Bring back Mainframe, says I. To aitch-ee-double-toothpicks with this cel animation crap. Also, I never got into the whole vehicle-based idea. Make 'em beasts for me, thanks.
Sorry, they spoiled me. 
Take off those nostalgia glasses, bot-boy, it’s time to reacquaint you with The Screwy Goofy World of G1 Transformers Cartoons! 
Presented for your consideration:
[ul]
[li]“Microbots” – Megatron has obtained a new super energy component, the “Heart of Cybertron,” which is violently unstable. The Decepticons get drunk(!), so Perceptor, Brawn and Bumblebee are shrunk to microscopic size to sneak into Megatron’s body and retrieve it. Includes the classic line, “Look! Megatron’s evil brain impulses!”[/li][li]“Kremzeek!” – A berserk being of energy is accidentally created and runs around creating havoc for the Autobots and the Decepticons. Goofier than it sounds.[/li][li]“Changing Gears” – Grouchy Gears is abducted Megatron, who uses his personality cartridge in his latest plot, making Gears cooperative in the process. The Autobots go out to stop them and retrieve Gears’ component, but nobody is particularly happy about it.[/li][li]“City of Steel” – New York City is rebuild by Megatron into a steel city. Optimus Prime is captured and disassembled. Has to be seen for its sheer level of bad animation, goofy dialog, and outrageous plot holes (I helped mocked it as part of the MST3K presentation at BotCon 2000).[/li][li]“Child’s Play” – A group of Autobots and Decepticons find themselves transported to an alien world where they are the size of toys. They finally escape using a toy rocket modified by Perceptor.[/li][li]“Auto-Bop” – Megatron is using a dance club to play hypnotic music, which he uses to force humans to help him construct buildings. Tracks and Blaster infiltrate the place with the help of Tracks’ pal Raul, who discovers the cure: a splash of water.[/li][/ul]
And that’s just a short list; you don’t want me to get started on “Carnage in C-Minor”, do you?
True, not all of the original Transformers cartoons are lighthearted and goofy, but again, you have to compare the current Robots In Disguse stuff to the Beast Wars and Beast Machines shows that preceeded it. BW was fairly adult for a toy-based show (including the high-profile heroic death of Dinobot), though the writers did a good job of keeping things from getting too serious. Beast Machines was even darker – aside from some bad characterization and shoddy plots, it was dark and moody all the time, which only made the fans hate it more.
Nah, you’re confusing things. The Autobots retook Cybertron at the end of the movie, relegating the Decepticons to the planet Charr (I am not making that up). The “Rebirth” three-part cartoon introduced the Headmasters and revived Cybertron, though it was simply a last-gasp effort by Hasbro to sell toys before canning the cartoon. Most fans consider “Rebirth” a crummy, gratuitous commercial.
Demonic hands are a common component of Japanese fantasy literature, what can I say.
Well, the fire engine dude was originally Fire Convoy, who isn’t Optimus Prime, but they changed his name when the cartoon got imported to the US. As for combining with Ultra Magnus, that’s definitely coming up later in the cartoon – ever-increasingly-powerful heroes and villians are a staple in the Japanese Transformers shows (ask me about Star Saber, Victory Leo, and Deathsaurus sometime ).
Though I don’t know why Hasbro didn’t keep the original names from the Japanese toys. “Fire Convoy” is cool, “God Magnus” is cooler, and “God Fire Convoy” (for the combined mode) just oozes badassitude. “Omega Prime” is the American name for the combined form, and while that’s not bad, it’s just not as good as the original…
(Sorry, did I geek out there? )
Okay, so you bring up a good fact: I haven’t watched the show in a good long while (aside from the movie, the last time I watched anything was The Return of Optimus Prime two years ago), but there is a HUGE difference between crappy dialogue in a serious situation, and downright stupidity. Okay, shrunken Autobots, silly, yes…the line “Look, Megatrons evil impulses,” even sillier. But honestly, how many times did the decepticons of old walk into bolders or walls for no reason? Poorly written dialogue is one thing, writing by a five year old mentality simply so the enemy can seem less frightening and incompitent is something else. I did also reread some of the old Marvel comics series, which was MUCH darker than anything the old series had, so maybe that’s also influenced me as well, but you have to admit, even the silliest of the old episodes wasn’t anywhere near as bad as the new show.
In “The Ultimate Doom,” the Decepticons are repelled from an attack on the Autobots’ Ark because they’re being sprayed with fire-retardent foam.
You must have been reading the later issues (written by Simon Furman), then. The earlier stuff written by Bob Budiansky are generally considered to be just as juvenile as the stuff you’re decrying. “We’ve removed the brain components of the Throttlebots and put them into radio-controlled cars! Look out!”
In any event, if you’re eager to relive the old TF cartoons, you can get a number of videotapes from Rhino Home Video. Well worth the price.
Nope, wrong. Transformers was invented and written by a couple of aging hippie comic book artists in Los Angeles. I know this for a fact because I know them personally, and I was hanging around with them when they invented it. Sure, they swiped ideas from Japanese comics, but TF is a wholly American invention.
Chas, I don’t know if you were, you know, paying attention to, you know, anything in this thread, but:
a) This isn’t about the original Transformers series, it’s about Transformers: Robots in Disguise, currently airing on Fox, which started life as Transformers: Car Robots in Japan about when we were getting the first season of Transformers: Beast Machines (this would be 3 or 4 years ago).
b) The original wasn’t created by ‘aging hippies’ based on ‘japanese comic books’ it was created by Hasbro Toys based on several Japanese TOY LINES. (Diaclone, Micromen, Macross, and a number of others.) Any Japanese Transformers comics came later, based on the various TV series (several of which were, like Car Robots, Japan only).
I can’t remember who they hired to work on the comic book/TV tie ins offhand (Specific person wise - company wise it was Marvel Comics/Sunrise Animation), so they may well have been aging hippies who you have had personal contact with, but they were almost completely under Hasbro’s thumb, and didn’t create it in any way shape or form.
Sure Tengu, whatever you say, you’re the expert, you read all about it in a Usenet fan newsgroup, I merely know the people who created it, hung around with them in Yaohan’s LA department store toy department looking at robot toys, hung around the Japanese bookstore while they read manga, etc etc. How could I possibly know anything that would contradict your authoritative information?
How about posting some useful information for a change? Did the “two old hippies” you knew have names, or were they just OH-1 and OH-2? I know, Chas, that you are deeply offended when other people don’t immediately accept everything you say as the gospel truth. Please try to understand that the rest of us need something called “evidence” before we can accept something as fact. If you’re willing to provide details and corroboration to back up your claims, instaid of just wailing proclamations from the mountaintop, maybe we can have a reasonable discussion.
Incidentally, the IMDB agrees with Tengu’s assertion about the RiD cartoon originating in Japan.
Actually, while a cartoon of some sort may have originated in Japan, the Transformers originated as a line of toys put out by Hasbro in 1984. They comissioned Marvel Comics to put out a 4-issue limited edition comic that would be released at the same time. Jim Shooter and Denny O’Neil created a background history for the already created toys. As far as the credits for the comics go, the plot was done by Bill Mantlo, the script was done by Ralph Macchio, and it was pencilled by Frank Springer.
I got this bit of info from press release from Marvel Comics.
No, Chas, I posted easily verifiable facts, whereas you CLAIM to have known two unnamed people who CLAIM to have created the Transformers based not on Hasbro’s toy line, or even in Hasbro’s employ based on the Diaclone, Micromen, Macross, etc toy lines, but based on a comic book - flying in the face of all verifiable information. BTW, the only usenet connection to my knowing this is my research into the subject for a usenet post of my own.
Now that Pyrrho and Czarcasm have posted cites supporting my post and contradicting yours, is the appropriate apology forthcoming, or will you at least shut up? Or are you going to claim that the people who made the IMDB entry, and in Marvel’s PR department are all misinformed otaku who have it out for you?
I’m willing to believe you know Jim Shooter and Denny O’Niel (Or perhaps Bill Mantlo and Ralph Macchio), and that you were misinformed about their part and inspiration in the creation of Transformers, but you are, simply put, wrong.
Nope, the creator’s names you cited are wrong, and you’ll get no cites on the real creator’s names coming from me. These guys are notorious reclusive hermits. They don’t want any comic geeks showing up on their doorstep, and I completely agree, after one TF nutball started sending me death threats after I informed him his favorite manga wasn’t invented in Japan. And that’s precisely why the real creators of TF did not take credit, they didn’t *want[/] credit. All they wanted was the money.
Maybe someday if you and I and the people you think created TF get in the same room, we’ll have a discussion. Until then, I guess I’ll know the straight dope from my personal experience, and you’ll just believe what you read on Usenet.
Or in other words, Chas.E, you have nothing. Can you come up with anything to show that some sort of “Transformer” comic existed before the toy line and comissioned Marvel comic came out in 1984? If you are accusing both Hasbro and Marvel of lying?
Do you think it possible, in lieu of the facts and cites so far listed in this thread, and the hundreds more available, that your two buddies may have been telling a few tall ones?
Well, Chas.E’s friends are part of the Transformers underground, founded by the Illuminati to fight the Go-Bots, which was a creation of the Bilderbergs and Faction 2. Transformers was funded in part by George Bush Sr. selling drugs to the Columbians and sales of Transformers helped to pay for the murder of Vince Foster. Later, as sales slumped, Faction 1 switched to using Star Wars toys again, and Faction 3 took over the Transformers files. A new Retrovirus has been introduced with all new Optimus Primes, which, when combined with a bee sting, will leave the victim in a coma, allowing FEMA to take over the country on Christmas.
Now they are all gonna kill me for this…
I’ll be honest, here… I’m not altogether sure what Chas is trying to argue. He started out with the following comment, with regard to the “Robots in Disguise” television series having originally aired in Japan:
It appears as though Chas is denying that the series “Robots in Disguise” was produced in Japan. Other posters thought maybe Chas was confused, and pointed out that we were not talking about the original “Transformers” series or the comic book by Marvel, but about the “Robots in Disguise” TV series which aired recently on Fox. Chas managed the following brilliant reply:
Ah, yes. The “whatever you say” rebuttal. From the brilliant displays of higher brain function and reading comprehension that Chas has made in this thread, one would expect his well thought out response to end the discussion. :rolleyes:
I provided a link backing up the assertion that “Robots in Disguise” began life as the Japanese series “Car Robots”. Tengu requested an apology from Chas and asked that he retract those statements he made which have been shown to be false.
How did Chas reply? Well, with more tales of his hippy friends, of course. No apologies, no retractions, and apparently nothing relevant to this discussion. So is Chas attempting to argue that “Robots in Disguise” did not start life as the Japanese series “Car Robots”, but that it was instead created entirely in America? Is he claiming that Hasbro created the series in North America, then released the cartoons in Japan a year early just to give the Transformers some “street cred”? Or, is he claiming that there never was a series “Car Robots” in the first place? Is he claiming that his two hippy friends are the only two people that have ever worked upon The Transformers, in any medium? Does he have any evidence to back up anything he’s said so far?
Maybe Chas is having flashbacks to his misadventure with that Transformers fan who thought that “Ralph Macchio” and “Frank Springer” were traditional Japanese names. He seems to be railing against the mistaken notion that The Transformers were a Japanese invention. Chas, calm down. If you read this thread again, and look up the difficult words, I think you’ll find that no-one here is claiming that they were. To the best of my knowledge neither Hasbro, Marvel, nor Sunrise ever attempted to pass the original series off as being Japanese. If you just wanted to educate us about the fact that The Transformers was an American creation, I think your work here is done. Thank you Mister Obvious. We’ll move on shortly to fire being hot and rabbits pooping a lot.
We’re even willing to let you claim that you personally know the creators of the Transformers, and we won’t even ask you what their names are. I’m a bit fuzzy on what they actually did, though. Did they make the original sales pitch to Hasbro? (possible, but if so I’d hardly credit them with being the creators of the series) Invent the mechanical designs? (demonstrably false, unless you’d like to argue that the Hasbro designs were not copied from previously existing Japanese toy lines) Wrote the TV series? (IDMB credits George Arthur Bloom and Doug Booth) Worked on the comic book? (Where they should be credited, or at least have pen names) Or did your two friends just hang out at the comic shop, talking about the giant robot series they were gonna make one day, and when the Transformers series came out they started claiming that Hasbro had ripped them off? (This would explain your “All they wanted was the money” comment)
As interesting as your hippy dissertation was, let’s try to get back to the issue for which you owe Tengu an apology Chas: Was “Robots in Disguise” originally produced in Japan or not? Please explain your answer using complete sentences.
Wow, from innocent-chitchat-about-G1-Transformers-and-RiD to Chas.e-vs.-everyone-else-on-the-origins-of-Transformers in just six messages. WTF?
As far as I know, the original origins of the Transformers are as follows:
- Hasbro gets the rights to distribute a whole bunch of transforming robot toys in the United States from Takara (and a few from other properties).
- Hasbro goes to Marvel Comics, says “We have these toys, what can you do with them?” (following an earlier trend where Marvel helped Hasbro revive the G.I. Joe franchise)
- Marvel’s staff (including Shooter, O’Neil, et al) cook up the backstory about Cybertron’s civil war, Autobots and Decepticons, etc.
- Everything snowballs from there.
While I found Chas.E’s assertions to be interesting, I have to also say that he’s the only person I’ve ever heard dispute the events as listed above. Considering that the origins of the Transformers toy line has been revisited by everyone from the organizers of BotCon to the authors of Cybertronian: The Unofficial Transformers Recognition Guide – not to mention yours truly, keeper of the Transformers toy list – I’ll have to be very skeptical and ask Chas for some more definite proof before I start believing in aged hippies hiding somewhere in Los Angeles…
I’ll apologise now for not providing at the start the cites that Pyrrho, Czarcasm, and rjung have since provided. (Thanks guys, BTW. And rjung- I LOVE you’re site! It’s one of my favourite cites for TF related conversations - I think I’m responsible for at number of hits on it from another MB. ^^ (A thread about the original topic of this one. ^^;;
)
The Ralph Macchio? Was the inking done by Pat Morita?
At the age of 23, when I’m driving down the highway and I spot a blue semi with a red trailer, I still say, “Omigod! It’s Optimus Prime!”
Strange little girl I was in the '80s, watching all the “boy” cartoons…and My Little Ponies. I credit the latter episodes of G.I. Joe with my bizarre imaginations…but that’s another story.
Incidently, I used to think it was “Robots in the skies” because, well, some of them did fly.
Hey guys, dont you know? Chas E. is NEVER wrong…nope never. If it comes to culture or entertainment, he knows all, sees all, is all.
Why, ask him about how rice should be eaten sometime.
LOL, I’m sorry, this just came across as funny to me. Notorious reclusive hermits seems like an oxymoron to me. Well, just the thought of any hermit being notorious is pretty funny.