I suppose I should be clear about this. I don’t really have much of a problem with Jeeps (or Blazers, or Explorers). My all steel SVX, at 3700 pounds has a history of doing very well against a 3100 pound Cherokee. Even the smallest of my cars would stand up well to that class of vehicle.
However, when you look as the 8000 pound Excursion, or even the 5500 pound Tahoe, we are both in some serious trouble.
Imagine the physics of a car weighing two and a half times what yours does (yours, not mine) running a stop light and sideswiping you. That doesn’t scare you? Even a little bit?
You can have an enourmous variety of vehicle styles without ever breaking 4000 pounds. 4 ton passenger cars are just ridiculous.
Well I did comment on it. Hope that’s o.k. with you. As I see it, the problem isn’t really people like you who need SUVs, it’s people who buy them just to drive around on the freeway because they think they’re “cool”.
Sorry, I don’t know what you mean by that.
Well it’s not a hypothesis, it’s a fact. I can’t give you a handy-dandy internet link because it’s in the book I cited. The author makes that point that SUVs do not protect their passengers any better than cars do for the most part. The few types of accidents where SUVs do fare better statistically than cars are negated by the SUVs higher likelihood of rolling over. The author cites a great deal of evidence in the form of crash statistics.
If you’re interested in the numbers: SUVs roll over 5 times per 100 crashes
Pickups - 3.8 times per 100 crashes
Minivans - 2 times per 100
Cars - 1.7 times per 100
“The percentage of SUV owners who say they use their vehicles for actual off-road driving varies from 1 to 13 percent, depending on how the question is asked, executives at the big automotive marketing firms say. When market researchers press these people, most of them admit that their idea of off-road driving is to travel on any dirt or gravel road, even if that road is smoothly graded.”
Clearly, almost none of the people who buy SUVs actually need them.
No, I am admitting that when it comes to my family’s safety, your safety falls in a distant second place. Sorry, but you have every opportunity to buy a larger vehicle that I do.
My wife and I both have taken drving classes to manage the bulk and driving heft of our Tahoe. These were sponsored by our local insurance agent. I’ve done my part to be safe. the rest is up to you.
Imagine the physics of a tractor trailer running a stop light and sideswiping you.
Imagine the physics of morons on the road who like to cut off said tractor trailers and expect them to be able to stop.
There are lots and lots of big trucks on the road. Do you propose that they be taken off so you’ll feel safer? I mean, those trucks aren’t usually hauling anything that an entire fleet of minivans couldn’t haul.
Am I the only person on the road who is entirely comfortable sharing the road with semis? Maybe it’s because my father’s a trucker and I’ve grown up with them as both a passenger and an observer, but I can drive down the interstate with a fleet of tractor-trailers and feel perfectly safe. I can meet tractor-trailers at stop lights and feel perfectly safe. I am not intimidate by them, and I do not fear for my life as soon as I see one. If I can deal with tractor-trailers I imagine everyone else can deal with Humvees.
Many people are absolutely freaked by the big rigs. I grew up travelling across the US and got used to them at a very early age. I would guess that the folks who are afraid of SUVS, while they drive their '02 Specks probably wet themselves at the sight of a fully loaded Peterbilt or Mack sharing the road with them.
If not, they should, as the avergae semi is aleast 10 times bigger than my SUV.
I feel fairly safe amongst semis. The problems with semis aren’t the fault of the trucks or the drivers, usually. There are too many morons who think that a truck can stop on a dime, so they cut them off. And the other problem is even worse. Here in Ohio, trucks are forced to a speed limit (55) that’s ten miles below the speed limit for cars. The result? Constant traffic clusters where cars get bunched up while people traveling 65 get caught behind cars going 60 who are passing trucks going 55.
Add higher speeds and the mess escalates.
So, I don’t blame the trucks. I blame the idiotic law and the morons who can’t drive.
Well, sure- if you can tell me that is the only kind of accident that you’ll ever get in, fine. I’d rather be driving a Suburban than a Mini in a head on between the two myself. However, there are other types of accidents to consider (not to mention accident avoidance, which SUV are notorious for being bad at)- and overall- SUV’s are simply not that safe. Like I said- they are just a tad more safe that the average compact car, and nowhere near as safe as the average full sized car. So- if you are telling yourself that safety is one of the reasons for driving an SUV, you’re deluding yourself. And many other vehicles can be just as versatile. I’ll admit a 2seater sports car is not one of them!
Sure- if I was saying that. I’m not. What I am saying is that very very few NEED to own an SUV. If you drive off road, yes- otherwise- no. If you just admit you WANT to buy an SUV- well, then, that’s your choice here in America. But again- it’s not safer, and it won’t make your penis bigger. I don’t care WHAT the commercials show. For instance, those ads that show a guy ashamed to admit he drives a minivan- for gods sake, those are appealing straight to the “make your penis bigger” crowd.
Racinchikki- yep, indeed, I did read all your reasons- and driving on a muddy dirt road wasn’t one of them- nor was towing. You can buy a minivan or a station wagon the same size as your SUV. Of course, some of these get worse milage than some SUV’s- but overall they get better- esp as they have better streamlining, and that 4WD sucks milage. In fact, almost the only difference between most SUV and station wagons/minivans- is that the former have a 4WD and a truck body- which few dudes need. Some "SUV"s have neither- they just LOOK like an SUV. Fine, then, I guess.
John Mace hit it square on the head in his last post. You select your car based upon image , not need .
I don’t have a problem with Semi’s because in my experience, they are pretty good drivers. They are aware of those around them, and courtious to others (using turn signals when changing lanes, staying in thier appropriate lane based on their speed, etc). They do this for a living, so they are good at it.
SUV’s on the other hand are without fail my nemisis on the road. Block my view, totally unaware (the last 3 people who have started pulling into my lane when I was there have been SUV’s), bad at parking (taking up a space an a half because they couldn’t park right), etc. I am not saying the people are bad or anything. It just seems like SUV’s require a level of skill that many people who buy them don’t (yet) display.
The problem may be that many of the people buying them now, took their drivers test on a smaller vehicle. So they had prooven that they could drive a car (at 16), but now in their twenties, they are trying to drive cars they aren’t skilled enough to drive. Perhaps a re-test if you purchase a larger class of vehicle than you got your liscense on.
Again, there are many other reasons to buy an SUV besides going off road.
Maybe John buys his cars based on image, I sure don’t. And I don’t know anyone that would consider image over need. Image may be part of the equation, but need certainly comes first.
Name one where another vehicle type can’t do it with better gas milage, and likely with greater safety. Besides, of course- “image”, which you dismiss.
If you need large cargo capacity plus all or four wheel drive an SUV is what you NEED. If you need to haul a trailer, an SUV may be what you NEED. Going off-road is only a portion of what an SUV can do.
And bad driving is certainly not limited to SUVs. For years, I’ve complained about minivan drivers. (I never thought I’d read a thread where people are advocating everyone drive minivans.)
It isn’t a matter of there being ONE, it’s a matter of an SUV combining several functions into one vehicle. The large cargo capacity of a van plus 4 or all wheel drive plus (often) larger engines for more power.
Deep snow
Towing
And low-range, which I don’t necessarily use just for ‘jeeping’.
Lumber is easy to load in, and on my Pathfinder. Don’t know how well it would work in a minivan, but at least I don’t have to take out any seats.
Don’t need to haul lots of people, so the one thing that a mini-van is good for is useless to me.
The average minivan gets about 1 mile per-gallon then my Pathfinder.
As I see it, the problem isn’t really people like you who need SUVs, it’s people who buy them just to drive around on the freeway because they think they’re “cool”.
I don’t care WHAT the commercials show. For instance, those ads that show a guy ashamed to admit he drives a minivan- for gods sake, those are appealing straight to the “make your penis bigger” crowd.