Tossing this into The BBQ Pit.
This bothers me.
Why because one doesn’t agree with the outcome, immediately the voters for Bush are ignorant and stupid? Unless you can cite some statistics this is a false statement.
Some statistics (PDF).
Bloody hell, that’s shocking.
(Prediction: poll will shortly be debunked, then counterdebunked, then names will be called, bla bla ad nauseam.)
[QUOTE=gfloyd
She said it didn’t matter and that voting was a right, not a duty. Fine, let’s say it is a right, not a duty, but does that mean we shouldn’t exercise it? I drove almost an 1.5 hours, round trip, to go home and vote. For my roommate, it was more like 3 or 4 hours, including 2 train rides. [/QUOTE]
Voting is not a right; it’s closer to a priviledge.
[QUOTE=DougC - Hey, sorry–some of us like to own guns, like the idea of killing terrorists on their own doorsteps and don’t like the idea of the US taking orders from the UN.
[/QUOTE]
Ah, you like to kneejerk on NRA glurge, you like the idea of killing brown people with strange religions in weird parts of the world and you’ve been reading Free Republic again, haven’t you?
And I obviously can’t code worth a Bush’s conscience…
Oh, and this…
…definitely deserves a :dubious: .
That defeats the whole point of presumption of innocence. It’s not an abstract concept. A jury is supposed to assume only that the defendant is innocent until the state proves guilt. As a juror I know that someone else thought there was probably cause but at the start of the trial no one has proven anything to me. Do you think innocent people have never been indicted or brought to trial?
Last week I had to explain to someone that registering to vote doesn’t cost anything. Someone who told me that they don’t vote because ‘It’s not like they actually count the votes.’
After human beings all over the planet have fought for time immemorial to be enfranchised and have a say in the government they live under, why in the hell would anyone deliberately silence their own voice?
And to all the people who say ‘Why vote? Things will never change.’ you’re right. If you never vote, things will never change because politicians will never realize that there’s that threat of losing your job if you continue to ignore the will of the people you represent.
There’s a difference between legal fictions and reality. I’ve served on a jury in a criminal case. As a juror, I was required to base my decision on the evidence presented in court, and to assume that the defendant was innocent unless proven otherwise beyond a reasonable doubt. As a person with a brain, I know that the police usually have a good reason to arrest someone. They don’t just pick people off the street at random. I have no trouble keeping the two ideas separate from each other, and presuming the defendant to be innocent when serving on a jury. In the case I served on, we found the defendant innocent of one charge (breaking and entering), even though he was probably guilty, because the prosecution failed to prove its case for that charge. We found the defendant guilty of another charge (possession of stolen property) where there was sufficient evidence to convince the jury that he was guilty beyond any reasonable doubt.
I don’t see anything wrong with either answer. As a juror, assuming that the defendant MIGHT be guilty does not prevent me from doing my job at weighing the evidence. In fact, I could possibly cast a vote for aquital while still assuming that the defendant might be guilty. Did the lawyer in your example understand the concept of reasonable doubt.
A right is irrevocable. Prisoners and ex-cons can’t vote in some US states. Also, the constitution doesn’t directly establish a right to vote, but a prohibition against discriminating votes based on adult age, sex, or race.
Nope, he’s correct. Voting is not a right, it’s a privilege. You do not have a constitutional right to vote. It would not take a constitutional amendment for Congress to strip your ability to vote away from you, as long as it is not done on the basis of race, gender or age (if you are over 18).
Second Amendment rights are curtailed for felons as well. Are you going to argue that owning a gun is a privilege, as well?
They are not ignorant and stupid because they voted for Bush. They voted for Bush because they are ignorant and stupid. Two different concepts.
Please explain this “fighting them on our doorsteps” concept to me, it doesn’t make any sense. Of course you don’t even have to worry about terrorism, because good 'ol NYC will be taking the consequences of our national actions, maybe DC too. As far as not taking orders from the UN, well everyone has their opinion. Here’s mine. From time to time our country and the UN and members will have conflicts over courses of action. There is nothing wrong with this. The problem is when we tell them to fuck off and call them worthless, etc, etc. So to put it bluntly, IT’S THE WAY IT WAS HANDLED STUPID! (not calling you stupid btw). Then my irony meter explodes when we tell the world to fuck off we’re starting this war, you’re all a bunch of pussies, and then ask for help. Also Keep in mind that everyone that argued SH had no WMD (IIRCS France and Germany were in that group) WAS CORRECT.
Christ, even if we ate some crow over it, it would do us a world of good. These guys won’t admit any mistake whatsoever.
BTW, the word is Colin Powell is out the door (his choice).
Gun ownership is more of a right as worded in the constitution. Its just that nobody wants to take the case for allowing prisoners the right to carry firearms to the Supreme Court when there are greater injustices to be righted. Voting is framed as a privilege even in the Constitution.
(Cue the cowboys around a campfire) NEW YORK CITY?!?!?
But you must realize that many people in the USA hate NYC and DC. New York is the New Sodom and is the epicenter of Jewish Homosexual Liberality. Washington is where all those worthless politicians are and where the bureaucrats suckle at the teat of our taxes. Many people are not entirely joking when they say that they’d just as soon have NYC and Washington DC wiped from the face of the Earth, so when you think they don’t care that terrorists will target it you are right. They don’t really care and might be smugly pleased it it were.
I don’t think of voting as a right, or a duty, or a privilege. Voting is taking responsibility.
I’m seeing calls all over the place for a more united America. I seriously doubt this is the way to go about it.