I’ve been lurking here for a spell now and this seemed like a good thread to use to introduce myself. I’m from Lone Star, Texas. So, its true I’m a Texan, not a Southerner, but I’ll pitch in my two cents on the debate anyway.
Tea: iced and sweetened. The only hot tea is sun tea, and that’s just 'til ya add the ice.
Y’all: is plural ya weirdos! As said before, we may say to one person, “How ya’ll doin’?” But we mean “you 'n yours”.
Cornbread: I’ve had yellow sweet cornbread. I’ve also had oil n vinager on my french fries (chips) when I went to England. Sometimes you have to go with the customs of the land you’re in to be polite. Cornbread should be white, no sugar, and cooked in a seasoned (oiled) iron pan.
Coke: any carbonated beverage.
Not discussed, but something else I’ve noticed certain people have wrong is potato salad: should be mustardy and the fewer ingredients the better (no friggin’ celery or red peppers, etc.)
My mother was born and raised in Arkansas and she never, ever made white corn bread when I was growing up. It was never sweet, and was always cooked in a (well-seasoned) cast-iron skillet. It had an “open” texture, rather like fine sponge rubber, and had a crispy crust wherever the loaf had rested against the pan while cooking.
I liked it, but not as much as my parents. Sometimes, for a late-night snack, they’d crumble some left-over cornbread in a tall glass and pour buttermilk over it. They’d eat it with a long-handled teaspoon and try to convince us kids how good it was (you couldn’t tempt me to go near the stuff – buttermilk tastes bitter to me).
I suspect that the reason mom made her cornbread with yellow corn meal was that, living in California, white cornmeal was hard to find. Often, it was labeled Mas Harina, and my mom didn’t find out that this was white cornmeal until I was a teen.
Take a big, fat, hot cathead biscuit (My Dad makes them from scratch. Why cathead? Well, there as big as a ol’ cat’s head). Cut it in two pieces.
Slather one piece with real butter.
Pour a generous helping of King Po-To-Ric Syrup (ordinary King Syrup has the red label, King Po-To-Ric has the dark blue label) on the buttered half and spread it around.
Lick the knife clean.
Using the same knife, butter the other half of the still steaming biscuit.
Add more syrup.
Eat, being sure to sop up the syrup with additional biscuits as required.
Ask Mama if there are more biscuits.
She will have fried some scrapple and probably made some fried apples as well. Grits will have already been cooked.
Add two eggs overeasy and coffee (black, and so hot that it melts the spoon).
Eat some more. (“Surely you’re not finished. You better come on here and eat. Come on and eat a little something else. Do you want another egg? I’ve got some strawberry preserves? Do you want another piece of scrapple?”). Everyone’s mother is saint, but a Southern mother is a saint AND a great cook.
Yes. Mustard, as few additional ingredients as possible. Celery is an option. It’s funny. Krogers here as 4 different types of Potato salad, only one of which is called “Southern Potato Salad”,it has the fewest ingredients.
Crowder Peas anyone? I got my wife hooked on them.
Cornbread. I’ve never heard of this “white” cornbread. It’s always cooked with Yellow cornmeal, at least it is in all the fine places I’ve ever eaten. Sugar will mark you as a heathen faster than anything.
I too vote for DoctorJ. Just reading your thread has made me so hungry. You just make this southern girl so proud. Now , would you please pass the jelly?
Well, as long as we’re serving the Compleat Southern Breakfast, don’t leave out apple butter or sow belly (“drag ham” as my Dad used to call it). Some hand-churned butter, courtesy of my Mom (who grew up on a dairy farm) was a nice touch. We often served cantaloupe and sliced home-grown tomatoes with breakfast as well. Anyone else do this?
Scrapple??? I fear you may have been raised too close to Pennsylvania if you serve this dish. It is unknown in the Deep South, and is (I believe) a great source of inexplicable culinary pride in Pittsburg.
DoctorJ wrote:
[quote]
BTW, I never once heard the term “sawmill gravy” outside Cracker Barrel.**
It was always called “sawmill gravy” by my parents, who both grew up on Southern farms during the Depression. Perhaps it is an expression of the Deep South. The term most definitely pre-dates the existence of Cracker Barrel.
Sawmill gravy can be made with either sausage grease or bacon grease. (For that matter, you can use the same method to make gravy with ham grease or chicken grease. Ain’t nothing better than chicken gravy made this way, BTW.) It’s a matter of personal taste, I suppose, but IMHO sawmill gravy should be generously seasoned with coarse-ground black pepper.
Thanks for the tip on the sorghum festival in KY, DoctorJ.
Oh, and another cornbread debate: eggs in the batter or no? I say yes, but I know some folks who say eggs don’t belong in cornbread. Cornbread without eggs is way too dry, IMHO.
Speaking of cornbread, pass the pinto beans. I want to pour some of the bean juice over mine.
Maybe I’m from too far South (Louisiana), but I find that paste the rest of y’all are calling gravy inedible. For real gravy, you have to fry the flour down in meat grease with spices–it’s dark brown, spicy, and heavenly over biscuits. You can even put sausage crumbles in it, though I prefer fried chicken. (Recipe available in http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?threadid=35358)
As for the other rules, I generally agree with the consensus. Note that in Middleofnowhere, LA, sodas are always called by their proper names–“Coke” means Coca-Cola; if you want a Pepsi, you ask for it by name (and get a lot of strange looks).
I live in Richmond, which I guess is closer to Pennsylvania than, say, Alabama, but we still had scapple for breakfast. I forgot the melons and tomatoes, which we had in season as well. No sooner had we finished eating breakfast than Mama (yes, that’s what I call her)was asking what we wanted for lunch. And she never has had a dishwasher (feeding 4 sons these gargantuan meals over the course of 40 years - she must have washed a million plates). God bless my mama.
Didn’t mean to question your Southern “credentials,” plnnr. The fact that you are familiar with the term “cathead biscuit” establishes your bona fides in my book. (Not to mention the fact that you call your Mama “Mama”.)
This scrapple stuff mystifies me, though…
On another point: I recently learned that you can get sorghum syrup at Cracker Barrel. It’s not on the menu; you have to request it. Those of you who are curious about what you are missing need to get down to your local Cracker Barrel, butter up a couple of biscuits and request the sorghum. MMMMMMMM…
Another question: Red beans and Rice. My wife swears that it’s “Pinto” beans and rice, whereas being the son of the South I am, I defend Red Beans and rice. Being close to good old New Orleans as MS is, I have had some wonderful cajun cooking…
Some of the sawmill gravy you get at restaurants is inedible paste. The most common mistake is not using enough grease. Will it clog your arteries? Sure! But the grease is the source of that good flavor. I’ve noticed that many restaurants seem to use very little grease, the result being a very bland milk-and-flour paste. Bleeechhhh! (Denny’s is a major transgressor in this area.)
Don’t skimp on the grease, or for that matter, on the black pepper!
This raises an interesting point: what did the rest of y’all serve with beans? We never ate beans and rice when I was a kid. Is the “beans and rice” thing strictly a lowlands phenomenon? Where I was from (in Appalachia), beans were always served with cornbread, and never with rice. The only time we ate rice was as an occasional side dish with fried chicken. (Though even there, I preferred the more common mashed potatoes.) All of the folks I know who like rice with their beans are from coastal regions. Is this an accurate observation?
Five: Threadgills in Austin- Love the grits there. MMMMM…
St. Zero- There is another season in Central Texas- Dove Season. They close schools on the opening day.
TN*Hippie- Yep, Texas is a bit different then the “Deep South”, but we were still on y’all’s side in the War of Northern Aggression. And all of the state buildings face south just so we won’t forget
Iced Tea debate: Here it comes unsweetened, and the good restaurants leave the pitcher at the table.
Coke: The term “coke” refers to all carbonated beverages EXCEPT Dr. Pepper. Dr. Pepper is from Texas. It is different, and we treat it that way.
And why the hell to the yankees put only 3 ice cubes in any chilled drink? It has to be at least half the cup full of ice.
Holding door open- Scares the hell out of northern women. Once they figure out what you are doing, they get very impressed. Hell, Yankee women are just easy to impress 'cuz they aint used to being trated right.
My wife is from LA (lower Alabama) and her father makes red beans and rice that are crushingly good. A couple of big plates of red beans and rice and a couple of ice cold beers. Whew.
As to whether rice is a lowland dish - yes it is. Rice grows in very wet conditions and its just too dry in Appalachia (or anywhere not near the coast). I’d rather have mashed potatoes drowning in gravy any day. As a kid, gravy was considered a beverage at my house.
As to closing school on the opening day of dove season, in many parts of VA it pretty much an unofficial holiday the first day of deer season. Lots of hunters here run them with dogs, which I never thought was very sporting but you’ve got nearly 400 years of tradition and we all know about Southerners and tradition.
Born in Dallas and lived within forty miles of the city till I was nineteen. Will Rogers once said, “If Fort Worth is where the West begins, I guess Dallas is where the East peters out.” I’d add that Dallas is also about as far north as you can get in Texas and still be in the South. And Fort Worth is about as far West as you can be and still be in the South. Well, maybe Weatherford. (Obviously, there is some overlap. However, San Antonio is not Southern, whereas Houston most definitely is. But it’s ALL Texas.)
Iced tea MUST be sweetened and before ice is added. There is no way to add enough sugar with all those ice cubes in the glass. Iced tea must also be so dark (so strong) that you can just barely see through it. (The only way you can tell the difference between properly-made tea and Dr Pepper is that tea has no bubbles.) My Daddy never ordered tea in restaurants because they never made it strong enough and/or sweet enough. I used to dip pieces of white bread in mine while I watched TV. Margaret Thatcher once visited the South and said (approximately), “I adore Americans, but I cannot understand their habit of putting ice in their tea.” If I’d’a been there, I’d’a said, “It’s better than using cream!” Tea tastes best after it’s been in the refrigerator overnight.
Okra should be battered and fried, just like chicken or steak or fish or pork chops.
The two best desserts are either home-made ice cream or home-made banana pudding. Banana pudding MUST be made with Nilla vanilla wafers, Jell-O vanilla pudding and Chiquita bananas bought at the A&P or Winn-Dixie.
Virtually any kind of meat can be bar-b-qued, including German or Polish sausage. (Germans and Poles first settled in Texas when it was still part of Mexico.) Ever try bar-b-qued turkey?
Black-eyed peas are best with a piece of pork or bacon cooked with it. Tradition says they are to be eaten on New Year’s Day.
Never could stand grits. Family always thought I was weird.
Parents were called “Mama” and “Daddy.” “Mama” ALWAYS came first. Grandparents were “Grandma” and “Grandpa” or “Papaw.”
The best soda water is Dr Pepper. (Note the lack of a “.” after “Dr”) Second is Big Red strawberry soda. Third is Orange Crush. Any of the three could be combined with a small bag of Tom’s salted peanuts.
Always ate Jimmy Dean’s pork sausage and Wolf brand chili (not together.)
If there’s no sausage or ham or bacon available for breakfast, try fried bologna. Remember to make small cuts in it so it won’t curl up too much.
The other “car” was always a pick-up truck. If it wasn’t always dirty, you were a city-slicker tryin’ to look “country.”
“Y’all” was ALWAYS second-person plural, no matter what your Yankee English teacher said. “Yankee” was anyone from north of the Red River.
Ever try peanut butter and honey? Crunchy or smooth?
We had pih-KAHN trees in our yard, not PEE-can trees. Whatever you called 'em, they made good praline.
The second meal of the day was “dinner,” the third was “supper.” Only Yankees and folks who wanted to put on airs ate “lunch.” “Oh, gettin’ fancy on us, huh? Well, lah-de-dah!”
It is unknown in the Deep South, and is (I believe) a great source of inexplicable culinary pride in Pittsburg.