I understand why Rachel was hurt. I probably would have been too. I understand why she didn’t want to get back together with him afterwards. (I do not understand the 18 page single spaced, double sided letter.) But Ross didn’t do anything unethical. Rash and stupid, yes. But he didn’t betray her.
“I, Ross, take thee, Rachel.” was much more of a betrayal.
She would have had to buzz him into the building, though.
This was just the most enduring example of the almost universal acceptance (i n entertainment, anyway) of women (and I’m a woman) who are unreasonable, unrealistic bitches. And get away with it.
I loved Friends and while it was great for setting up lots of fun plot stuff, it really drove me nuts because it was SUCH bullshit that I knew if Ross ended up with this stupid woman he’d be miserable.
Friends always was a chick show. I never cared for it. I’m not saying it’s good or bad, just that I, as a guy, don’t like chick shows.
And chick shows have a particular slant…
At what point is he allowed to sleep with someone else? It is a certain period of time? Is it after he confirms she’s sleeping with others? Is it when she unilaterally declares ‘we’re broken up for good’? He’s not psychic he acted with the information he had.
Whatever silly rules she had in her head about what a break meant has nothing to do with anything. She had a perfect opportunity to make it clear when Ross thought it was a break from the argument. She could have said ‘no I don’t want yoghurt I want some time just to calm down. Call me in three days’ Instead she told him a break from the relationship. That’s what she got.
I’ve always been on Ross’s side of this argument. It was always clear that Rachel took it for granted that Ross would be at her beck and call, and it’s bullshit to tell him she wants a break and let him go away brokenhearted. Any guy in that position who went out after that and got drunk, would not say no to a hot chick making herself available to him. Like the saying goes, “the quickest way to get over someone is to get under someone.”
Times like that, sex is just sex and has no deeper meaning than a momentary distraction. It’s not a betrayal of trust or anything that dramatic. That might be a difficult concept for people who can’t do one nighters, or NSA sex, but it’s something a lot of us can do for a little comfort and nothing more. Makes perfect sense to me.
Of course, even if that’s the case it’s still makes sense that it’s hard for Rachel to get over it right away. She takes it waaaaay too far though and it gets ridiculous.
I am on Ross’ side here. I wouldn’t call him blameless but he is definitely less wrong.
But what always bothered me about this sequence is they had established in a previous episode that Mark was engaged. You would think that would come up when he revealed he really was into Rachael but it never was mentioned again.
It’s been a long time–when does Mark reveal he is into Rachel?
I so totally agree with this.
Going from my own spotty memory, a couple of weeks (months?) later, Rachel mentions something to him about how silly Ross was, thinking Mark was chasing her, and he said that he was. Something like that, anyway.
to mark’s credit, he waits til they’ve been broken up for at least a couple weeks to a month or so, because it’s like 2-3 episodes post break up that he tells her he always kind of had a crush on her (but never acted on it because of ross) and that he’d like to take her out sometime. he does it right when gunther is mentally working up the courage to ask rachel out. poor gunther.
not going to delve too deeply into who is right or wrong here because i find a lot of the attitudes in this thread very strange, but i think they both handled things poorly. i also think if ross really wanted to work things out with rachel, as he was so desperate to do after the fact, he should’ve kept it in his pants.
i do agree that “i ross, take thee rachel” was a lot worse. i always felt so badly for emily.
Really? So you’re reconsidering your prior posts?
Yeah, poor girl. She was cute, too.
I don’t even know what a TV is! But I do so love my zoetrope.
Get in line. I love her.
They were totally on a break. Ross shouldn’t have slept with the copy place girl, granted, but they WERE broken up. Bitch move, yes. Rachel CLEARLY loved (loves) him. They should have worked it out!
Question about Rachel-Gunther: Rachel is oblivious to the crush, right?
I don’t get this. It was unconscious. If anything, it was a gift: he was clearly making a mistake.
if you don’t get why saying another woman’s name at the altar is a betrayal, there’s not much i can say. if he were still that hung up on rachel, he never should have proposed to emily to begin with, and should’ve said something before he flew overseas, planned a wedding, gathered both families and friends, stood up in front of them, started to exchange vows, and said another woman’s name. absolutely a betrayal. he had plenty of time to back out if he had doubts, and he never did.
about rachel and gunther, yes, she’s oblivious to it. he confesses his love to her in the series finale.
I remember seeing her (the actress who played Emily, Helen Baxendale) in an episode of Mystery! playing Cordelia Grey in Unsuitable Job for a Woman, based on the P.D. James novel. Great character. I always had a soft spot for her after that when I’d watch the reruns.
I felt bad for Emily, too. I got the sense that we were meant to see her as harsh and unforgiving when she told Ross that he’d have to stop seeing Rachel if he wanted the marriage to work. But I think that’s a pretty normal reaction. That was such a humiliating moment and she’s probably wondering if Ross spent their entire relationship secretly in love with Rachel.
Pretty much depends on yoru definition of betrayal.
I pick… 5. Maybe. Except that he revealed it to himself as well as everyone else in the room.