"They're not twins, they're surviving triplets..."

[GrizzRich]

For those that don’t know my story…

…Five years ago, GrizzWife was pregnant with boy/girl twins as a result of IVF and eight years of trying.
Three days after they were born (nine weeks premature!) our daughter died.
Our son is nearing his fifth birthday (in October) and is doing physically and emotionally well, thankyouverymuch.

But, he IS a surviving twin. We wanted both of them so much that every milestone our son passes is poignant because his sister is not here to share it.

We’ve gotten beyond feeling the need to explain the full situation to others that are giving idle chat. Or, in phungi’s case, just making a friendly observation and comment. Certainly, no slight was meant by the comment and I don’t think the mother should have taken the opportunity to make him feel ill-at-ease.
If a deeper conversation is engaged, then perhaps I might feel the need to share such information.

That having been said, there have been persons (we refer to them as “DHAC’s”; that is, they Don’t Have A Clue) who might observe us having difficulty with our son and would say something like “Makes you glad that you don’t have TWO of 'em! HAR HAR HAR!!”
Depending on our mood that day, they might just get both barrells of our reality.

[phungi]

As a parent of two (boys 3 and 5) it is hard to imagine the loss of a child, although I find myself pondering news stories and shuddering in thought before bed of horrible events (and then cannot believe I am lying awake worrying about my kids who are sound asleep in their rooms).

To clarify, there were a lot of kids percolating in a waiting area at Epcot prior to their “lunch with a character” fiasco. My youngest was briefly playing and interacting with their two when I asked the question, and their reply caught me completely of guard.

I was really sorry to have brought up a sad thought at what appeared to be a celebration of kid-dome, but then wondered what had happened and why it was necessary to share the fact with me. Reading the various perspectives definitely helps understand the various stages of dealing with such a tragedy.

[WhyNot]

@GrizzRich

That having been said, there have been persons (we refer to them as “DHAC’s”; that is, they Don’t Have A Clue) who might observe us having difficulty with our son and would say something like “Makes you glad that you don’t have TWO of 'em! HAR HAR HAR!!”
Depending on our mood that day, they might just get both barrells of our reality.

Y’know, I’m trying to think of a single situation where this could possibly be an appropriate thing to say, and I just can’t. It almost always holds the potential to cause pain. The only only time it could be possibly funny (and not very) is if you know the person well enough to know they’re unconditionally happy with being the parent of an only child. And if you know someone that well, find better conversation.

There’s your situation, of course. How about the parent who’s trying desperately to conceive again? Or the parent of another child who they don’t have custody of? Or the parent who’s always dreamed of a big family and can’t afford one, financially or health-wise, or just hasn’t found the right person to do it with? Or the grown surviving twin who is now a parent? Or a parent who does indeed have more at home? There’s just a minefield of possibilities.

Damn. Talk about unconsiously trampling over people’s feelings like a bull in a china shop. :mad: (No offense to bulls. Or china.)

GrizzRich, I’m very sorry for the loss of your daughter, and I’m thrilled your little boy is doing well.

[Jurph]

@Hal Briston

Hoooo, boy. Hope those kids are saving up their birthday money, 'cause I guarantee you they’ll be needing therapy in about 20 years.

It’s okay, because all three of them get presents. :eek:

No, I keed. I’m sure nobody’s that creepy about it. Right?

I can’t imagine how much more guilt would’ve been thrown on there if he were “the surviving twin”.

Elvis Presley was a surviving twin, and he turned out just fine.

[Guinastasia]

@Askia

phungi. “Surviving triplets” as “a loss of one of the kids at birth” is you and your wife’s surmise, but not necessarily what was meant or what happened. The death might have been something as tramautic as a flu earlier this year the children caught all at once from which one succumbed.

So: Creepy? Maybe. People handle grief in strange ways.

Predicting therapy for the two surviving triplets is a little overboard.

I don’t it’s overboard-especially if, like you said, their sibling died recently. Considering how close triplets and twins usually are, I’d say that warrants therapy.

Everyone deals with death in different ways. Although I agree with you, Kalhoun, if only because, hey, what if someone else in the office had also lost a child that way, and the pictures only make him or her feel worse?

[Mangetout]

@WhyNot

No, twins are two chilren born at the same time of the same mother; triplets are three children born at the same time of the same mother. If one of a set of triplets is in another room, the present two do not become twins.

There’s no ‘become’ involved; they always were twins - two children born at the same time of the same mother (like you said), at the same time as being two members of a set of triplets; the definitions needn’t be exclusive.

[Mahaloth]

@Tracy Lord

grin The Quagmires were the first thing I thought of when I saw the thread title.

Me too. Of course it wasn’t their mother that told them they were triplets. It was themselves who insisted.

[Guinastasia]

@Mangetout

There’s no ‘become’ involved; they always were twins - two children born at the same time of the same mother (like you said), at the same time as being two members of a set of triplets; the definitions needn’t be exclusive.

No, they are NOT. According to medical terms, they are triplets. Period.

[Cat_Jones]

Woah this thread is a bit of a roller coaster, carlotta’s point about when to ‘disclose’ information in a growing friendship particularly touched a chord but I digress.
Keeping to medical rather than emotional. I knew identical sisters who also had a triplet brother; two eggs resulted in three children - could the girls be referred to as twins ? (Not trying to be awkward - it’s real).

[eleanorigby]

They’re both-identical twins and triplets! How confusing, but fun. To me, twins are born to the same mother, and shared the same pregnancy. More than two fetuses doing the same means that twinship doesn’t apply (except as above)–they are triplets, quads, quints etc. If one dies, that doesn’t negate the triplet-shipness (I make up more words on this bb…heh).

I don’t know how parents should refer to deceased children. I can imagine all manner of responses. Perhaps it is best to keep things low key until better acquianted. That seems most natural to me, but YMMV. Either way, cut the parent alot of slack–that would be the most courteous thing to do. And with that, if said parent hasn’t shared with you the infant death that they survived–for God’s sake, don’t get all offended that you didn’t know about it. I have known some folks who think that they should be privy to all the inner secrets of people–I dont’ see things that way.
I am in a weird place with this thread. I was born on my sister’s Bday, 4 years later (and it was yesterday, 7/12, btw)–and now both sisters are deceased. They were twins. Obviously, I was never a twin or a triplet–but I ahve been asked my whole life if I am, because of the brithday thing*.

But when people ask me how many brothers and sisters I have----I never know what to say.
Sorry to go OT, but this thread kinda caught my eye.
*and you would be amazed at how many people cannot figure it out. If I had a nickel for every time I was asked, “but if you were born on their birthday, how come you’re not a triplet?” I would not need to work. Light dawns slowly for some.

[irishgirl]

The girls are identical (monzygotic) twins however, they are also triplets.

Just as a twin in a room on their own doesn’t become a singleton, two triplets in a room do not suddenly become twins (unless of course, they are the identical twins of a higher order multiple).

[Kalhoun]

@WhyNot

Y’know, I’m trying to think of a single situation where this could possibly be an appropriate thing to say, and I just can’t. It almost always holds the potential to cause pain. The only only time it could be possibly funny (and not very) is if you know the person well enough to know they’re unconditionally happy with being the parent of an only child. And if you know someone that well, find better conversation.

Well, I think if we stretch political correctness to this level, conversation will be reduced to “information only.” You can’t say, “Your mother wears army boots” because your mom might have died in the service (or maybe just DIED like mine did). You cannot insulate yourself from pain and you cannot make innocent people feel guilty for friendly, off-the-cuff comments that are made.

GrizzRich, I’m very sorry for the loss of your daughter, and I’m thrilled your little boy is doing well.

Ditto.

[elbows]

As a woman who surrendered a child to adoption as a teenager, and never having another child I can relate to a lot of what’s been said here.

I spent the next thirty years being asked, casually, mind you;

“So, do you have any children?”

Now what they meant, was; do you have any children at home?

So I would respond, “No, no I don’t”.

A flat out lie.
Thirty years.
How many times do you think I told this lie?

This one lie leads to endless others, conversations about not knowing what it’s like to be pregant, wait till you have a baby, you’ll see your body will change, blah, blah, blah.

Now my nearest and dearest friends knew about my daughter, but what was I to tell strangers? And what about doctors? Of course I always told them the truth, but never without pause.

I new all these were innocent questions, and I knew it was inappropriate to blurt out my hurt, as it were. And I knew I’d signed on for a lifetime sentence so I made my peace with it, well, sort of.

3 yrs ago this spectacularly beautiful, and successful young woman came dancing on air back into my life, imagine my glee. Well, you can’t imagine, let me assure you. However I find I am struggling anew with an old and simple question.

So, do you have any children?

I was last asked in front of a table of 6 people and I responded, “Well, actually, yes and no.” While true, and a good indicator of my own confusion with this change in my status, it had the effect of turning heads and garnering undivided attention in a way I had not foreseen, I had just answered honestly how I felt just then, ooops. In the end it was okay, I simply explained myself but it was a moment.

I easily introduce her as my daughter. (And my spirit soars!)

I struggle yet with calling myself a parent, or implying same in any way, as I have never parented.

I guess I want to say that I came to understand, not initially, but eventually, that they were just innocent questions.

[Quartz]

@Eve

A simple child
That lightly draws its breath,

Just right.

[Nawth_Chucka]

This thread has really made me think about what I say to strangers when I’m trying to be friendly. I’ve made an ass of myself on more than one (dozens) occasion, and this has shown me the importance of keeping my word-hole shut.
It’s also reminded me that when I was about 9 my aunt (after 2 miscarriages) had a little boy that died within a week. Only his parents and siblings ever saw him and only once has anyone ever referred to him after in my presence; the parents divorced soon as well. That was 26 years ago. She’s always been such a mean and bitter person and now I think I may cut her much more slack than I have done.

[velvetjones]

I am the mother of three daughters. Two died in infancy. One in a car accident when she was just past her first birthday and one 4 days after she was born.

It was horrible, and painful and devastating and took me foverer to get through and changed me forever.

But when strangers or acquaintances ask me how many children I have I tell them one.

I don’t believe I’m dishonoring the memory of my precious daughters, I’m just saving my personal tragedy for someone who might actually give a damn. I really don’t believe that sharing something so terribly intimate and personal (not to mention tragic) is appropriate with strangers and acquaintances.

But that’s just me.
(and of course now I’ve gone and shared it with all of you )

[MaxTheVool]

I think that this is one instance in which our society’s attitudes, our generally low infant mortality, and our excellent medical technology, can make things worse, emotionally. As I understand it (and I may be WAY off here), people used to have lots of babies, assume that many of them would die young, and, knowing that, not really start emotionally vieweing the baby as a “child” until it had reached a certain age, perhaps because any other option was just too painful.

I was thinking about this somewhat recently… I’m good friends with a couple who were trying to get pregnant for quite some time, including one miscarriage. Finally, she got pregnant, and soon learned that it was twins. It struck me that if there were complications (as wouldn’t be TOO surpising, given how hard it was to get pregnant, and that she’s a person of small stature) and only one baby survived birth, they would probably be devestated, despite the fact that they had precisely what they wanted in the first place, namely, a baby. If medical science had never told them about the twins in the first place, and at the moment of delivery they had basically been told “you have a beautiful healthy baby boy! (oh, and there was a girl also, but she died)”, would it “make sense” for them to be happy about the boy, or upset about the girl? Not that “making sense” has anything to do with it obviously, and I realize that this is a very difficult topic to discuss without being hideously callous.
Anyhow, both babies are now healthy and happy at 14 months…

And to further talk about things I really know nothing about, I had a cousin with Down’s Syndrome who died at the age of 2 or so, 26 or so years ago. He’s certainly not forgotten or anything, and is mentioned from time to time when the situation comes up, or when he shows up in a family photo from that era, but I certainly get the impression that most people talk about his father (my uncle) as having two children (the older brother (now an expecting father himself) and younger sister of the deceased cousin) without giving it a second thought. Certainly, I think the fact that bro and sis were such happy and healthy babies (and children, and young adults) has helped keep morbidity at bay.

[ouryL]

She’s gonna screw up her kids. :mad: