John Ramsay didn’t suddenly jump up and run right to the body on a hunch. A detective asked Ramsay’s friend, Fleet White, to accompany him on a search of the house. Ramsay wasn’t alone when the body was found, Fleet White was with him. Ramsay and White started their search in the basement, which seems logical (you’d expect them to either start at the bottom and work their way up or vice versa). Ramsay didn’t go straight to the room containing the body, the pair searched two other rooms first. Ramsay did “mess with the evidence” by trying CPR on his daughter’s body, but that wouldn’t have introduced the DNA that was found under her fingernails and in her underwear.
I got this quote from the Crime Library article that I linked to above:
Well, yeah, that’s why the cops don’t ask loved ones to help with crime scenes. The cops are the ones who fucked up by asking John and Fleet White to help look. John Ramsey behaved like a normal father wanting to protect his child–he shouldn’t have been allowed to find her to begin with.
Obviously, the ransom note was a clumsy, bullshit attempt at misderection, whoever wrote it, but I can see where a perp might simply panic and forget it was there and/or simpy want to cut his losses and flee if he accidentally killed the kid before he wanted to.
I imagine I’d be in heavy discussion with investigators on how to proceed…and if I did think of a special place that she could be that the cops hadn’t looked (because all 12 of them came and told you they hadn’t looked in that place)…I’d mention it and go down there with officers in tow.
No, the cops didn’t have to report to JR where they had and hadn’t looked, he KNEW they hadn’t looked there. Him finding the body’s hiding place and being the first person to reach the body doesn’t seem random.
No. The family has been officially cleared. Anything else is in your own imagination. The DNA evdience cannot just be handwaved away because you are personally desperate to believe (without a shred of evidence) that the parents are the perps.
No, they haven’t. Mary Lacy is out of office - anything she might have said in a letter to the family doesn’t mean squat. It holds the same weight as OJ Simpson saying he is going to spend the rest of his life looking for the real killers.
I live in Boulder and have friends in the police force and in the DA’s office. It is not in my imagination.
But how would any of us know how we’d respond? It’s an abnormal situation. I don’t think John Ramsey did anything all that odd, especially since he was asked by the police to help search. Is it so hard to believe he wouldn’t be rationale enough to sit down and have a logical discussion with cops but might think randomly, “Oh, maybe she’s in that little room down in the basement.”
That’s not a cite. As the officiual record stands, the Rmaseys are cleared. The DNA is irrefutable, and I personally don’t give shit what the moron cops in Boulder think. They’re the ones who fucked this case up, and then wasted years going after the wrong people in the first place.
The DNA is what is is, man, no matter what the cops want to be true.
According to Cazzle’s cite, it’s not even true that he just suddenly thought of a space and “jumped up.” He was searching the basement with a friend upon advice of the police, and they found her in the third room they looked in.
Yeah but that doesn’t explain why they didn’t take the body, even if it was misdirection. You’ve spent the time writing the note, if you intended to kill her either way you’re still better off buying some time with the police using their resources to investigate a kidnapping than a murder. Or at least in your own head you were better off, otherwise you wouldn’t have written a note, you just would have abducted her.
I’m just having problems with the intruder being such a dunce, yet having intimate knowledge of the finances (I think $118,000 is too much of a coincidence) and movements of the family. Surely if it was a family friend (and it would have to be a close one) the police would have investigated him and tested his DNA.
If it wasn’t then it would have to be someone with sufficient intelligence to monitor the family and discover financial information about them, why would someone who had so much previous restraint go and bugger the whole thing up?
No, not really. The DNA only indicates one additional person she was in contact with in the hours before her death besides her immediate family.
Dude, you are letting your conviction that the Ramsey are clean cover all other possibilities with flecks of your spittle. You are not only not open to other possibilities, you are rabid in support of your claim. Take a step back. You may still come to the same conclusion, but you will sound a little less, if I may, crazy.
They are innocent until proven guilty, and they have been cleared as suspects by the Boulder DA’s office (a position which has not been reversed by said office, despite Lamar’s personal guarantees).
Unless some evidence can be shown that the source of the DNA on the body was not the only perp, then I can see no reason to keep insisting that the parents (who are VICTIMS of this crime) must prove their own innocence.
Which part do you think is buggered up? I think the evidence is consistent with a psychopath intruder (serial killer type sicko) who intended to kill her and just wrote that note as a ruse. If it was intended as a real ransom note, why make it so long and meandering? It reads like something that some demented person wrote for kicks. And it accomplished the goal of creating hours of chaos and contamination of the crime scene.
I’m still struck at how the parents adopted a defensive posture of (seemingly) the most minimal possible cooperation with the police very soon after the investigation initiated. The doors shut *so *fast on working with the police it was astounding. Even given “rich” people’s tendency to lawyer up most wealthy families would (I think) cooperate with e police far more than the Ramsey’s did if they had a child that was murdered. That, and the weirdness of the ransom note make it look like it was something the Ramsey’s cobbled together as a clumsy CYA.
In weighing the possibility that some sociopath with intimate knowledge of the Ramsey family and their finances did swoop in and do all this vs the possibility that this was some inter-family argument or altercation gone horribly wrong, I think my money is still (overall) on the family altercation and more specifically on her brother as the murderer. Even small kids can be ferociously strong when angry. If either parent had done it I don’t think they would have covered for each other. The only way it all makes sense re the Ramsey’s overall behavior is if was her brother.
I’m not saying I think it’s a real ransom note, I think from the language and tone of the whole thing it’s pretty obviously not.
I’m just saying I think you’d have to be in possession of a crystal ball to think leaving a sample of your hand writing was going to aid your evasion of police, rather hamper it.
But what about the DNA under her fingernails that matched the DNA on her underwear? It didn’t match Burke Ramsey or any of the Ramseys for that matter.
Also, there was evidence of sexual molestation. Though some believe the killer did that after death to make it look like it was sex related crime–I guess one of the Ramseys under that theory could have done that to draw attention away from it being one of them. Do you really think they would, though?
Now I’m confused. If you think it wasn’t a real ransom note, why would it be left there, other than to confuse the investigation? For fun? (possible) Something else?