UK Snap Election: 8 June 2017

Hmm I think there’s a line beyond which respect is not deserved.

He was there because he was a BBC journalist.

You don’t seem to understand what I said. You don’t have to respect the person. You don’t have to respect what is said. You do have to respect the right of the person to say it.

I believe in freedom of speech. That includes someone saying something that I find offensive. That includes someone saying something that you find offensive. I found Naughtie’s comments offensive; I still respect his right to say them and hold them. But his having said what he said diminished my respect for both him and the BBC.

Well we’ve got a new scandal today: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-kent-40129826

Any thoughts on what this could do for the vote? Storm in a teacup or yet another badly timed shock?

I think that the accused is entitled to the presumption of innocence. Sadly, though, I also think that it will be perceived as sleaze as normal. Labour were fined £20K last year, as were the Lib Dems. I’m not sure but I think the SNP are the only major party to have not been fined, but I think they have been investigated.

For the edification of non-Brits, these prosecutions do have real bite: David Chaytor, a Labour MP, was sentenced to 18 months’ imprisonment. Fiona Jones, another Labour MP, was convicted but the conviction was overturned on appeal. Sadly, one report suggests this triggered her alcoholism which led to her death.

The Financial Times has an article here, referencing her. Note that it’s a year old. Quoting the relevant bits would go beyond fair use, so I’ll just excerpt two bits from near the end:

and

Respecting free speech does not mean you have to refrain from mocking that speech.

You say something stupid, you should expect to be called stupid.

Absolutely. Just as you are free to speak, so you must accept responsibility for the consequences of what you speak.

Something tells me we’re all in agreement but saying it differently.

So which is it? He shouldn’t have said he thought they were crazy, or he should have? Because in this thread you seem to have maintained both. To quote you again:

Yes, he was free to say it. But he should not have done so. He’s a BBC reporter and in saying what he said - not respecting their right to hold that view - he has diminished the reputations of both himself and the BBC. He would have been better advised to be more professional and to not have said it. He was free to say it; now he suffers the consequences.

Journalists offer their opinions all the time - never read an op-ed? BBC News, when presented as such, must be impartial according to broadcast media rules, but it doesn’t stop individual journalists being able to express their opinions at appropriate times, such as this after dinner speech, when they are clearly NOT purporting to present a balanced news report.

The BBC shows plenty of shows where journalists get to take pops at politics - Have I Got News for You being the obvious example.

James Naughtie is also, these days, just an occasional ‘Special reporter’ for the BBC, which strongly suggests to me that he is freelance, so on his own time can basically say what he likes.

Of course, but I’ve not read that sort of language in one.

That seems rather melodramatic.

Only a week to go now. I will cheer a Labour majority. I will cheer a Tory majority. Who runs the Union is less important than the Union itself.

I would only cheer a party whose views I shared, but I agree that party is far less important than country.

I’m expecting an increased Tory majority, but not by much. A loss would blow my mind. A hung Parliament would be amazing. I don’t know how I’d react to a Labour majority.

I mentioned upthread that I turned off the TV in disgust when Corbyn was on. Well, May is now on and I’ve again turned off the TV in disgust. Her answer to the question of payments to Europe as the divorce bill was utter waffle. She should have said something along the lines of, “Not a penny.” or, “They’re trying it on” And then the NHS. She was being questioned by a nurse about the lack of a pay rise and she kept saying, “I respect your position.” instead of pointing out that the nurse was in the same job doing the same thing and therefore had not earned a pay rise. Pathetic.

Neither Corbyn nor May seem up to the job.

Do you know what happens when annual wage increases are below the rate of inflation, Quartz?

I’ll just leave this splendid picture from The Poke. :slight_smile: (SFW but innuendo.)

Yes. And your point is? Pay rises don’t happen automatically. She could have tried for a better - higher paid - job and has not got one. Or maybe she did and failed. What has she done to earn that pay rise?

Hush, everyone knows there’s a magic jobs tree and anyone who is stuck in the same dead-end job for years is just lazy.