What on earth are you talking about? An hour before you posted this, I wrote that I still think I did the right thing.
I’m not seeing any sense in your math.
I shouldn’t have been charged for the second tea at all. So there’s no reason I should have paid for part of it.
Either the waitress intentionally charged me for a second tea when she shouldn’t have (which is what I think happened). Or she accidentally charged me for a second tea when she shouldn’t have (unlikely in my opinion but some people are suggesting this is possible). Either way it was her mistake and my lowering her tip was justified.
The waitress made two mistakes but they were very minor mistakes. Was she openly rude to you? Did she not check in on you with enough regularity?
She basically didn’t clarify your order for you and then she probably made (or suffered and did not notice) a mistake on ringing up the bill.
You were honestly ridiculous for not pointing that out.
Now, on to the issue of a tip, here’s how I see it.
There are a lot of people in our society who work an hourly wage and pull down $30+ an hour. A software engineer working as an independent contractor can pull down $100 an hour. If they make a very minor mistake, meaning it does not have a major impact on their customer or anything of that nature, and get it fixed really quick, it’s no big deal.
A construction worker making $25+ an hour who makes a minor mistake, again, he’s not going to lose his job.
Waitresses who are working for $2.25 an hour and pretty much everyone in our society thinks it’s appropriate to reduce their hourly income because of minor bullshit? I just don’t understand that.
Yeah, if I’m a surgeon and I make a mistake and someone dies or is permanently disabled, I’m in serious trouble, huge increases in medical malpractice premiums etc. But that’s a major mistake.
If I own a construction company and a minor mistake results in some cost overruns, yeah, I’m going to eat those losses. As a business owner I eat any losses as a result of my minor mistakes. Craftsmen are often in the same boat.
But the thing is of all the individuals in the world who you can say honestly are at risk of regularly having their take home pay reduced (people who do piece-work, entrepreneurs, people working on commission, people whose pay is significantly made up of performance bonuses or stock options) all make significantly more than a waiter/waitress and by and large the reasons their pay will fluctuate up and down are typically over more important issues. People act like a sub-minimum wage worker deserves to get shorted on nickles and dimes over minor little mistakes that no normally compensated employees would get so much as a second look from their supervisor over, I think people need to get over themselves and recognize there is almost never a time when it’s appropriate to withhold a tip off a meal you paid for.
My philosophy has always been that unless I’m willing to go to management and complain about atrocious service from a waiter, I’m paying a 15% tip, 20%+ for extraordinary service. If the service is so bad it ruined my dining experience to the point I go to management, I will complain and hopefully my bill will be comped and I won’t leave a thing for the server. If it’s an uptight place that won’t comp the bill, then I’ll pay but not tip. These are massively egregious violations though, and have only happened maybe 2-3 times in over 50 years of eating in restaurants.
Apparently I’m a heavy tipper. I usually leave around a 25% tip. Higher if it’s a cheap place where we’re only talking a few dollars.
But I don’t figure I owe a tip. I’ll tip a waitress because she did her job not because she gets bad pay. This waitress screwed up twice.
Were they minor mistakes? Mostly. But losing two dollars is a minor penalty.
As I said, I don’t have any moral qualms about the short tip. I guess I was wondering more about restaurant policy in general. I eat out quite a bit but I don’t send food back. I can think of only two other occasions in the last couple of decades when I had to send something back.
So I was wondering if maybe my belief that restaurants shouldn’t charge for replacement items was mistaken. Maybe restaurants have always had a “no takebacks” policy and I never knew it because I never send anything back. I thought it was possible that everyone was going to tell me “Of course, you’re going to be charged for two teas even if you sent one back. Everyone knows that’s how it works. It’s one of the unwritten rules.” And I would have learned something I hadn’t known.
But that doesn’t seem to be the case. It appears most people agree the restaurant shouldn’t have charged me for the both teas.
Humblebrag aside, I think it’s pretty funny that what was largely a communication discrepancy between you and the waitress is occurring in this thread as well. You say she screwed up twice. I think that’s not really a fair way to present the case. Iced tea is usually served sweet. Notice in convenience stores and grocery stores, the vast majority of iced teas they sell are sweet. Snapple iced tea is sweet. So is Lipton, etc. Yes, they sell unsweetened versions, but they usually specify that they are not sweetened as it is (today) not the default. Also, note that Snapple sells “sweet tea”, which is a different animal altogether. Now, should the waitress have warned you? Probably, but this is certainly a forgivable, and it’s no more an error than you not asking before you ordered.
The second “mistake” was having two iced teas on the bill. This very well could have been a mistake, but we will never know because you didn’t ask for any clarification. There are many innocuous reasons why there may be two drinks on the bill. One could be that the owner mandates that they do it that way. Another could be if the waitress doesn’t make the drinks, and has to ring it in in order to alert someone else to make it. I personally know of a few restaurants where non-fountain drinks are dispensed at the bar, requiring a waiter to ring in the drink even if they already served one. That said, the waitress might have been able to preemptively get it comp’ed, but again, that may not have been an option for her. Regardless, the one thing that would have certainly brought a little clarity to the issue is some assertiveness on your part. Not sure why you felt compelled to return the drink that you “didn’t order”, but felt no compulsion to correct the bill. It’s just weird to see such passivity coupled with such entitlement.
But is it? Of course $2 is a small amount of money, but waiters make their living on lots of small amounts of money. I get that you were upset, but, as a former waiter, I can tell you that every asshole has a “valid” reason why they decide not to tip the appropriate amount. There is always some perceived slight, delay, or inconvenience that justifies deviating from the implicit tipping agreement. Sometimes, that perception it real too; but that’s usually because this is real life, and (unfortunately) shit happens. People somehow think the chaos that exists in the world stops once you sit down at The Outback. As if there must be some reason why problems arise beyond the fact that people are involved.
That said, I am not saying you are an asshole, but you are trying to justify your behavior despite many people pointing out why you overstepped somewhat. Again, I don’t mean to come down so hard on you in particular, it’s just that when I was waiting tables, nothing pissed me off more than the feeling of cognitive dissonance that occurred when my personal feeling of the service I gave was completely at odds with the tip I received. Especially, knowing that there were likely times when both the customer and I walked away from the situation with a bad taste in our mouths when the issue could have been resolved if there was just more communication.
More importantly, this idea that docking a tip is an appropriate response to any problem that occurs at a restaurant is incredibly myopic and counter-intuitive. First, it robs the waiter of a chance to fix the situation, or to get better in the future. As much as you think you are punishing the waitress, you are punishes whomever she serves after you too, since she will never know that this is something people might (understandably) have an issue with. Second, your solution often punishes the person with the least amount of power to affect change, and the person who relies most on the kindness of others. Third, it validates this expectation that nothing can or should ever go wrong at a restaurant. And that if it does, it’s somehow at affront to you personally, making it okay to screw the messenger rather than speaking up or arguing.
It’s crazy to me that people think they should get anyone’s undivided attention and impeccable service in return for the $3 they “might” tip you at the end of a meal. I am not excusing bad service at all, but you go to a restaurant to eat. If you get your food in a reasonable amount of time, and the people are courteous, and it tastes okay, that should basically be enough. Expect more if you are at Michelin Star restaurant, but recognize that occasionally, the diner off the interstate that you go to might accidentally overcharge you, and if you are too lazy/indifferent/offended to say something, you should eat the cost, not the waitress. You say two dollars is a minor penalty, yet you were completely unwilling to accept that “penalty” yourself; especially since you made a few “mistakes” as well. Instead, you got all butthurt rather than speaking up, then you decided that passive-aggressively exploiting the power you have over someone serving you is the appropriate response. From where I am standing that doesn’t make you some aggrieved victim trying to set things right, it just makes you a bully and a coward.
As a former waiter, you have a different perspective on the issue. Mine is simple - if the waiter or waitress does a poor job they get a reduced tip. This waitress did a poor job and she got a reduced tip from me. I would do the same thing if the situation occurred again. (And let me repeat - I’ll eat hundreds of meals out without shorting a tip. I’m not somebody looking for reasons to complain.)
The only thing I was wondering was if maybe I had been unaware of a common restaurant policy and people were routinely expected to pay for mistaken orders.
And I don’t see why you think I should have paid the “penalty”. Did I prepare the bill?
It’s certainly not a default in a restaurant. This is what the OP said:
Defaults are most certainly regional, regardless of what is sold in gas stations. If the regional default wasn’t the restaurant default, then the waitress should have asked, and the OP shouldn’t have to pay for a second tea (plus, you know, tea refills are usually free anyway).
That’s like spanking a dog when you come home and find that he’s peed in the house. It doesn’t work because there’s no cause & effect connection, and at worst, it’s counterproductive.
First of all, the waitress has no idea that you’ve even shorted her because you routinely tip 25%. By reducing it to 15-20%, your message was way too subtle to be noticed. So she’s learned no lesson. AT THE VERY LEAST, you should have circled the second drink on the bill, and maybe put a frowny face next to it.
Secondly, even if she had noticed the chintzy tip, since you didn’t bother to communicate your unhappiness, she undoubtedly assumed that you were a chintzy tipper. No cause & effect connection.
You believe that she double billed you on purpose. Instead of giving her the benefit of the doubt, you assumed the worst about her. That’s not very nice. You gave her no opportunity to make things right. That’s not very nice.
Expecting impeccable service from waitstaff at anything but 4 and 5 star restaurants is setting a ridiculously high bar. When I order a medium rare steak at Morton’s, I expect it to be grilled to perfection. When I order a medium rare steak at O’Charley’s, I HOPE that there’s some pink in the middle.
Oh, and finally, if word gets out to the other waitstaff about your chintzy tipping, expect your subsequent visits to be less than stellar. At best, the more experienced servers will pawn you off to newbies. At worst, well as Penny from “Big Bang Theory” says, “I can’t believe that a smart person like you would continually piss off the people who handle your food.”
I agree with the rest of your post completely, but if he still tipped 15-20% on this bill I doubt it would be noticed as a chintzy tip, considering the not-insignificant number of people who still apparently think that tipping a crisp new $1 bill is appropriate no matter what your bill was. (OK, maybe not as much these days, but that was certainly my experience back in my restaurant days.)
The only penalty you were being asked to “pay” was asking the waitress to take it off your bill. She would have done so and apologized. By not taking that simple act of common courtesy you moved the situation from a small oversight on her part to a significant boorish move on your part.
Riiiiiiiiiiight.
That’s why your asking us if you did the right thing. The waitress has forgotten you long ago, but you are still rehashing this event over and over and over… day after day.
You know you were wrong. Just admit it and put it behind you.
I was a bartender for 4 years. She should of removed the drink you didn’t like and “took away” off your bill.
Sugar. Water. Brown.
I think it probably is at this point. Many chain restaurants and lower-end places will not bother to brew their own tea, meaning they often buy something like Lipton Brisk tea. When it’s a fountain drink, it will probably be sweet. Even the restaurants that do brew their own often have it pre-iced, or a room temperature, meaning that the sugar added by the customer will not dissolve well. In those cases, its easier to just add simple syrup beforehand.
Regardless, I have no idea what the percentages are, just anecdotal experience, but the fact that nearly every iced tea sold outside of a restaurant is pre-sweetened indicates to me that there is likely some social inertia that gives people the understanding that it’s probably gonna be sweet. Again, the bottle tells you when it has no sugar, not when it does. And that’s not just because they don’t plan to provide you with sugar, people seem to like it that way. I have to think those assumptions have made their way into most restaurants.
I think we all agree on the above. Especially since they serve both. However, life is about how you react to things. His reaction was clearly lacking.
Perhaps, but it’s clearly a relevant perspective under these circumstances.
But she didn’t really do a poor job. She made a small mistake. One which likely would have been corrected or clarified had you spoken up. Again, why do you have no qualms whatsoever with returning a drink, yet you can’t be bothered to ask about the check?
I think you have made it clear that you have learned nothing here. Can I ask you why you bothered to start the thread if you didn’t plan on listening to anything being said?
Oh bullshit. Come on, as a person who has eaten hundreds of meals, you know this is not the case. You honestly can’t be this naive. Even when someone returns an order just because they don’t like it, the vast, vast majority of places will not charge them for it. They build this into the cost of most restaurants. Even fast food places will correct a mistake in food quality or error without charge. In fact, they will usually apologize no matter who is at fault.
A penalty is punishment for breaking a “rule”. You clearly made several mistakes here.
- You ordered something without being sure what it was.
- You didn’t alert someone to a mistake you felt was made.
- You penalized someone who may have not been at fault.
Why aren’t you suffering at all in the scenario? Especially since it’s such a “minor penalty”.
I’m sure the restaurant/waitress would’ve agreed with you, and complied, had you brought it to their attention. Again, each and every time this has happened, I’ve had no issue having the charge removed. I can’t say I agree with your justification for deducting the charge from her tip, as I don’t think it was beyond you to point out the error.
In fact, when items are incorrect during a meal, I assume there is good potential for an incorrect bill, so I double check-- if there is any error, I work with my server to be sure it’s corrected. I think that much is at least being decent.
Given you stated the service was good for most of the meal, I highly doubt she’d shoot herself in the foot by intentionally keeping the charge on the bill. As stated earlier, there is very little incentive to do so, as she risks losing more in tip than she does for a small percentage gain on the charge of the tea.
Restaurant tea outside the South is assumed to be unsweetened unless they specify sweet tea on the menu. This has been my experience both as a restaurant employee, and also as a customer who’s ordered tea in restaurants in at least 30 of the 50 states.
Does that go for iced tea as well ? I’ve never heard of unsweetened iced tea served in the can or purchased in powder form for instant iced tea.
As a non sweet tea drinker, I always order my beverage “Unsweetened Iced Tea with Lemon”. I don’t assume either way or expect the server to read my mind. You have no way of knowing which beverage is the most popular in that particular establishment and although she should have asked, you should have been specific.
Since you didn’t ask for the extra tea to be removed, I think you were totally wrong in docking her tip. You have no way of knowing if they have to key in each product and it could have been an honest mistake to not get an override. You didn’t request what you wanted, you didn’t ask for a resolution to your problem and you took it out on the waitress without communicating why.
I give you 3/4 of the blame. She gets a 1/4 for not remembering to take it off the bill which is what likely occurred.
I think she was referring to iced tea, but remember, restaurants don’t serve tea in cans. They brew their own (or serve fountain tea). In Michigan I could (if I wanted to) buy powdered iced tea instant beverage mix without sweetener very easily – but remember, it’s regional; it’s what we want in Michigan.
Yes, sorry, my post was specifically about iced tea. (A lot of restaurants in the US don’t even offer hot tea, as I found when a British friend was visiting me last year.)
And yeah, most restaurants do brew their own iced tea. Even McDonald’s does. The only real exception would be if they have a brand of premixed iced tea available from the fountain, and in that case it will be clearly marked in the menu as such. (Mind you, I am saying “most”. I know there may be exceptions.)