See, I disagree. I don’t think Smashy is stupid. Just someone who drank the right wing kool aid. Oh sure he’ll claim otherwise, but it’s pretty clear.
Sometimes, in my perversity, I think we should give the conservatives everything they wish for. Don’t like government-run anything? Fine. Abolish Social Security and Medicare for a start. Since they’re so much better at managing their lives, they obviously don’t need ‘government handouts’. They can find better deals by buying private insurance, and since they’ve planned so well they don’t need a monthly Social Security check from the gubmint. The strong and the smart will survive. The others can die, and decrease the surplus population. With a decreased population, there will be more jobs than people and the economy will thrive.
And we can also make our military pay for their own medical care. Get shot? Good thing you bought private insurance! Cops? Who needs them? That’s what guns are for. Courts? A Real Man can handle his own disputes. I plan to buy up as many roads as I can, and charge people to drive on them. That way people only have to pay for what they use, instead of some government stealing their money to maintain roads they never use. I don’t have kids, and I never will have kids. Why should I pay for someone else’s kids to go to school? They bred, they can take the responsibility. The list goes on!
Just think about how much better America would be if only we were all free to demonstrate our own responsibility!
Not that either SS or Medicare are hand outs, but great idea, as long as they quit taxing us for it too!
When has anyone said they don’t want to pay for any of these things?
Yes, it would be great if parents would take responsibility for their kids, but in the case of schools, if they were actually teaching the kids even half what they used to, there would be far less bitching about how much they cost.
Yup, it would be a lot like the days before we were being forced to pay to support random strangers simply because they don’t feel like supporting themselves. You know, when one income could support a spouse, house and 2.4 kids?
Yes, damn this living in a society where we are actually expected to care about others! I mean, screw everyone else, what about me? ME!!
And weren’t the old days great, when the top marginal tax rate was not 35% like today! Like in the 1940’s when it ranged from 81% - 94%. Or in the 1950’s, when it range from 84% to 91%. Or in the 1960’s when it ranged from 70% to 91%. Or in the 1970’s when the top rate ranged from 70% to 71.75%
You know, if you are trying to make the argument that taxes are SOOO terrible today, and are completely responsible for someone with one income not making a go of it, you’d be well advised to acquaint yourself with the historical facts of taxation. Idiot.
You know, continuing to pretend that those who disagree with your opinions must be talking like monsters really doesn’t say much for the strength of your beliefs.
And how many middle class folks paid those tax rates back then? Again, it doesn’t say much for your side if you only post the top rate.
You know, if you are trying to make any argument at all, you could try not pretending the opposition said something they didn’t. Idiot.
:rolleyes:
Tho, this is a good example of what many folk in here do when there might be a chance the will be exposed to something outside their comfort zones…
Actually, it’s a logical reaction when we’re talking to someone who’s so dense her head has an event horizon.
The Washington Post had a pretty good summary of the issues in today’s lead editorial.
The WaPo is very left-of-center on most issues, but they make some good arguments for the bill, including a few I agree with. Our conclusions are different, maybe because I’m more of a deficit hawk and a realist when it comes to future Congresses cutting costs/increasing pain - I’ve seen this movie too many times before, they rarely seem to happen. Also, America has a track record of entitlements starting off ‘small’ (if any number in the billions can be called small) but growing out of hand.
This is the money shot:
The piece goes on to talk about the benefit of getting the insured population from 83% to 94% outweighing those risks, and also some stuff in the bill that’s supposed to give us a chance to control healthcare spending long term (pilot programs, M4M’s medical cost-control BRAC-like commission, etc).
You can draw your own conclusions of course. But this piece does a reasonable job of summing up my opposition to this bill. And maybe the OP’s buddy’s opposition?
I did not say you were a monster. I implied that you were selfish. And you are - you bitch about being "forced’ to support random strangers. Boo Hoo - you have to pay money to keep society running. How sad for you that you have to pay taxes to keep people from starving. Move to Somalia - that seems your speed -no government, no taxes, just look after yourself by paying money to the local warlord.
Christ, I knew that I"d have to do your research for you. Here you go. And then please shut your pie-hole about how horrible the taxes are now compared to “back in the day”. You’re WRONG.
Single/ married filing separately
1940
10,000 14%
20,000 28%
30,000 34%
40.000 40%
50.000 48%
1950
10,000 38%
20,000 56%
30,000 62%
40.000 69%
50,000 75%
1960
10,000 38%
20,000 56%
30,000 62%
40.000 69%
50,000 75%
60,000 78%
1970
10,000 32%
20,000 48%
30,000 53%
40.000 58%
50,000 62%
60,000 64%
1980
10,000 21-24%
20,000 34-43%
30,000 44-54%
40.000 49-54%
50,000 55-59%
60,000 63-64%
- lower number = single, higher = married filing separate
1990
10,000 15%
20,000 28%
30,000 28%
40.000 28%
50,000 31%
60,000 31%
70,000 31%
2000
10,000 15%
20,000 15%
30,000 28%
40.000 28%
50,000 31%
60,000 31%
70,000 31%
80,000 36%
90,000 36%
100,000 36%
2009
10,000 15%
20,000 15%
30,000 15%
40.000 25%
50,000 25%
60,000 25%
70,000 28%
80,000 28%
90,000 28%
100,000 28%
110,000 33%
Your immature responses are noted and held against your side of the debate.
You essentially stated that I didn’t care about anyone but myself. Sounds pretty monstrous eh?
It’s just amazing that you all don’t see that your position is also selfish. Which of course is to be expected, since healthy egos are selfish. But to pretend that forcing your opinion on what is best for society on the rest of us isn’t selfish?
I have no problem paying to keep society running. What I have a big problem with is paying to keep more and more people sitting on their backsides their whole lives. Again, look into what is happening with California for an example of how society evolves when bleeding hearts make it easy for people to get by without having to work for it. Handing them government subsidized health care is just another step towards that socialist society you all claim you don’t want. It’s no wonder we have to support so many people the way you all encourage people to blither off into life without a plan or a clue.
Yes, you do. If you want to use a fact as proof of some point you want to make, you will actually have to post that fact, not expect me to wander about Google trying to figure out what you are talking about. I will not do your work for you. However, since you couldn’t be bothered to provide a cite for where you got these numbers, nor put them into context, I have no idea if I am WRONG or not… Not to mention that you posted only the single/filing separately, when I was obviously talking about married couples filing jointly way back when.
I don’t know about Lobohan, but I’ve always thought that thing is funny as hell.
I’d never seen that before, but it is pretty funny. 
Just another example of why people think you are a malletheaded idiot who refuses to read the bill, and believes everything she is spoonfed by Glenn Beck. Even with the public option (which was removed), very, very few people would qualify for free health insurance. The vast majority of people that would gain coverage under the Senate bill will be paying premiums for their health insurance. You refuse to acknowledge that, because it would demolish your carefully constructed liberal hatred house of cards.
That’s why everyone here sees you for what you are; a willfully ignorant extremist that cannot be bothered to read the facts, content to wallow in ignorance and blame others for all your problems.
No, that’s the fucking definition of selfish. Which you are.
No, it is not selfish, since I’m not “forcing my opinion” on you; The taxation legislation has not been “forced on you” by anyone. It is the result of laws passed by your elected representatives. Take a civics class for fucks sake.
Read this if you’re able:
http://www.taxfoundation.org/publications/show/151.html
It does have lots of numbers and big words, but maybe you can get someone to explain it to you. Bottom line? You cannot blame “increased taxation” for your poor hypothetical person who can’t support a spouse, house and 2.4 kids on one income.
Hey, I was praising the improved tone of the debate only a page or so ago. Including you! :eek: (Pssst. Post 165.)
And, come on Shodan, you know you’re the king of the vitriol-laden one liner. You often enjoy trying to score points off other people rather than debate them honestly.
When you do debate honestly, I enjoy reading your posts, or at least respect them. I wish you did it more often.
Well, no, I don’t have the figures but it stands to reason if you need to collect for 10 years and only spend for five there’s some problem with things adding or not adding up.
It takes time and money to set up large systems. The Exchange will require startup money, but it more than pays for itself in the long run.
Like say you want to start a lemonade stand, you need to pay for the stand and lemons before you start selling.
Doesn’t that make sense to you?
If you say so! :rolleyes:
Holy fucking shit on a dog’s anus, Batman. You sound like Joe Pesci from My Cousin Vinny. “Oh I didn’t mean Jerry Callo, I meant Jerry Gallo! With a G”
Fine you whiney McSimpleton. Here’s your list of married couples filing jointly
http://www.truthandpolitics.org/top-rates.php#fn-2
You know how difficult this was to find? How long do you think it took me to go to Google and type in “historical income tax rates” and click on the very first link that came up.
Fucking hell, with the auto fill button on you only need to put in “historical inc” and Google will spot you the “ome tax rates”
Do some fucking research on your own. Learn a goddamned thing or two.
Let me get this straight. Were you pissy about the interstate system because you couldn’t drive on it day one?
Your objection isn’t sensible.