Just curious. And if you don’t think there is such a thing as a problem drinker, just alcoholics, by all means tell me why.
You can abuse alcohol without being an alcoholic. For example a High School friend of mine was definitely a “problem drinker.” When I would come home for summers and such he would pretty much be the same every time–consistently drunk. We were 18 years to 21 years old so it wasn’t unusual for him to be a bit of an abuser of alcohol. Young adults, especially at that age, often abuse alcohol more or less as part of their socialization.
However four or five years later when I had graduated from the academy and most of my other High School friends had either graduated college or had settled down into real careers he was still drinking like he had at 18/19 years old, in fact he was drinking more. Most of his friends had moved on (I grew up in an area where there weren’t a lot of job opportunities so it was uncommon for people to stay there into adulthood) and he had taken to drinking more and more alone or in bars. He lived with his parents who essentially were supporting him like a child.
Then one day he started dating a woman and shortly later he had a full time job and got married. Fast forward to today, decades later, and he’s a fully normal, middle class guy. He drinks socially but never like he did when we were kids.
He was basically a guy who early in life just never really made much of himself for various reasons, and he had parents willing to fund his lifestyle so when all his friends grew up and moved on he just kept going as he had always gone.
The key is once he decided he wanted more from life he quit drinking like he did in the past no real problem. Key is he never quit drinking, he still drinks socially just like most anyone else. He just simply made the decision to stop being a big drunk wastrel.
Alcoholics can never make a decision like that because alcoholics, through no amount of willpower, can ever just take a drink and leave it. Alcoholics can’t drink socially and they usually can’t quit at all without significant help.
From an outside observer my friend may have looked like an alcoholic. In fact he appeared to be a lot worse off than say, my uncle who was a successful business owner but a hopeless alcoholic. But the truth was much different, my friend was simply engaged in stupid behavior that he had the ability to stop when he chose to stop it. My uncle was very good at masking his drinking from the community but he was as serious an alcoholic as you could find. One drink never was one drink, it always lead to more, and he was totally incapable of just saying “I’m done drinking too much, I’ll just have a little drink now and again.” For him, little drinks always became more drinks which became more drinks.
I’m not a professional or anything but that’s just my observation of two people close to me that I think meet the definitions and it seems consistent with what I’ve read on the topic.
I don’t make much of a distinction but it depends on your terminology. I’d distinguish clearly between a heavy drinker and an alcoholic - I come from a fairly boozy Anglo-Irish family and have relatives of both stripes. Problem drinker to me is someone who is an alcoholic to a greater or lesser degree - I know plenty of heavy drinkers who I wouldn’t class as having a problem with alcohol.
It’s hard to generalise - different cultures, different phraseology etc.
An alcoholic is an addict. A problem drinker isn’t, but may be heading in that direction.
Hm. Martin Hyde, did your uncle do that thing of only drinking on certain days (“I only drink on weekends!”) or not drinking on certain days (“I never drink the night before a big presentation!”)? That’s kind of a sign of alcoholism, isn’t it, as opposed to a problem? Like, if you have to compartmentalize your drinking, then you’re not in control of it? ETA: And did your friend ever do anything like that – designating specific drinking times?
Usually a very pissed-off bartender.
I don’t really have an answer, but in AA someone told me of a rough and ready test to see if I was an alcoholic or problem drinker. It wasn’t a matter of motivation; the fact that I voluntarily started to go to AA meetings spoke to my motivation.
He said to promise myself that I would have two drinks each day, and no more. If I was an alcoholic, I would soon invent a reason why this was a stupid test, and tell myself that three or more drinks would be OK. Soon after that, of course, I’d be right back to where I was.
The two drink minimum, rather than total abstinence, is important. I could white-knuckle going with no alcohol for nine months at a time, but there was no way I could have two drinks a day and keep it there for very long. For other beverages with which I might overindulge (such as Dr. Pepper or iced tea), this wouldn’t be a problem.
I’ve always distinguished the terms as follows:
Alcoholic = Physically dependent on alcohol, i.e., will experience physiological withdrawal if he or she does not consume alcohol.
Problem drinker - irresponsible in his or her consumption of alcohol such that his or her behavior while drinking has obvious negative consequences for him- or herself or others (a good example would be failing to moderate one’s drinking at a party, then insisting on driving home and getting in an accident).
The two terms aren’t by any means mutually exclusive or inclusive.
In psychiatric terminology, we don’t use the word “alcoholic”, as it has no clearly defined definition. Likewise for “problem drinking”; I think in common usage these terms are used fairly interchangably.
We talk about “alcohol (or fill in your favorite drug) dependence”, which would roughly correspond to “alcoholism” and is defined basically by a loss of control over drinking. One becomes unable to refrain from drinking in inappropriate situations, or to limit the number of drinks consumed once you start. WRT to what Rilchiam said, I guess you could describe someone who* can* control their drinking, but has to exert a great deal of mental effort in order to do so, as having a less advanced form of dependence, or possibly as not being dependent but being at high risk for becoming so in the future.
Alcohol “abuse” is defined as a consistent pattern of getting into trouble (ie having “problems”) relating to drinking; fights, DUIs, losing relationships, etc. It doesn’t have the element of compulsive drinking implied by “dependence”, and the prognosis is generally better. Note that these diagnoses can’t co-occur, as someone who meets criteria for dependence will pretty much automatically also qualify for abuse, but not vice versa.
I’ve danced around this shrub before, and it always came out like this thread has, so far. No two replies quite match up.
I think it’s vital, though, to point out that the alcoholics are the ones who go to the meetings.
I would be remiss in failing to cite Ambrose Bierce’s classic definition of an alcoholic as
“Someone you don’t like who drinks as much as you do”.
Reminded me of this:
I was a problem drinker. My wife is an alcoholic. She always will be, she is just in a 18 year 364 day period of remission, if you will. I no longer am (with alcohol anyway, just don’t give me your iced tea to hold or it is going bye-bye). I decided to stop way back in Feb 2002, drank everything I had in my apartment (not much) one night, and switched to Sprite until the physical habit of having a cold can in my hand after work waned. Never felt the need to drink alcohol, or drank when nobody I knew was around, or felt that if I DID drink I would be in personal trouble. I drank a lot when I did, partial to brewpubs. I rationalized drinking less from time to time, gave up domestic beer for Lent one year so it would cost more and I’d drink less, that sort of thing. I thought I was an alcoholic, and was quite relieved was I found I wasn’t.
One of my friends was a serious problem drinker.
I’ve seen him do 10-15 strong gins and tonic in a four hour period. It was probably only at #12 that he started to show drunk.
That said, last year he got tagged with a DUI. Kind of half-wrecked his life, but fortunately he didn’t hurt anyone. That was enough for him to swear off alcohol forever.
He didn’t really struggle with it. He still goes to the bar (!). Sometimes I go with him. Sure enough, he’s perfectly happy drinking iced tea.
The bar is his social outlet; drinking was always coincidental. He just got way too good at it.
This I think is a difference between a problem drinker and an alcoholic - for an alcoholic there’s a dependence and alcohol is the main focus. A problem drinker is maybe just not good at following limits once the drinking starts.
As an alcoholic, once I start drinking, I can no longer accurately predict what will happen or where I will end up, nor can I stop until I run out or pass out.
People who are not alcoholics can choose to drink or not, can drink one or ten, can set a goal (2 beers tonight) and stick to it.
YMMV, as always. I have a feeling this will end up in IMHO…
Edit- the late Father Joseph Martin used to say “If alcohol is causing problems, it’s a problem. If it causes trouble, then it’s trouble.” I always say that if you’re wondering whether or not you’re an alcoholic, then you probably are, because normal people don’t think that! 
Are you sure he’s drinking alcohol, and not just elaborately faking with ginger ale and the like?
What kind of drinker am I? I’ve been trying to figure this out for years. Once I start drinking, I don’t stop for anything. If I drink one beer, I’m automatically locked into drinking ‘til I’m blotto. However, I only do this about four times a year—usually my birthday, New Year’s Eve, and perhaps one or two other random days during the year. Other than that, I abstain completely. So where do I fit in the scheme of things?
How old are you? In my case, I started out with my birthday and New Years, but by the time I was 30, I was celebrating Juneteenth and **Maundy Thursday. ** For an alcoholic, every day is a holiday.
47—halfway to older than dirt. Been like this since my mid-twenties.
Binge alcoholic? But it’s pretty much a self-diagnosis, so if you don’t think it’s a problem, then there you go…