The Usual Suspects Are a Bunch of Weenies!

The BBQ Pit
1

You know who you are.

For weeks, you blustered and sneered about how embarassed the libruhls were gonna be just as soon as those warehouses stacked to the ceiling full of Evil Nasty were found. Thousands of litres of nerve gas, anthrax, toxins, the mega-magilla. Over and over, you gloated in advance about how you were going to rub our noses in it. Yessiree, Bob. Can’t wait to get in there, show you guys how full of shit you are.

Well, I think we all know what happened with that. Anybody who doesn’t know by now drools in thier oatmeal. And, of course, we stalwarts of Truth and Justice, offered invitations to explain this rather embarassing development. Admittedly, it was a bit like serving up a turd sundae and handing you a spoon. But that’s only fair, isn’t it? After all, you were sneering in advance, so certain you were that Fearless Misleader, that collossus of geopolitik, was the font of all that is true and worthy, and we were but carping and hostile peaceniks.

Truth comes out, and you guys vanish. Nothing to say.

Weenies. Wimp ass weenies. Only Sam had the cojones to step up take his spoonful. A Canadian, fer Chrissake!

(In deference of which I hereby promise never to refer to him as Conan the Canadian ever again. Scouts honor. Honest Native American.)

Now, I didn’t expect a mass conversion from the Dark Side. You even had an excuse, you were lied to by experts, and dazed by a misplaced faith in a vapid little twit with delusions of competence. But do you step up and take your lumps like a…person? You do not. You slither back under the nearest rock and pretend it never happened.

If balls were LSD you wouldn’t have enough to blow your mind. Such as it were.

Weenies.

2

Like it matters.

Bush is so proud of himself for kicking the shit out of Iraq, his hard-on won’t go down for a year.

Reasons don’t matter … the USA won a war, goddamnit!

3

Like in the 38 other “Where are the WMD” threads most people realize that Iraq is a big country, and are willing to give the U.S. a fair shake by allowing 4-6 months to demonstrate their existance.

Of course there are always those that chose to jump to conclusions.

4

Scylla

Quarter of a million dollars, sitting on a table, just waiting for someone to walk in and show us where one, just one, of these “massive stockpiles” are located.

Iraqis don’t like money? Or they have nothing to sell?

“They asked us if there are any hidden chemical weapons, and we told them that to the best of our knowledge, there weren’t any,” Al-Sayeed said. “Why would we lie now?”

[snip]

“But Al-Sayeed and others argued that after two months without paychecks, and facing an uncertain future, scientists are not only motivated to cooperate but also desperately interested in working with the Americans.”

$250,000. Nobody claims it. Why?

5

Hey, luc, didn’t you start a thread in ATMB asking how many times you could use your sig? Did you check the answer to that?

6

Why do you persist in rabbiting on about WMD? That wasn’t the reason for the war. It was never the reason for the war. We went to war with Iraq to…er…liberate the Iraqi people! Yeah, that’s the ticket, liberate the Iraqi people. And anybody else tries any funny stuff, we’ll liberate their sorry asses too.

7

Bush: Sadam has stockpiles of Weapons of Mass Destruction. Therefore we must invade. We’ve decided to not ask for a UN vote because we already know it’ll go against us. But we won’t stand still; we’re invading Iraq to get rid of all of those Weapons of Mass Destrucion. God Bless America.

{boom – bang – shoot – explode – arg – death rattle – etc.}

Bush: There. We have vanquished the Iraqis, now to mop up that stockpile of Weapons of Mass Destruction.

Aide: {whispers} Sir. We can’t find any.
Bush: {aside} Did you look. I mean, like really good?
Aide: {sotto} Yes. We did.
{blink blink}
Aide: {out the side of his mouth} You know Iraq is really big.

Bush: My fellow Americans. Iraq is really big. But those Weapons of Mass Destruction are there! Give us a few months and we’ll whip up a report for you. God Bless America.

8

What is this “Truth” I’ve missed? What development?

9

Ah. Parsing. Very good, grasshopper.

10

I guess I’m just a wild and unconventional guy who flaunts convention. On the other hand, what the fuck do you care?

11

Just to give people context:

http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=182866&pagenumber=2
Once again, Elucidator seems to be conflating florid rhetoric with proof of something. The Washington Post article he references (http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A40212-2003May10.html) states that the US is withdrawing the 75th Expeditionary Force (the only known team looking for WMD in Iraq). Meanwhile, other contemporaneous articles claim that the US is sending a team of 2000 experts to continue the search and it may take a couple of months to get them assembled and on site. In other words, no solid news whatsoever. But Elucidator, who accuses the “hawks” for leaping at the first bit of news has adopted the Washington Post article as sacred gospel. While most other debaters on this subject have agreed to wait a reasonable time (4 months from the end of the fighting is the usual period) before deciding one way or another.

Disclaimer 1:   I'm a mostly liberal person who happens to think that Iraq had WMD programs and stockpiles, but not in a state to present an immediate threat.

Disclaimer 2: I think Elucidator is a complete ass (cite? this OP) whose overblown posting style, emotional rants, and passive-aggressive responses to criticism diminish his credibility severely. I am convinced that his primary motivation is not to discover the truth, but to support his loathing for the Bush administration.

12

I don’t fucking care. But I would like to know why you asked the fucking question in ATMB in the first place, if you didn’t care about the answer.

13

I will admit to being surprised and wrong that we haven’t found large amounts of WMDs by now. If Saddam had destrowed them, he could have proved their absense to the UN and gotten the sanctions lifted. So, I thought it highly likely that he still had them.

Jim Lacey postulated an intriguing explanation.

Re. as apologizing to the “libruhls”:

Did anyone on this Board post before the war that in his/her opinion there were no WMDs? Any such poster will get an apology and a tip of the hat from me.

14

In case anyone’s wondering, elucidator recently started an ATMB thread Rules on sig repitition?, which caused the following rule to be added to the FAQ - guidelines for posting at the SDMB:

15

You know, that kind of thing could really hurt a sensitive guy like me. Luckly, knowing that it comes from a dimwitted fart balloon like Finagle takes a lot of the sting out of it. Lets take a long stick and poke at this pustule of argumentation.

They aren’t?

And when, exactly, did this notion occur to them? Seems to me, complete ass that I am, that if you are really worried about Nasty Stuff falling into the wrong hands, you are ready to hit the ground running with a full-court press to find them now. Given that, after all, this adventure in liberation was planned for months!

So we are prepared to launch a full invasion, involving hundreds of thousands of personnel, yet we aren’t prepared for such an endeavor. Odd, don’t you think?

They’re lying? You can prove that? In your haste to protect innocent minds from my corruption, you neglected to mention that.

We have? Gosh, guy, I didn’t get the memo. When was this agreement reached? Involving which parties? Or did you just pull this nugget of misinfo out of your Nixon?

By a lucky coincidence, exposing truth furthers the cause rather nicely!

But soft! You seem firmly encrusted with adamantine convictions. You can tell us, then, can’t you, why the aforementioned quarter of a million dollars has gone unclaimed for, what?..a month now?

16

Would that include taking back any bad things you might have said about Scott Ritter and any poster who cited him stating that there were no WMDs in Iraq?

17

december I have in fact advanced such a theory. As you likely know.

MWD’s are piss-poor tactical weapons. Vagueries of wind and temperature render them very unpredictable. As strategic weapons, they are even worse: they thoroughly enrage your enemy without incapacitating him to any significant degree. Esp. when that enemy can lob nukes at you from 10,000 miles away at zero risk.

I think he destroyed them because they are so weak. I think he hid that fact in order to maintain them as a bluff against say, Iran. His primary miscalculation was in believing that the USA would not, in fact, go to war on such flimsy pretexts. He overestimated our good sense and civilization. He won’t to it again. Then again, neither will anyone else, most likely. You may think thats a good thing. I think its a very dangerous thing. You’ve read The Guns of August, have you not?

But, come to think of it, you’re just the guy to answer that niggling question: how come nobody wants that money, december. Theres tons and tons of the shit, all over the place. Must be at least 100 people who know something How come the line to rat them out isn’t a mile long?

And, Demo: is that really the best you can do? I assure you, I am a scoundrel, a blackguard and a despoiler of maidens, yet all you got is this double-sig thing?

Sure, I checked it out. Been here a couple of years, first I’d heard of it. Son of a gun, its true! Whodathunkit? Not that I’d ever think of ankle-biting some fellow poster of such a trivial bit of rule mongering. I hunt bigger game, with a bigger gun. I’m a man of higher caliber. (snicker…stole that from the Guiness Book of Records)

18

Prediction- We’ll find 'em in a few months. Why? Cos, let’s face facts, if I were a scientist and was offered that much cash to turn over chemical weapons, I’d start making the damn things -right now-, thanks!

19

Unlike milroyj, I’m not trying to discredit your argument by discrediting you elucidator.

I personally think that your arguments are valid, but that you are an asshole.

Wait, I’ll revise the spelling so that you can follow it:

I pirsonally think that your argumints are valed, but that you are an asshole.

20

Let’s look at one of Elucidator’s claims and see if he is evaluating the evidence in a fair and balanced manner. He claims that there is a $250K reward for evidence leading to discovery of WMD and that no one is lining up for this reward. (And note that we don’t know that no one is lining up – only that no results have been reported yet.) I can’t find an online cite for this 250K reward, but I remember hearing something about it, so we’ll assume it exists. I can think of at least three scenarios that both satisfy the assumption that WMDs did exist and that would result in no claims at this time.

a. The WMDs existed and were indeed moved to Syria as persistent rumors claim. If so, very sensitive negotiations are probably underway. Possibly involving guys with night vision goggles and Blackhawk helicopters. We wouldn’t hear much about those.

b. If I were hiding WMDs and I were a despot like SH, I would dig a big hole in the middle of the desert. I would put the WMDs in the hole. Than I’d shoot and put everyone who dug the hole in the hole. Then I’d have trusted lieutenants cover up the hole. Now assuming that these trusted lieutenants weren’t themselves shot and were eager to claim the $250K, well…there’s still the problem of explaining the bodies surrounding the goods. Maybe the US would overlook capital crimes in exchange for the goods, but if I had been the one pulling the trigger, I wouldn’t bet on it.

c. The WMDs were indeed destroyed immediately preceding the war. (Did anyone ever explain the traces of chemicals found in the Euphrates during the war?) Hard to claim a reward when all you can point to is a bonfire or an empty barrel at the bottom of a river. At the very least, this would take weeks or months of forensic analysis to confirm.

As for Elucidator’s repeated claim that he is a “despoiler of maidens” – as if. All the maidens I know prefer that their despoilers not froth so visibly at the mouth.