I’m just assuming that my Social Security will be uncollectable. According to my statement, that’s $1159 / month if I start at age 67, so not insignificant. I’ll claim it if I can, but I don’t feel I can count on it as I should be able to.
My wife was looking at houses in Tuscany this morning. My old friend who is a singer (she used to sing backup for Pink Floyd) lives part-time in Italy. She says Tuscany is great. (And between Milan, Venice, and Florence, where I’ve been, I like Florence best.) The Spousal Unit says that if the country is still shit eight years from now, we should think of moving. (Assuming Social Security hasn’t been stolen by the oligarchs, or that the retirement age isn’t raised again. We’d need something to live on.)
I’ll say it again.
Where you gonna go?
Very few of us can turn our backs on family and the life we’ve made here.
If you’re on retirement or Social security, if that money is still coming to you, who’s to say the hardship will be any easier somewhere else.
In fact it could be so much worse.
You’ll have limited rights in a foreign country. Less ability to fix problems. And no close support to help.
Yeah. I’ll be staying put.
It is what it is.
I’ll die here. We will see if I go down fighting or other.
But you potentially have greater, less expensive, access to health care, and a society that is aware of how societies work. There’s a lot to be said about societies where the health of the citizens matter more than some demi-oligarch’s vacation home.
You might have less days off in a foreign country country than you have here, but then again I’m no blacksmith.
Oh… We don’t have any close contacts now. I have a sister in San Diego, but we rarely talk. My father’s last surviving sibling is in Oregon. My wife is estranged from her sister, and interacts with her cousins through Facebook. Basically, it’s just the two of us and the cats.
You don’t have rights until you become a citizen.
From what I’ve read it’s not so easy to become a citizen everywhere. And maybe quite expensive.
You may well be disliked for being American.
Jobs are hard to get everywhere.
And, I’m sorry but medical care would be the first reason I wouldn’t go. Free ain’t always the best. I’ll take my chances here.
Things may get bad for me anyway, but if I gotta die, I’d rather do it here among my family.
One thing I posted in another thread is my astonishment at how strongly people resist even the IDEA of getting out. I’m finding this in real life, as well. People certainly have quite valid reasons for staying, and I respect that. What I don’t understand is how people are just writing it off as impossible without due consideration.
I hear a lot of people saying “but my family is here.” Valid, of course, but any of our immigrant ancestors could have used the same argument to stay in Europe / Asia / South America / Wherever.
I see a lot of people saying (basically) “I’m afraid it might be too hard.” I will say, from experience, that emigrating in mid-life is extremely difficult, and that it takes years to get back to where you were before you left, and that you always have a foot in your culture of origin. I will also say that, looking at what’s happening, it was worth it. But maybe I’m alarmist.
There’s a lot of other reasons, as valid as they are varied, but it still strikes me as bizarre that people don’t give it due, serious consideration before rejecting it. I’m thinking more of my real-life friends than people here, because I cannot, O reader, see into your mind, but still.
As I’ve mentioned before, I left Floriduh - a house, a good job- precisely because I watched my city, which had been reliably blue, turn obnoxious red. When dickhead DeSantis got in, that was the last straw.
Even during the good years, I always vowed I would “die in California”. I meant “eventually”, and “eventually” appears to be at the door. I love my state, and up to now I’d taken for granted that it would always remain as is, politically, but now I fear Newsom is gonna cave (I think he has already but I can’t keep track).
Sorry to ramble; TLDR - I’m in the mindset of ’ if situation is as dire as it feeIs, I can’t outrun it, so I’ll trade temporary safety for fighting / dying on my home turf '.
Like what @Beckdawrek said.
No judgement on those who have expressed otherwise.
Coming to America back in the day was full of promise and a future. It was worth leaving famine ridden Ireland for a future. Many other places had similiar or just as dire situations.
The difference is we Americans have no great place that is free of strife or problems of their own that can provide a future for an unwanted guest.
Immigrants still wanna come here. It’s a dream and a chance to improve their lives and their families lives.
America is a one of.
If you think the rightwing crap is only in America you’re mistaken.
I am an American living in a foreign country. Been overseas for years.
I have actual, factual, real-world experience with this.
Whereas you, clearly, are imagining things, making up a reality out of your own head, based on who knows what half-baked misinformation is gunking up your mental shower drain.
At some point you’re going to figure out you don’t have to weigh in, you don’t have to offer your thoughts, on every little topic. At least, I certainly hope you do.
Because — I am on a track to citizenship without any kind of financial reaming, I am not disliked for being an American, I feel more comfortable with my human rights being respected here than I did back in the US, and the overall quality of my health care is so much better here that my American doctor might as well have been a medieval barber bleeding me with leeches.
You have any other expat-horror fantasies you need me to disabuse you of?
I’m very very happy for you.
That won’t be nearly everyones experience.
This fantasy people have of running to the arms of welcoming foreign country and being totally at home. Accepted. Employed. Healthy. Like the food and language. It’s just that, a fantasy.
Who wouldn’t like strolling down some nice avenue, to a quaint little restaurant. Make good friends. Enjoy yourself. Be able to afford it because you found the perfect niche’ job working remotely.
But, face it…it’s not gonna happen for most of the people railing about it.
We stuck folks. Make the best you can of it.
Well, it only works if you try. I did it, and it was very hard but worth it.
You can learn a second language to fluency as an adult; it just takes time and effort. You can find a job abroad; it just takes time and effort.
Yeah, I haven’t left Texas despite despising its politicians for at least a quarter century. I thought “hmm, Portugal sounds nice” in November, but didn’t act on it (due to the company I work for, Poland or Mexico would probably be easier). Quite honestly, I probably don’t have the long-term planning skills to carry out an orderly emigration. Moving across town is an endeavor for me.
And yeah, there’s no guarantee that things will be better at a place that would take me. Plus, I’m an inveterate scofflaw, so breaking the law isn’t really a barrier to my behavior or a line I fear to cross. I’ve been to jail before (which would probably complicate any attempt I made at leaving), plenty of my relatives have been to prison. I’m probably better suited to being a burr under the saddle of the powers that be, wherever I am.
Also, this board skews older. Many people here have less ability to leave or make a new life elsewhere and/or don’t expect to live much longer anyway, so there’s less incentive to give up everything to leave.
Yeah it skews old and white and I’ve noticed that white boomers, more than any other group, seem to be slow to acknowledge the depth of the problem.
I suspect the concept of moving to another country is far less daunting to those with a fairly extensive travel history than it would be to those without.
Those with have an infinitely better understanding of how things do and do not work elsewhere, and probably contemplate this sort of move with their eyes wide open.
Even then, there are definitely going to be significant differences between actually taking up residence in another country and spending time there – even months on end – as a ‘tourist.’
I also think it’s worth asking:
- How many expats (US-ers who moved to another country) do you know well, and have you talked about their expat experiences with, and
- How much time have you spent in which foreign countries in your adult life?
This being SDMB, I guess this is the equivalent to asking you to cite your source.
If people have the opportunity and fortitude to make such a move I am all for it.
I’ve traveled extensively and realize the situation America is in at the moment.
I am 67 with health issues. I cannot consider a move to another country.
I don’t have the stamina (physical and mental) to complete the prep work before and the adjustment after.
Here, I have a decent support network and I’ll take my chances.
My grave and tombstone are all prepared and I’m ready to shuffle off anyways.