Did you even read the fucking article? That poll was conducted between 9/19 and 9/23 days before Polosi announced the inquiry an OK.
Way to bring your A-game :rolleyes:
Thank you for sharing! That is very heartening. If any Doper is “in the middle” on Trump, based on what I can tell, it’s you. If we can extrapolate Bone to all of America, then we’ll be just fine.
My overall take on all this is that it is a huge deal and that the cynics and pessimists are wrong. This is far worse than anything Trump has been caught red-handed doing before. I imagine most of the people who have defended him up to now will continue doing so, but surely some will find this the final straw.
And Trump has no political margin for error. If only another 5-10% of Americans join the group who are already solidly against him, a massive Democratic landslide in 2020 is certain. And if Trump can’t be re-elected, that dramatically changes the calculus for Senate Republicans. I don’t think it’s at all implausible that enough of them will vote to remove him from office. At the very least, I think it’s highly likely that the number of Republicans voting to convict will be large enough to prevent the impeachment from being dismissed as “partisan”.
Sorry if this isn’t the appropriate thread, but can someone point me to what they think is the most succinct analysis of what (purportedly) happened and the steps that are being taken? It really can be a challenge to fight through the partisan folk on both side to get an objective view. And so many of the “facts” seem to be of the weaselly, likely unethical, but criminal? sort.
Also, anyone know of a clear discussion of what different “rules” apply in an impeachment, compared to all of the various previous hearings? My main focus is on him NOT getting another term and - hopefully - Repubs losing the Senate majority. I’m trying to figure out what benefits the impeachment inquiry provides in those efforts.
It would take quite a bit for someone to detest Trump more than I, but I have to admit that there has been a bit of fatigue. I’ve long thought Trump embarrassing, dishonest, and incompetent, and suspect he is seeking to enrich himself through his office. Basically a scummy individual. But none of that is news. And none of that apparently matters to his true-believers or the Republicans in Congress.
It is not readily obvious to me why THIS action - as opposed to so many others - is the one that merits impeachment.
My post below quotes a good summation:
I think this one stands out because it was relatively recent, is relatively straight forward, and clearly shows action (i.e. pressure) meant to gain direct domestic political advantage (i.e. harm a rival) due to improper usage of foreign policy.
From here.
In this case he asked a foreign leader to investigate an American to his political advantage over his duty to uphold his oath to the office. There’s the short version.
I guess we’ve found the new talking points for today:
- The public does not want impeachment hearings (points to week old poll)
- It’s not technically Treason!
Adam Schiff is terrific. Listen to as much of today’s hearing as you can, but certainly his summary at the end.
When I went to take a look at the poll itself, I can’t find it on Quinnpiac’s website now does the article actually link to the poll. For all I know, they interviewed 5 republicans and 50 democrats.
Anyone have a link to the actual poll?
… And did so while dangling hundreds of millions of dollars in military aid that Congress had approved, and Trump had ordered withheld for no clear reason…
(slightly longer version)
… And the American Trump wanted investigated is a family member of an important political rival.
(full version)
Specifics of the Nunes cow suit, since we’re all wondering.
I realize things are moving fast with the release of the whistle blower complaint, but I think it’s interesting to note, as highlighted in this article, that in order for Congress to release the $250 million the Pentagon had to sign off on it specifically to certify that they felt Ukraine was doing enough to combat corruption. So the Pentagon thought enough was being done to release the funds but for whatever reason Trump disagreed. This article also notes that the other excuse Trump is using for having held back the funds, that European allies were not doing enough to support Ukraine, is suspect as well. Eight European embassies have told NPR that they received no requests from the Trump administration to up their aid, and they are also claiming that Trump is minimizing Europe’s contributions, which are actually pretty close to those from the US.
I find it highly unlikely that Putin has Trump under his control, being that I haven’t seen any good (obviously IMHO) evidence to support this. My opinion about Trump and dictators comes down to Trump’s aversion to confrontation. Now, as president, if there is any group of people that should be confronted more than dictators, I don’t know what group that is. So if you insist that, say, Kim Jong-un is a good person or words to that effect, you no longer need to confront him. The threat is nullified.
But getting back to the thread, I saw the 10:30 to 11:00 segment. My first impression of Maguire is that he was simply trying to do his job as he interpreted it. But the one troubling thing is as others have pointed out, and that is going to the WH for advice, being that of course the complaint was directed there.
“Shut up its not treason you illiterate boob” has been a talking point for 2 years now
Way too early to be certain about this, but IMO the way things have played out over the last few days have vindicated Speaker Pelosi’s approach to impeachment and related issues. But we’ll see. I still won’t make any predictions.
Indeed; that is actually quoted in the whistleblower complaint on page 2, footnote 1.
Trump supporters should just stop making references to popular opinion and Trump. He came up three million votes shy of Clinton and has had a majority of the country against him since inauguration.
Defending Trump with polling data is like saying, “I never touch diet sodas, that stuff will kill you!” while inhaling spray paint.
It’s the most recent national poll (Sept 25.)
Question 37.
That move rivaled Trump’s in grabbing an old weather model to “prove” he was right about Alabama. Hey, Annoyed. You got a sharpie handy?