I disagree. Only a great warrior would know that fighting abilities are not what would make one great. Then again, I seem to be the only person in the Universe who likes Episodes I & II.
I though it was perfect. The whole reason that scene was there was that is as something totally different from what audiences expected. Everyone had seen the aged, wise Yoda who put Luke through his paces, and people had seen a somewhat younger Yoda leading the Council as it dealt with the Senate. But they hadn’t seen Yoda in his role as the greatest Jedi. Jedi are warriors as well as diplomats and thinkers.
That actually takes a great deal from Hong Kong Wushu Theater. The old master, faced with the younger (OK, its hard to imagine Dooku as being young, but he exuded youthful power and elegant grace despite his apparent age) Kung-Fu master, leaps around like a schizoid frog while smacking the stronger combatant back to his mommy. Its a classic scene, and you can find in almost all of Jackie Chan’s old flicks.
No, you’re not, I thought both were great fun. The fanboys who’ll never be satisfied with ANY representation that doesn’t exactly follow their own fantasies, and the film school types who don’t really like SF anyway are over-represented online.
Crouching Tiger, Hidden Kermit.
By the way, I find the first three movies far superior but, having said that, I still think that Darth Maul kicks butt.
The first James Bond movie is the greatest, but the others are good too, while the first Thin Man movie is the best, the others are fun. And so on and so on. Pick your franchise and see if it doesn’t mostly ring true.
Just wait until Matrix part 10 and you’ll see our kids are having the same discussion:
I personally think the fight would have been much cooler (and more in character) if Yoda hadn’t actually touched his light saber at all. Just have the little fella sitting in a lotus position (maybe floating a foot off the ground) while manipulating his light saber with only the force. I think it would have enforced the Yoda code of emphasizing mind over body.
Also, after all the hopping around he did during combat, doesn’t his use of a walking stick seem like a joke? I mean, he certainly doesn’t seem to need it, so who’s he trying to kid? 
I don’t know. I mean, I enjoyed watching it in theaters, but compared to the character everyone came to know and love in the following trilogy, it does seem rather out of place. I’m pretty sure there are some Jedi out there that don’t fight with lightsabers, or at least, aren’t that proficient (isn’t there a story where Luke and some partners find a Jedi who is essentially a giant sentient tree? No lightsaber usage there, I’m afraid). Perhaps if Yoda faught with a bit more of the classic fencing style seen in the second trilogy instead of the super flashy, utterly useless fighting style of the prequels, it would have been different.
Overall, I think it’s going to have to wait till the final movie comes out and they can all be seen together. I mean, it’s going to be rather odd for him to be absent in A New Hope seeing as how he’s been such a key player in the prequels, and then suddenly becomes a “Who?” If anything, it’s not the lightsaber fight, it’s his presence in the movies that kind of ruined the character. I even found his speach pattern in the first movie jarring. His broken English worked so well in Empire and Jedi, but it seemed like they were trying two hard in Menace and Clones. But maybe that’s just me. I would have prefered if he remained more in the background as a type of Oz, you know? Someone who’s super powerful, only comes out every now and again to impart wisdom, but wasn’t really that much of an active player.
But that’s just my opinion.
Damn you beerdog! I got all the way thru this thread to see if I was the only one who noticed that…
I just took his use of the walking cane more as a ruse. Lots of people do that; if your opponant thinks you’re weaker than you are, it gives you an advantage. Also, with lots of people who have studied marial arts for a large portion of their lives, they’re still affected by old age and move kinda slow when just doing ordinary things, but when they start practiving/teaching, they seem to fight like a youngster again. Didn’t you watch any kung fu movies as a kid?
[ /bad dubbing on ]
Ha Ha! Your Reading Tiger style is no match for my Steel Nitpicker of Doom!
[ /bad dubbing off ]
I think that should answer El Elvis Rojo’s question.
Star Wars: I felt that Yoda’s fight was a realization that he had to confront Dooku in the one remaining way.
I feel that he uses a cane because he injured his leg sometime in the past. To use the Force to overcome a handicap in normal life would be trivializing the Force. Especially if the injury occurred in a fight as a Jedi. It would be a badge well earned and a lesson not to forget. A way to remind himself to be humble when he could just as easily use the Force and fly around - just like Tinkerbell. It probably took him a long time to accept using a hover chair (and perhaps the cane too), but he came to realize using a chair was not sloth but just a practical way to keep up with beings that naturally walked faster.
Movie: It was great special effects and we love to see our heroes use their minds as well as their physical skills. Someday I’ll watch it in slow-motion and can comment on whether it was graceful.
PUt me in the “The way he fought was demeanig” side.
He bounced around like Sir Didymus from Labyrinth. It was a joke.
After “The Phantom Menace” I had an image in my head of the scene I wanted to see in the next Star Wars movie. In that scene, some cocky headstrong Sith apprentice comes across Yoda in an empty hallway somewhere and tries to cut Yoda in half with a lightsaber. In response, Yoda barely moves: he just blocks the saber with his cane. Then while the apprentice is still picking his jaw up off the floor, Yoda uses the Force to bounce him off the wall a few times.
That would have been way cooler than the Yoda vs. Dooku fight in “Attack of the Clones”.
I thought it was way cool as it was: harmless, old, somewhat eccentric Yoda suddenly turns into the scariest little green goblin you never saw and it’s not so much a lightsabre duel as frog-in-a-blender time for Dooku.
It’s perfectly consistent with Yoda’s philosophy too. He is inconceivably dangerous with a lightsabre in his hand, but he still maintains that this is not what makes someone great.
First off, Yoda does not sound like Gonzo. He sounds like Grover, Miss Piggy, Fozzie, Cookie Monster, Animal, Bert, and Sam the Eagle. Well, mainly Grover. But those are all Frank Oz characters. Gonzo is performed by Dave Goelz. (OK, maybe they sound a bit similar, but it’s a different voice.)
I’m in the pro-saber fight camp. Like Malacandra said, he is pretty great as a warrior, but it doesn’t make him great. He doesn’t think he’s great, and as much as I love him, he’s got good reason. It was under his watch that the Jedi had their greatest defeat. (IIRC Mace is the leader of the council actually, but we know who Mace goes to for advice.)
As for the style of the fight, I think it was perfect.
- He started out with only the force. He only resorted to sabers when Dooku challenged him.
- He didn’t seem angry to me, as much as dissappointed in a padawan that went astray.
- As Soapbox said, in slow motion he’s very graceful, and moves like a real swordsman. He doesn’t just bounce around. Heck you don’t even need slo-mo. After the initial shock wears off and you’ve seen it a few times, you can see the gracefullness at normal speed too.
- He HAS to move fast. In a lightsaber fight, if you move slower than your opponent, you’re toast. (Ask Darth Maul.) One step of Dooku’s is 4 or 5 of Yoda’s. His legs are infantile. He’s got to pick up the pace.
- He’s clearly winded after it’s all over. The force takes a lot out of you, and it’s clear to me at least that he wouldn’t be able to move like that without it. I believe he does need the cane, not as a ruse, but to avoid using the force constantly and burning himself out. In moments of need, he can summon up great things, but it ain’t easy.
What did cheapen Yoda a bit (aside from the dreadful commercials) was the whole “dark side clouding everything” bit. Having Yoda kick butt shows his power. Having Yoda not knowing something shows him vulnerable. Not fun to see, but probably necessary. As great as the Jedi may be, to get the story to ANH, they must fail. That Obi-wan and Yoda survive shows them to be the greatest of the Jedi, but if they’re so great, why couldn’t they save anyone else?
Count me as someone who thought the fight was one of the high points of the film. It was a big risk but it worked.
From what I understood, they aren’t the only two Jedi to survive, but it’s understandible that they wouldn’t hang out together all the time. Draws attention and all that.
I liked I & II. I’m not even all that bothered by Jar Jar.
Tinkerbell’s a Jedi?! Holy shit!
…
[runs off to rent Peter Pan]
I’ll add my voice to the camp that believes that the Yoda sabre fight was terrible. I thought it was truly, truly awful. In fact, I believe it’s the second worst thing in the first two movies. (The scene where a weepy little Anakin runs to his mother in Episode I before leaving was the worst, but at least that part sucked solely because of the unimaginably poor decision to cast a child who was incapable of realistically exhibiting any human emotion.)
I thought the fight was out of place, added solely for the “cool” factor, and was completely inconsistent with Yoda’s character as previously developed. I also thought that it looked absurd. Even though I knew the movie was almost over, I seriously considered getting up and walking out at that point.
Absolutely everything about Star Wars is cheapened by the prequels. Some people need to learn to leave well enough alone.