominant 7th chord. When you are playing 3 or 4 notes, instead of trying to span all 6, it opens up a huge number of possibilities for voicings. I play a plain vanilla major triad chord several different ways, depending on what inversion I want, what the bass player is playing, how fat I want the chord to sound, what other instruments are there and how they are playing.

Let’s take the D7 example above. If I am comping on a big band chart with a piano player, I might approach it Freddie Green style and just stroke quarter notes. Otherwise I’m just battling for real estate with the pianist. I would play a D7 as

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That’s 1st, 3rd, 7th. But that puts the root in the bass, and more often than not the bass player is on the same note. So I might invert to put the root on top

xx453xx

which you have play in position III.

If the piano player is in the same register and I want to get up above him, I move to position X



1 111
0x010x

Omit the root on 6 if it clobbers the bass player. What’s left is 7th, 3rd, 5th. And you can almost always omit the 5th if you want to be austere.

I played two gigs last month as part of a guitar/bass/flute trio. In that situation I need to fatten up the chords a little since there’s no piano, but I still stay away from doubling the bass, which is even more of a sore thumb in that situation. And I still almost never play 6-note chords.

1162

CookingWithGas - I couldn’t agree more! That was the secret of Ed Bickert’s playing - you never need more than two notes at a time, and you can get beautiful effects from implying more harmony than is explicitly stated. His work with Paul Desmond and especially on ‘Mutual Street’ with Rob McConnell was a textbook in tasteful comping.

1163

That’s really interesting. I keep hearing guitarists lauding Ed Bickert but I haven’t heard that much of him. I have Paul Desmond Live, which is a quartet with Bickert. Good work but I am still puzzled by such high praise. Maybe I just need to hear more of him.

1164

I grew up thinking Ed Bickert and Lenny Breau were the standard for non-fusion jazz guitarists. It took me a while to figure out that it wasn’t that other guys were bad, it was just that Ed and Lenny were incredible.

Jim Hall is another one whose style is similar to Ed’s. I don’t think they influenced each other’s development, but they both have a huge respect for each other. It was Jim Hall who suggested Paul Desmond should hook up with Ed Bickert.

1165

Oh, hey, someone asked me something and I didn’t have a good answer.

Is there an easy way to go to B7 in a 12 bar blues progression?

(I’m having enough trouble playing 12 bar blues progressions. I’m getting better…)

1166

What key are you playing it in, and when does the B7 come in? And when you say easy, do you mean an easy voicing/fingering? Not sure why B7 would pose a particular problem, any more than any other chord…

1167

I’m guessing in E, so open-E, open-A, barred B, and the barre is the crux of the problem.

1168

If such is the case I would either do a full barre at VII

797877

That’s a bit of a reach starting from open, also try a half-barre at II

x2424x

Either one is going to be a bit of work for someone whose repertoire is mostly open chords, but it’s worth the effort. If you

1169

Four bars E7, two bars A7, two bars E7, one bar B7, one bar A7, one bar E7, one bar B7 then turn around… I think!

Yeah I just strummed it with a swing/blues down up strum and it sounded right.

1170

It’s a D7/A.

1171

If you are using open chords, after playing the E [or E7], move your index and second finger towards the low E string, and move your ring and little finger towards the high E string. With practice, all four fingers should move simultaneously.

022100 or 020100 —> X21202

If you are using barre chords, the same shape is used for both A7 and B7, just on the 5th fret and 7th fret respectively. If you can go from E7 on the 7th to A7 on the 5th, you can go from E7 to B7, plus there’s no vertical shift.

1172

I thank you on behalf of the person who asked the question.

In other news, so I’m learning guitar. So I bought a new guitar. So I own guitars.

For Christmas, I got a three hundred dollar Casio synth from my parents. I’m… not entirely sure why. It’s got 76 keys, a USB midi output, and built in speakers.

Apparently, the thought was I could use it to make looping backing tracks for practicing guitar with.

1173

They’re actually darned useful for that purpose. Or as an interface for software that can be used for that. Have you any interest in adding drums/bass/whatever to yours solo performances?

1174

They are, but A: I have software that does that, and B: the last time I tried making anything more complex than a simple beat I got ‘dying yak’ in about four flavors.

And C: it’s a huge freaking thing that’d take up half my kitchen. Also, not a very good keyboard. It was a good idea, but I’d have no use for it for like five years.

See, first I have to, say, learn to play the guitar. Then I can worry about the solo performances. Right now I’m kind of swearing at barre chords and trying to play some pretty simple rock and Beatles songs at normal tempo just to convince myself I’m learning something. I’m better than I was last month, but it doesn’t mean much. I have been informed that Best Buy and Target had huge piles of this model on the floor at one point. This may be why I got it.

1175

E-Sabbath, as I’m sure you’ve heard countless times, the Number One bit of advice for people learning to play guitar is to find a teacher and take some lessons. I wholeheartedly agree, and you’ve probably done this. The next piece of advice I tell my music students is to play with other people. In fact, try to play with people that are better than you. I’ve been playing for almost thirty years and I still try to do this. Not only is it a challenge to play with more advanced musicians (there’s nothing wrong with getting your ass kicked), but you will learn a lot from them. Are you doing this? If not, make it happen. Seriously, even if you are just playing chords while someone solos, you will get something out of the experience. You will advance faster than just playing by yourself.

As far as playing Beatle songs, Yes!!! I teach my students a lot of Beatle songs - there are many things to learn in each one. The first Beatle tune I teach them is “Yellow Submarine”; it’s full of open chords that a beginning guitarist should know: D, C, G, Em, Am, and D7. It also has some good strumming patterns…sustained chords, four-to-the-bar, and some swing rhythms. Next is “Eight Days a Week”. Like YS, it’s got some basic open chords AND a barre chord, Bm. Also, the changes are a good way to show two ways to play a G chord: E → G, play it using the middle, ring and little fingers (2, 3, 4), and Bm → G, using index, middle, and ring (1, 2, 3). Next up is “Come Together”. It’s got a cool riff, the bluesy root/five, root/six pattern, and some power chords.

I could go on with more of the tunes that I teach my band class and why I’ve chosen them/new skills that are introduced if you want. Which songs are you working on? Why did you choose them (besides liking the song)? What challenges are you experiencing? Which Beatle songs are you looking forward to learning?

1176

Right now, With A Little Help From My Friends and Yellow Submarine. I’ve got a problem in that I can’t switch from chord to chord very fast. I’m better than I was last month, but…

Then I was looking for something that had some up and down the neck action. I need to learn how to play in positions other than first without looking.

Eventually? Hey Jude. It’s not hard and it’s the best singalong song ever.

1177

It’s here. And it’s beautiful. A little pinchy on the thigh, but the action is so low, and it plays so smooth. It’s gorgeous on a clean setting. It’s not very heavy, either. Needs a little oiling, and I need to find a good case. (It’s a bit wider than a Les Paul at the horn, but would otherwise fit in my LP/585 case.) The action is so low. I can play F chords easily. I can play barre chords easily. Gol-darn! This is just pure love here.

Also, the SNARK tuner comes. It’s got a visual metronome!

1178

Congrats! I love the romance of new guitar - enjoy the honeymoon!

1179

Did I ever give you this exercise that I make my students do? If I already have, please forgive a repetitious old man…

Moving your left hand between chords. Say, for instance, that you’re changing between G and A. (I deliberately picked those two because the way most people finger them, they don’t use any fingers in common; no pivots, no guides and only one parallel. There’s a way to get some common fingers, but that’s another day’s ramble…)

So, set the metronome and play in a slow four-four, one chord per bar.

|: O | O :expressionless:

Your left hand has the entire four beats to change chords. Once you are used to it and comfortable, change the rhythm to -

|: d d | d d :expressionless: - still only one chord per bar.

Now, you’re using a half note, two beats, to change chords. Once you are used to it and comfortable, change the rhythm to -

|: ♩♩♩♩| ♩♩♩♩ :expressionless: - still only one chord per bar.

Now, you’re using a quarter note, one beat, to change chords. Once you are used to it and comfortable, change the rhythm to -

|: ♫♫♫♫ | ♫♫♫♫ :expressionless: - still only one chord per bar.

Now, you’re using an eighth note, half a beat, to change chords. Once you are used to it and comfortable, change the rhythm to -

|: ♬♬♬♬♬♬♬♬ | ♬♬♬♬♬♬♬♬ :expressionless: - still only one chord per bar.

Now, you have a sixteenth note, one fourth of a beat, to change chords.

The trick with this exercise is to use the long notes to give your fingers the time to sort themselves out. The less you consciously place them and the more you simply allow them to find their own way, the easier the progression to smaller and smaller note values will be. Eventually, your fingers will simply know the way better than your brain could ever tell them. This exercise is a lovely way to spend the next hockey game or basketball game on the telly…

1180

Already doing something of the sort, actually happening to involve G and A.
Just takes time and practice.