To continue this hijack… from post #5 on.
Early life, family, during his ministry. Pick any or all.
Jesus, or at least his family, was poor.
As No Clue Boy already mentioned Mary and Joseph were poor enough to be able to legitimately use a dove as a sacrifice and not a sheep. At the very best that made them lower middle class.
He and his father were carpenters. Note that the word used is equally translatable as intinerant labourers. They may well have been workers of wood, but equally they could have been farm labourers, cleaners or held other semi-skilled positions. Carpenters at the time were not generally the skilled craftsmen of the later medieval periods. They were just handymen with sufficient skill to do basic work such as erecting poles, thatching etc. Consider that at the time the amount of timber was limited, and so was the amount of skilled work for ‘carpenters’. A carpenter at that time was landless and semi-skilled man. Honest but clearly wealthy since he could not afford land of his own.
He came from Nazareth, which is quite clearly a centre of destitution and rural hickness. Not a likely centre for great wealth. As far as the location can be determined the area in question was quite poverty stricken at the time, which accounts in no small part for the early popularity of Jesus’ messages of forgiving debts, paradise where no-one paid rent etc.
The gospels themselves suggest intimate familiarity with the tribulations of the poor. There are endless parables about struggling to find food, being in debt etc. Although this could just be an attempt to make the message friendly to the poor and meek, it does provide some corroboration.
When Jesus is confronted early in his ministry he is scorned but people who know his background. Isn’t this Jesus out of Nazareth? Isn’t his father a carpenter? Aren’t his brothers nobodies? Those are not the words you would expect if his family were well-to-do.
Yes Jesus had an expensive robe. But remember that at this time he had followers, at least some of them wealthy including tax collectors, lawyers and a Roman military officer of some rank. These followers furnished Jesus with high grade oil for his feet and a memorial tomb, both expensive items in that day. Indeed a point is made in one Gospel that Jesus willingly accepted expensive gifts given in the name of his kingdom. It seems entirely likely that his robe was also a gift befitting a king bestowed by a follower.
I can’t name book/chapter/verse (I’m pretty sure it’s in Luke, though) because I’m on my way to work, but I know that at some point the New Testament mentions that Jesus’ ministry was in some part financed by rich women. I imagine that, at the very least, they would have supplied his garments and some travelling money (Judas is mentioned as being the treasurer a couple of times).
OTOH, another verse mentions him having to pick grains that grew on the sides of the roads in order to eat, so at times in his ministry he was near starvation. Which means that the financial backing from the rich women may have dried up for one reason or another.
It always puzzles me that Jesus could read and write if he was so poor in his youth. I don’t think they had public education in those days.
No, they didn’t. In that day & age, fathers were expected nay commanded to teach their sons to read & write, which means that Jesus learned to read & write at Joseph’s knee, and Joseph learned to read & write at his father’s knee, and so on.
Mary & Joseph were poor when in Bethlehem, having to resort to the dove sacrifice at the Temple purification, but they DID come into some wealth with the Magi’s gifts. Also, once in Nazareth, when they had rejoined their families, they had time to settle down, establish Joseph’s business, have six more kids (4 sons Jacob/James, Simon, Judah/s, & Joses and at least two sisters). Jesus probably had a home in Nazareth, perhaps another in Capernaum. I doubt the family was either impoverished or affluent, they probably were middle-class, on varying ends of it depending on the situation. When JC left home, the brothers likely took over the business. JC’s having a fine unseamed robe as his only “possession” when executed only means he didn’t carry a lot of wealth around- doesn’t refer to what he may have had access to at home base. Finally, before someone quotes his words “Foxes have holes, birds have nests but the Son of Man has no where to lay his head”, those words were spoken when JC coundn’t find a place to stay in Samaria when they found he was on his way to Jerusalem.
Going in line with the literacy question, how did he become such a learned scholar (i.e., of the scriptures)? Seems an unlikely thing for a poor boy from the sticks.
C. Ryan’s book “The Longest Day” gives several incidents of planes deliberately flying so low to avoid AA that the jumpers’ chutes didn’t have time to fully open- with ensuing deadly effects.
Flying as low as possible without hitting hills has been a useful strategy for a long time. It is still in use with modern stealth craft which use computerized systems to guide the craft thru notches in ridges and such. But they don’t carry paratroopers.
Aggghhhhhhh! Wrong thread!
Sorry.
Well…either you aren’t a christian, then I’m not sure why you would believe that small details in the myths contained in the sacred book of this religion are reliable (that Jesus was the son of a carpenter, that he was a learned scholar…), and the question is essentially pointless, either you’re a christian, then, since Jesus is god, it should come as no surprise that he would have had a good grasp of (his own) scriptures.
What would Jesus fly?
No, I’m not a Christian, but I am a writer, and always interested in seeing stories that have internal consistency, whether it’s the Bible or Lord of the Rings.