In another vein, you know what I’d like to see? A child support “bonus” or “earned status,” as it were, in which noncustodial parents that:
Actually do take full part in raising their children,
Can verifiably demonstrate that they are actively involved, interested, and fully invested in their child’s welfare, growth and progress,
And have established a strong, on-going, reliable relationship with the child,
could petition the the courts to make the determination that, “This is no-longer a custodial/noncustodial issue. This is joint custody, and each party is afforded full and equal rights to and access to all aspects of the child’s life.”
As far as what monies would be exchanged, well, I haven’t worked that out yet. In any event, it wouldn’t be more than the amount awarded in sole custody instances. I would hazard a guess, though, that making joint custody (rather than sole custody) the default, (or at least a possible goal) it might prevent a whole lot of acrimony between exes.
As it stands here in Minnesota, unless both parties agree to joint custody, sole custody is awarded. I don’t think that’s right.
Annie, my husband got sole custody because his (first) wife walked out on him and their daughter when she (the baby) was six months old. She told him she was tired of being married and didn’t like being a mother. She just threw some thigns in a bag and walk out. She was gone for about five months before anyone even heard from her. One of the first things my husband did was file for legal separation and sole custody.
She has substance abuse problems and never holdds a job very long. There was a court order for CS, but she never had a job long enough to actually pay anything.
I guess technically, if we wanted to be mean about it, we could go to court and enforce the old order and get her to pay all the back support that is owed up till the time my legal adoption of my husband’s daughter took place, but it’s not worth the hassle.
Annie, I agree with you. I have been considering the problem of visitation for years, and heve ven contacted my state and federal representatives, all without much hope. There is so little that can be done to enforce visitation; whereas with child support it’s easy: garnishment or jail time. With visitation there is no such thing as garnishment (although there was this wonderful meeting I had where we discussed the possibility of Reverse Visitation. That is, if it is proved that Parent A interferred with the visitation rights of Parent B, then Parent A would LOSE custody for the same period of time that was involved. A fitting punishment, I thought…but how do you enforce it?)
When it comes right down to it, there would have to be a Federal Authority extending to all 50 states (as well as Guam, Puerto Rico, etc) with the sole duty to patrol and enforce visitation.
Well, my ex finally responded to an e-mail (in which I said, basically, give me information or we’re going to court). She still hasn’t talked with a lawyer. She’s not going to sign anything until she does (which is a good idea in situations like this). But due to her busy schedule, she’s not sure when she can talk with one. And, of course, I should realize that it’s not getting cheaper to raise the kids.
Well, knock me over with a feather. I KNOW it’s not getting cheaper. I’m not trying to weasel out of my obligation (and my right) to support the kids. I’m trying to get the support amount down to where it’s supposed to be. You’re not using childcare, ex, so you don’t get reimbursed for it. Why is that so hard to understand?
Here’s what gets me – I’m trying to be more than fair in the level of support I provide. I’ve used three separate calculators for my state on the Web. I’ve taken the highest amount produced by those calculators and added money to it as my suggestion for the monthly child support. And she has the gall to tell me I’m somehow shortchanging the kids?
I’m torn between going to court and trying to work this out between us. The vindictive part of me wants to go to court, just so the child support amount would drop even lower than what I’m proposing. (In my court-fantasy, the judge looks at my proposal and turns to her lawyer and says “Why aren’t you accepting this? Why are you even here?”) The good-father part of me wants her to agree to the amount I’m proposing without going to court, because I don’t want to have money that should be going to the kids.
Sauron, does she have a lawyer, or does she have to go find one? If she has a regular lawyer, who she just can’t find time to see, you might try sending a letter to him, rather than just to her.
And you can have it both ways, you know. You could get the court-ordered amount set as low as possible, and send more money anyway after the amount is set. Would that make both your vindictive side and your good-father side feel better?
Jeez. It’s too bad these people could not hold a marriage together after deciding to have kids. Even after divorce, it’s sad that they could not even agree on even monetary contribution to the kids they had.
She doesn’t want to use the lawyer she hired for the divorce, because the lawyer is too far away. I can understand that. She’s picked out a local guy, and has talked to him at least once, but hasn’t put him on retainer. It’s this that bugs me. She knows the guy she wants to use, has already met with him at least once, but hasn’t had time in five weeks or so to discuss this with him.
That’s one alternative. The pragmatic side of me cringes at the unnecessary investment of time and money on both sides if we go to court, though. What a waste.
I guess at the heart of this I just don’t understand. I’m not cooking the numbers; she can use the calculators just as easily as I can. There’s no reason not to agree to the amount I’m offering. I’m not a lawyer, but I don’t see how she could possibly get more.
If the child is a dual responsibility then split those expenses in half. Part for you and part for him.
That’s $450 each.
How is that significantly different from $400? Except that it’s easier to be more righteously indignant about $900? Or maybe you feel that since the kid lives with you he should have to have a penalty amount to compensate you for need to parent more?
Does he have to make provisions for when the kid visits him? My divorced father friend has more house then he needs because he has his kids half time - do we subtract his expenses for when the kids visit him?
Um, Belrix…that point has been made to her several times already, and she has not seen fit to adress it. In fact, since she hasn’t responded at all in four days, I think we may conclude that she has conceded.
Yeah - next time I’ll read all the way to the bottom before posting. I was just angry at her attitude and ended up posting too early to see the other comments.
Mea Culpa
Despite the fact that I have no children with my ex-wife, I’ve always been pissed by the short shrift given to most men in divorce. I’ve got a problem with Father’s lack of rights in the current system in general. Might be a post for GD someday.
If there’s a lawyer that you know she wants to use, send the letter to her, cc’d to him, with an indication that if she does not get back to you by <date>, you’re going to have to go to court. Then he’ll be calling her to get it straightened out, instead of your having to wait for her to call him. It’s not your problem that she hasn’t given him any money yet.
I don’t think so. A lack of a reply can mean a LOT of things. It’s arrogance to assume that the other person has conceded because they haven’t replied. Maybe they simply don’t agree and don’t want to argue anymore. shrug
I choose to assume she’s conceded 'cause it makes me feel better. And I thought saying that might bring her back in here to argue some more. shrug back at ya!
My humble apologies on reviving this two-month-old thread, but I’d promised Spooky an update to the situation.
After repeated requests for information on her lawyer, my ex finally gave me a name and a contact number. I tried calling him for a week, but he was always “out of the office.” (In fact, the first time I called, the secretary told me that the lawyer couldn’t talk with me about this situation, because he was representing my ex. I politely explained to her that I was representing myself in this negotiation, and if he didn’t talk with me he’d have a hard time negotiating.)
So finally I had enough. I filed with the state to have child support reduced to the exact amount I’m required to pay, with nothing added on. (Previously I’d been adding approximately $60/month to the amount.) Since I had no way to contact the lawyer except a phone number, and he wouldn’t take my calls, I sent my ex an e-mail notifying her of what I was doing.
After a brief flurry of e-mails between my ex and me, she has agreed to the lower state-required amount. I don’t know for sure, but I think her lawyer finally told her she had no case to ask for anything higher than that.
Now it’s just a matter of waiting for the revised child support order to take effect.
Again, sorry about resurrecting the thread, but I’d made a promise. It can now die a quiet death.
