What? No Frddy vs. Jason thread? *SPOILERS*

Cafe Society
1

OK, I admit that I say this movie last night, and I also admit that I was very excited to do so…but I was kinda dissapointed, and here’s a few reasons why:

[spoiler]The acting was HORRIBLE!! Freddy was the best among them! And that girl from Destiny’s Child made me cringe with EVERY LINE! I relaize they were going for the stereotypical “ghetto” girl, but it was too forced. And the script itself was not a gem, either. I mean, I didn’t expect much, and I got even less than that. Lines such as:
“Wait a minute…Freddy was killed with fire, Jason was killed with water…how can we use that against them?” WTF? Who says that? And the one thing that annoyed me more than anything else:

THE SHOCKWAVE FROM THE PROPANE! Since when does propane explode with a blue wave of force? Christ! Here’s a tip for the F X guys: Don’t take tips from the special edition of Star Wars, ok?

Now on to the stuff I liked:
The intro. I have never seen any of the Nightmare movies, so it was actually nice to to find out the backstory to Freddy, and the whole concepot of getting the naked girl skinny dipping out of the way in the first ten minutes was brilliant.

Some of the shots were pretty good, too. The cinematograhper (sp?) deserves credit. The one with Freddy jumping out of the water was amazing, and Jason walking out of the lake was pretty good, too.

Questions left unaswered: Who actually won? As my friend put it, “Jason walked out of the lake with Freddy’s head! He clearly won!” Wheras I say, since Freddy winked, he won, cause he’s not actually dead, just biding his time before he kills (well, not kill, since both are essentially immortal, but you get the idea) Jason.[/spoiler]

2

A question. Are their still teens getting naked for no reason? Or is that Horror movie trait dead now that the production companies are looking for more ‘well known’ actors who probably would never disrobe in front of the camera?

3

You know that the guy who directed this is also responsible for Bride of Chuckie, don’t you?

4

Yeah, the’re still getting naked for no particular reason. And yeah, they all look like they got their silicone implants from the same cosmetic surgeon.

God, the whole movie was so slapschticky I expect F and J to fight Adam West and Burt Ward next time around!

5

Just got back and here’s my own review of the film. First the non-spoilery stuff:

On a scale of one to four, with one being blah and four being Holy Shit!** the first two thirds of this film are definately one-star material all the way. The plot exists solely to Freddy and Jason interacting, but that doesn’t matter because that no more or less than expected. The characters are all uninteresting nonentities who mostly exist just to get stabbed, but that’s nothing new or unexpected either. What was unexpected is that none of Jason’s killings or Freddy’s dream sequences with the exception of the stuff involving at the beginning and end of the film are in the least bit creative or original. Jason is all hack’em up, hack’em up, machete, machete. Freddy’s bits cover ground gone over time and time again in previous films: the boiler room, Freddy’s house, the little girls with their creepy jump-rope song, etc. Each does get one interesting bit after repeatedly and viciously stabbing one victim in the back as he lay in bed, Jason then folds him up in the bed like a sandwhich, and there’s a cool dream sequence where Freddy appears to a Jason Mewes wannabe stoner character in the form of a hookah-smoking caterpillar but it’s far too little far too late.

Thankfully the film picks up in a major way in the final act as we finally get down to the meat of the matter, the pure hack ‘n’ slashy goodness of a full-on no-holds-barred F vs. J slugfest, and for a few minutes there all is good and right in the world as we’re treated to as fine a display of mutual ass-kickery with occasional gore as I’ve ever seen. [spoiler]The bit in the dream world with Freddy gleefully exploiting Jason’s troubled past, reducing him to the frieghtened and cowering child within, was especially effective.[/spoilers]

[spoilers]Unfortunately those boring ass non-Freddy and Jason meat puppets refuse to go away. A couple of them survive and get into the middle of the big grudge match, ensuring that no definate conclusion is in the offing. Though the film ends with the arresting image of Jason emerging from the waters of Crystal Lake holding Freddy’s decapitated head (a neat trick with no hair to hold on to) Freddy’s head quite literally tips a wink to the audience, so there is no winner, though Frddy definately dished out more ass-whoop than Jason, even in the real world. Freddy totally owning Jason in the middle of an abandoned construction site is the best sequence in the entire film.[/spoiler]

On whole, I’d give this film two and a half stars. A relatively entertaining time at the movies for slasher fans, mainly for the big Freddy vs. Jason fight, but if you’re only a casual fan, I’d suggest giving this one a miss.

6

Actually I’ve heard rumors suggesting Micheal Myers will figure into the next installment, and with the Texas Chainsaw Massacre franchise apparently now under New Line’s control I wouldn’t rule out an appearance by Leatherface either.

7

For a movie that was essentially an answer to a geeky argument about two horror francises that had both long ago descended into cheesy self-parody, it was brilliant.

Complaining about bad acting, or plot holes (to a certain extent) is like arguing about unrealistic conflict dynamics in the WWE. You’re missing the point. It’s a movie made for one prupose: to watch a guy in a sweater with knives on his fingers go toe-to-toe with a disgruntled goalie with a machete. And by the criteria, it satisfied.

Although I admit, the Jason Mewes wannabe and not-Beyonce were grating, especially when she was mocking Freddie. C’mon! As is often the case in these movies, the victims talked too much. Character development is imporant in other genres, but here, we don’t care who you are, but how you die. The subplot with the heroine’s father and boyfriend was also too drawn out and unnecessary.

Still, it was a masterpiece of the Dead Teenager genre. The best I’ve seen since the first Scream. The setup, how these two came together and why they’re in conflict, was very well done, and both monsters had great characterisationa nd a proper amount of menace.

Was it scary? Not hardly.
Was it, in a general asthetic sense “good”? Eh. Maybe.
Was it entertaining? Hells yes!

As for the ending: It ended the only way it could. A draw, with enough so that partisans on both sides could claim victory. Me, I say Freddy won. He dominated, of couse, in the dreaming, and was holding his own in the physical plane until he was blown up, then distracted by, then finished off by the meddling kids. Jason, it should be noted, “died” without need of a third party delivering the coup de grace. Yes, he was in fewer pieces when the credits rolled, but Freddy’s come back from worse.

Oh, and yes. There is gratuitous nudity which, of course, leads to certain death.

As for a sequel, Mike Myers, while scary as hell, is redundant with Jason around. Leatherface ain’t nothing without the rest of his family (Did I see Michael “Armageddon” Bay’s name attatched to the credits for the new TCM? Say it isn’t so! I’m willing to tolerate cheese but even I have limits!). No. The sequel can only have one addition to the mix.

I think you know who I’m talking about.
Jason vs. Freddy

vs. Bruce Campbell.

That would be so sweet.

8

Non-Beyonce dissing the Fredster was annoying, though it did set up one of the biggest laughs in the film

Any, it’s not bad acting or paper-thin plottage that bothered me, it’s that Jason’s murders and Freddy’s dream sequences, the meat-and-potatoes of these two franchises, are for the first two-thirds of the film totally covered ground. Those first two acts of the film were boring and in a genre where bad acting and non-enistent plots are expected, being boring is the only real cime.

And you’re totally right about the point of the movie, too bad so little of the film actually focused on that point.

Admittedly, and entire hour and a half of Freddy and Jason slugging it out would have gotten old fast, but that’s no excuse for the first 2/3 being a boring retread.

9

As far as other movie maniacs horning in on the action is concerned, I actually had an idea for a film centering around a hell-based tournament of movie slashers, with almost the entire film focusing on what we wanna see: famous movie killers whuppin’ on each other.

Each battleground would also be littered with the usual cannon-fodder, just to get some good ol’ fashioned killin’ in with our fight-night action.

Such a film could actually be pretty cool I think. It’d also make an awesome fighting game.

10

I was a little disappointed, though there were some parts that I liked.

[spoiler]I didn’t like the way Jason looked, I really wish they’d stuck with Kane Hodder. I didn’t like the fact that Jason had this zombie-mullet thing going (since he didn’t have any hair left in the latter Friday the 13th movies) and there was too much focus on his eyes. One thing I found Jason appealing was that he had a soulless appearance- you see his hockey mask but there are no visible eyes inside the eye holes, just darkness. This to me felt ‘ghostly’ while they way the made Jason in this movie was more ‘zombie’.

I did like the fight scenes, especially the one in the Boiler Room where Freddy gave Jason a telekinetic pelvic thrust into the pipes. It would have been cool if they had shown Freddy seeking out Jason in hell, though.[/spoiler]

11

I’ve actually heard a rumor this is already in the works: Ash vs. Freddy vs. Jason. But nothing is official, and Sam Raimi and Bruce Campbell haven’t commented. I don’t like horror/slasher/gore movies and won’t bother with this F vs. J, but I’m a big Bruce Campbell mark, and even I would see that movie.

12

With a movie like this I really don’t care about spoilers so does anyone feel like explaining to me how exactly freddy & Jason hook up?

How did they end up in the same neighborhood? Does Jason dream? Does Freddy come to the physical plane & encounter Jason?

I can see how Jason would want to kill Freddy, he wants to kill just about everybody he encounters. What made Freddy want to go after Jason? I thought Freddy liked to go after more or less innocent teenagers.

13

Well, levdrakon, I’ll explain as best I can.

The movie opens with some exposition by Freddy. The gist is, Freddy was pissed because the Elm Street kids have forgotten him. And since no one fears him anymore, he’s too weak to invade dreams and kill people.

So, somewhere in hell, Freddy finds Jason. Freddy resurrects Jason in the physical world (or, more likely, strikes a deal with his hosts to have Jason resurrected) to do some killin’. Freddy figures that the deaths will be blamed on him (Freddy), people will fear him again, and he’ll then have the strength to do some murderin’ of his own.

What made Freddy want to go after Jason is, Jason turned out to be a bit more difficult to control than he figured. Jason just keeps on killin’ kids, which means that kills are being stolen from Freddy. So, Freddy realizes, he’s gotta take this Jason feller out before there’s no one left for him to kill.

Since “spoiler” is in the title, I didn’t bother to put any of this in spoiler boxes. If someone comes into a thread with “spoiler” in the title and gets all huffy about spoilers therein, well, that’s the way the cookie crumbles.

14

I actually saw a sneak preview of it last week, and I found it to be absolutely great!! I mean, yeah, the acting sucked, the plot was rather lame, and there really wasn’t much to it, but I really liked the way they tied the two of them in together, and the fights between the two of them were absolutely awesome!

I admit, Freddy didn’t do anything really fantastic, which made me a little sad. I did like the caterpillar bit, but I think it would have been perfect if, instead of just blowing a puff of smoke in his face, he blew out a word, like “Boo” or something. You know, to make the reference really hit home.

One of my favorite bits is that, after watching Jason wander around the rave hacking people apart, the kids jump in the van, hightale it out of there, and then just drop everyone off at home like it’s not big deal. “Man, can you believe he just killed all those people while on FIRE? This is terrible…well, see you at school tomorrow!” What the fuck was THAT?!?!

I also love the whole bit with Jason’s dream how they try to make Jason out to be a sympothetic “victim”. Awww, poor baby was made fun of by the other kids for being a freak…his ruthless killing sprees really aren’t his fault, we should help him." I was half expecting there to be a touching moment between Jason and the main chick where he saves her and doesn’t kill her because he remembers her trying to help him in his dreams while he’s drowning.

But in the end, the fight was a draw. Unless we go by points, in which case, Freddy kicked Jason’s ass ten times till next Tuesday!

As for a sequel starring Ash, all I can say is “Ain’t gonna happen!” Aside from the occassional video game voiceover, Bruce is done with the part of Ash. Do you really think Evil Dead 4 hasn’t come out because there’s not enough of a fan base? Nope! It’s because Bruce is sick of being Ash. Go check out his website and read around, you’ll see it plain as day.

15

“As is often the case in these movies, the victims talked too much. Character development is imporant in other genres, but here, we don’t care who you are, but how you die.”

And that is the genius of the Final Destination movies! :slight_smile:

16

I thought the whole “talking too much” was supposed to be tongue-in-cheek. Maybe I’m reading too much into the movie (which I loved- it wasn’t amazing, more violent than scary, but just as I expected it to be), but everyone was laughing out loud when the kids were sitting around, figuring out what happened (“Gosh, Freddy must have sent Jason to Elm Street to kill for him, etc.” plus the aforementioned water and fire bit). And while I really don’t care for horror flic nudity, that over-the-top naked chick at the beginning was classic! And the scene where Kia is about to give Jason mouth-to-mouth? Who came up with that one?
Favourite line, by far,


That goalie was pissed!

17

Did anyone else notice the amazing adjustable cleavage of the main female character? In some shots they are one size, in the next seen they are either larger or smaller. No rhyme or reason.

All in all it was a great movie. Better than I expected actually.

18

Draw? What’s all this talk of a draw? Much as I wanted Fred to win, IIRC he really had no chance in hell at the end.

As I remember it, by the end of the fight he had been literally diarmed and had gotten impaled by his own claws and arm. The only reason the kids delivered the finishing blow was because Jason decided to go for a swim and let the kids have the glory.

Way I see it, if we’re going by style points then Freddy wins hands down. If we’re going by “most body parts still attached to your body at the end of the fight” Jason wins by two arms, two hands, and six fingers.

Of course it would’ve all been a moot point if Freddy didn’t spend so much time dicking around when Jason was snoozin’.

19

At the risk of being too much of a horror fanboy…

… that movie fucking owned.

I loved the tounge-in-cheek opening with the girl skinny dipping. In fact, I thought this movie poked fun at itself a lot with the stereotypical characters (nerdy guy, ghetto girl, stoner) and situations (rave in the middle of a cornfield), and I absolutely loved it.

About all I wanted from this movie was for it to earn its R rating with some cool, gory teen deaths (folding bed! flaming jason rave slaughter!!) and a brutal throwdown between the two stars, and I got everything I wanted and then some. Damn but that was cool. Easily the most fun movie I’ve seen all summer.

And Jason won, so nyeh :wink:

20

Damn straight, Jason won!

My favorite line: Freddy’s frustrated, “Why won’t you DIE?!”