She served her time, it’s done, and nobody really gives a shit anymore. A pardon would have no effect that I can see.
It’s one of the few things Trump can do without his advisors looking at him sideways, so he’s going to goddamn do it.
Also, you’re falling down the rabbit hole of trying to make sense of Trump’s activities. That leads nowhere good (for your mental health).
She was convicted of obstructing justice in a federal investigation. It sends a message to others that if the president notices that you were convicted of obstruction of justice and he likes you, he will likely give you a pardon too.
Depending on the state she may have lost her right to vote (a lot of states prohibit felons from voting). If so, she would now regain the right.
Financially she could benefit (a lot of companies wouldn’t want to advertise with someone who is a felon for public relations reasons).
She is famous, she’s got money and she isn’t liberal.
Ding, ding, ding!
She was convicted of a felony. That means in many states she is not allowed to vote. It means she cannot own firearms. In many school districts that means she can not act as a chaperone on a field trip or volunteer in a classroom. Her ability to travel outside the US is restricted. Depending on what state she lives in or where she works there may well be additional restrictions.
A pardon can remove those restrictions.
So while it might not matter to YOU, it might well matter to her. In reality, in the US when you’re convicted of a felony it’s never “done”, there are penalties that continue for life.
Felony convictions are a bit like contracting herpes. They are the gift that keeps on giving. There are lifetime legal consequences of being a convicted felon that remain after the punishment is over.
I assume it removes any SEC restrictions too? Like boards and running public companies?
I’m sure this figures into it.
I’m not certain and I don’t want to research or offer an opinion. The pardon is understood to apply only to criminal penalties, not civil penalties. I believe that director and officer bars can be imposed either as criminal penalties or civil penalties. The civil penalties themselves can either be a collateral consequence of a criminal conviction or they can be the result of separate civil actions. So, relevant factors might include the type of action in which her penalties were imposed and upon what basis.
As I’ve pointed out in other threads. . .While felons do lose the right to vote in all but 2 states (ME, VT), all but 9 (AL. DE, MS, NV, TN, WY, FL, IA, KY) automatically restore enfranchisement at some point, and those 9 have procedures for petition to regain your rights.
So a pardon is not necessary to vote.
mc
As I understood it a convicted felon cannot be the executive or a board member(?) of a public company. (So, a problem she shared with “Lord” Black of Crossharbor) Martha was convicted of obstruction but not, if I recall, of insider trading. there was insufficient evidence of that. (Thus bearing out Nixon’s observation of the Chambers case that “in the end, you get them on the cover-up not the original crime.” he was very prescient.)
I think it might be ever more self centered than this.
I think he wants to get the public used to the idea that campaign finance laws, obstruction of justice, lying to officials, (crimes he may have committed) are not “real” crimes. By pardoning people convicted of them, I think it diminishes their seriousness in the public eye.
This is the correct answer.
That said if I was a person with the goods on Trump I would never withhold that information from the police. No way in hell am I trusting Trump to pardon me after the fact. He is as mercurial as they come and might decide to not pardon me because he didn’t like my mustache (if I had one).
Why people keep putting their faith in Trump is beyond me. Why someone would fall on their sword for him is truly bewildering.
The question is what’s the alternative.
The main guy said to be banking on a pardon from Trump is Manafort. The problem Manafort has is that he’s too high up to get a really good deal from the prosecutors. It’s not like they’re going to let him walk if he “cooperates”. He is likely going to have to serve serious time anyway. So he’s looking at either definite serious time if he pleads guilty to what he’s being accused of, versus a shot at beating the rap in court and then another shot at a pardon later if he doesn’t plead.
Why doesn’t Trump just pardon Manafort now and be done with it? Hell, issue pardons across the board and be done with it.
For any other president the answer would be the political cost would be too high but that has never bothered Trump and indeed he seems to revel in doing the things he “shouldn’t” do.
I cannot see how he could be charged with obstruction of justice either. This is a power granted to him by the constitution. I can’t see how exercising that power could be punished by anything other than impeachment.
A lifetime supply of Christmas cookies?
God. I’m confused. I’d heard she’d given up on appeals back then and went to jail because she was a John Kerry supporter, and when he didn’t win, and she lost all hope of pardon, she might as well serve time.
Seriously, I always used her (in my mind) as a prime example of the hardcore lib attitude – “It’s not fascism when our side does it.”
Now she’s a conservative? Dangit. What’s with people, changing their point of view over time? Makes my pigeonhole worldview so difficult to maintain.
Only if the urge strikes him. I doubt if pardoning Manafort is an emotional issue for him, and I don’t see what’s in it for him to do it now vs later.
How is that different than things like firing Comey etc.? - these are also constitutional powers. What you’re saying is essentially the argument of Dershowitz et al who argue that none of this can be obstruction for this exact reason. But others argue that even executing a constitutionally granted power can be obstruction if done for the purpose of obstructing justice.
Martha Stewart: I’m not a Republican
That said, your story’s timeline doesn’t fit. She went to prison on October 8 2004, before the election.
Move to Great Debates.
Colibri
General Questions Moderator