The deal in Houston is that you can elect to tip a girl on stage or not; girls not on stage will either cruise by and check to see whether you want some company or you can ask a waitress to bring one over. You are not obligated to pay a dancer sitting with you for her time or drinks, but if you don’t ask for any dances within a few minutes, chances are she’ll be off to look for a paying customer.
Offical policy at these places is to fire a dancer caught doing something that might result in a prostitution bust (basically anything that involves genital or oral/genital contact) but, in my experience a significant fraction of Houston-area dancers may offer ‘extras’ at their discretion, and some managers will look the other way for a cut of the proceeds.
I haven’t gone many place outside Houston, but tried out a couple of Philly clubs one time just for, uh, ‘research’ purposes. In both, there was much less chance for conversation, and the dancers went round soliciting tips after each set; kind of put me off.
Well, you get the full range, really. A really large number are single mothers who have no other marketable job skills, but I’ve met my share of university students who were studying in medical or engineering disciplines, a librarian and even a couple of moonlighting grade-school teachers.
And, er, this boggles my mind a bit, but two of the dancers I’ve met who were most up front about offering ‘extras’ both claimed to be cabin attendants for a major airline with its main hub in Houston…
Not really dated any, but became good friends with one and would meet her for lunch quite a bit. She had had a rather difficult relationship with her parents and previous history of substance abuse, but she had turned things around and is currently going for a degree in physical therapy. Sharp wit, interested in lots of different things and great fun to be around, but major trust issues which were perfectly understandable given some of the things she told me about her past. We’ve drifted apart but I think most guys would be more than happy to date her.
I’m just glad to know I’m not the only person in the world who doesn’t think going to see strippers is nasty. I don’t know how many times in the last few weeks I’ve been challenged about my decision to go to strip shows. There’s no club in town that caters to gay men specifically but one of the local gay bars has weekly shows. The dancers know me and recognize that I’m a regular and do right by them, they trust me and they always make a little extra effort for me because they know I’ll show my appreciation. Only one has ever been a complete asshole; he actually tried to steal money from me which I was perfectly willing to give him as a tip. So no more tips for him.
It may be as emilyforce says that once their in the dressing room they talk trash about me and everything they say is a lie. I don’t really care. With the exception of one I don’t consider any of them my friends and I’m not paying any of them for their friendship. As long as they keep doing their job and treating me with some level of respect then it works for me.
I pay women to talk to me all the time. It’s called a date, and I end up blowing $50-75 on the evening. Apparently this makes every women I’ve gone oout with in my 34 years an opportunistic sleazeoid.
Careful with your labels, they may just stick.
Well, the overpriced drinks are for me, because most of the places I’ve gone to have a “x drink minimum” (you must buy at least x drinks).
The dancers will mingle with you and try to talk you into buying drinks for them (more money for the club), and/or try to talk you into a “lap dance” (girl sits on your lap and wiggles for three minutes). The dances start at $10 and go up, depending on the club and what “VIP rooms” are available. You are also certainly welcome to tip the girls if you like, and the more generous you are with the money, the longer they stay and chat with you. Me, I’m usually content to sit in the back, nurse my Coke, and watch the girls on the stage. I don’t need the fake sincerity.
As for prostitution in strip clubs, AIAK it’s illegal in all of them, but some of the clubs will get away with it, depending on location. I refuse to say more to avoid incriminating myself, but I’ll note that San Francisco is just jammed with clubs…
Rjung, you mentioned San Francisco, so I have to ask, have you ever been to the Crazy Horse? I’ve been there a few times, I have a pretty good time but the fact is I just can’t afford it- spending $60 in one night is a LOT for me, and now that I’m trying to pay my car off I’m not willing to spare the money for just one night.
There is another club I’ve heard of in San Francisco called the O’Farrel’s theater, who supposedly have LIVE SEX SHOWS (at least that’s what the radio ad claims. Is this true? Is it worth checking out in the future?
When I went to the Crazy Horse I was rather surprised at what went on. I had thought there was a very strict 'no touching ’ policy regarding strip clubs, but at the Crazy Horse the women there would let you touch them (they’d let you know when it was appropriate) also, each night they would have some spectacle or another; one time they had 2 girls sticking glass dildos in each other, another time they pulled a female audience member on stage, got her to strip naked, and made out with her :eek:
Generally what I did there was hold my tip money for the girls that really looked like they were having a good time. Generally the more money you tipped the more attention you’d get from the girl, so the girls I wasn’t generally interested in would leave me alone.
Never been to the Crazy Horse myself, sorry – it’s one of those “I want to go someday, but haven’t managed to yet” tasks.
And I believe “live sex show” is a euphemism for the dancers/actors/whoevers to do things to each other with plastic toys and whatnot. Sounds like you’ve seen some of that already.
Not exactly. Okay, I admit it, part of the reason for my starting this thread was a desperate cry for help. I feel like life is passing me by and I’m wasting it being miserable. I had a good time at that club, but I don’t want to start going to gogo bars as my only means of social interaction, and the prospect of a bitter, solitary existence with nothing to look forward to but a lap dance once a week terrifies me. I’ve been on my own for years and from the outside I look like I’m doing just fine, but sometimes I feel like the loneliness is sucking the life force from my body. I’ll be thirty in two years, and I have a feeling I’m not going to take it well.
Of course now I’ve come off more pathetic than I ever could have just talking about strip clubs. :o Thanks for your concern, Binarydrone, it actually wasn’t off-topic at all.
[QUOTE]
*Originally posted by emilyforce *
**As a former exotic dancer, I can tell you that if I were a guy, the reason I wouldn’t patronize strip clubs is that the dancers talk an incredible amount of shit about you as soon as you leave. We are there to exploit you, and 95% of our flattery or flattering attention is out-and-out lies. In our minds we are likely to be sizing up how much more bullshit, or listening to your bullshit, it’ll take before your wallet makes an appearance.
[QUOTE]
Having had quite a few stripper girlfriends through out my 20’s I can’t tell you how true this is.
As to the OP I see nothing wrong with toppless bars themselves; but if you’re going there to alieviate some sort of depression you’re having than that might be a concern.
Well maybe not this time because you said you only did it once but if it became a habbit then thats a different story.
When I was in High School, working in a pizza place, a very wise coworker once said “Johnny Bravo,” said he, “going to a strip club is like going to church. A lot of guys sitting around quietly looking like they want to be somewhere else.”
Well, maybe he wasn’t as wise as he pretended to be. He did work at a pizza place, after all.
But I did have my chance to go a few years later, when a friend and I came into a little bit of easy money and decided to squander it as easily as we’d made it. So we went, sat down at the bar, and spent some time watching the girls dance.
It was fun at the time, and especially gratifying being approached by every beautiful girl in the place. If I can say so without being too immodest, the two of us were probably the youngest and best-looking patrons there.
In any case, we chatted with the waitresses, we chatted with the dancers. The girls were all very nice and I enjoyed talking to them. We both got a lap dance, and we both left with significantly lighter wallets than we came in with.
In retrospect, it wasn’t an experience I found particularly enlightening or fulfilling (especially on a college student’s budget). I’m glad I did it just for the “life experience” or what have you, but I won’t be going again any time soon. The whole place had a very cheap, fake feel about it.
I’ve often wondered if I’ve run into any of those girls on campus. I certainly wouldn’t recognize them. For one, I’m terrible with face recognition. For another, I wasn’t really looking at their faces.
** cuauhtemoc ** I don’t mean to get all Ann Landers on your ass, but I just wanted to suggest that you need to make a change in your life in order to meet new people. “You can’t meet new friends doing the same old shit” as I like to say.
Join a local rec league if you like sports… take a class through a community college or high school with a community outreach program… you can even volunteer.
(I have a friend who volunteered with a marine mammal rescue group… that was GOLD when it came to meeting the ladies.)
Remember that friends don’t just fall in your lap once you’re past kindergarten. I find it hard sometimes to make the first step, but going out for drinks/dinner after a shared activity is how I have met the majority of my post-college friends.
If you truly feel immobilized by your misery, you should consider speaking to a professional about it.
Hey, cuauhtemoc, ditto these nice folks about taking care of yourself ‘n’ stuff. I do know it’s damned tough to go joining things and making efforts if you feel like crap, though. I went through the whole thing about joining groups, choirs, church, volunteering, etc. thing at one point and found it exhausting and unproductive… because at the time I was too depressed to really enjoy anything and didn’t realize that was the core problem. I don’t mean to get all Ann Landers on your ass either (thanks, Hello Again!) but seeing a shrink or a therapist is a great idea if you’ve been bummin’ for a while. They really can help, and it need not be difficult.
Am I right in guessing you hate your job? I have found that to be a keystone thing that when improved can make a huge freakin’ difference. Anything you can do there?
I used to work for a local govnerment org. The studies you speak of are bogus. When strip clubs first started up in my state, the city fathers were desperate for a way to prevent them. Well, not always the fathers, but the local religious people (hint: voters). They couldn’t find any studies that supported the contention that strip clubs were hotbeds of crime, but in a couple of years such studies appeared, courtesy of all the funding that suddenly became available for such studies.
Basically all they had to do was study areas until they found one that fit their preconceptions, and bingo! they had their proof. The fact that the early studies didn’t find any correlation between strip clubs and crime didn’t matter. It’s all a matter of politics. If strip club habitues had the nerve to speak up publicly in their local communities about how great strip clubs are, and voted their convictions, things would be different. But most guys are pretty cowardly in this area.
Thanks to all who responded to me, but I think it is rather clear that cuauhtemoc needs more feedback than I need information about strippers.
This is the part that struck me (when I realized it was not ironic):
This doesn’t sound right to me.
Granted I (obviously) don’t know much about strip clubs, but I would hope that those who go to them at least enjoy the experience. If you have to force yourself, what is the point?
You mentioned that you were twenty-eight. That is a difficult age - too old for college-age stuff, and everyone else is married.
I hope I don’t come across as a scold, but I doubt you are going to meet lots of people who are good candidates for a long-term relationship in a strip club. Male or female.
I think it might help if you could find something to do that is genuinely fun for you - not forced. Do that, and you will almost automatically connect with people who have at least one common interest.
If you can’t find anything like that, this is often called depression, and it can be treated.
Strip Clubs are good for one thing…embarrassing the shit out of your potential groom. I only go to Clubs when I am in a bachelor party with friends. Going alone is just too creepy and I can find better ways to pick up girls (if Mrs. Bitties did not reign me in that it)
But as I said, there is nothing like going with a large select grooup of pals and lambasting the groom with enough potential “look at what yer giving up” to warrent the lighter wallet. Plus the girls seem to love the torturing (or at least have act like they are having a good time)
Having just turned 30, I think I have a sense of what you’re going through. For me, 28 was a point where I realized that my youth wasn’t going to last forever and that I urgently needed to have more fun, accomplish more, etc. The same thing also happened at ages 23 and 19.
I think it’s important to recognize that the “life is passing me by” feeling is not based on reality. The problem is that right now you’re unhappy. When your life sucks, it’s easy to imagine how being unhappy at this critical age is representative of how the rest of your life is going to be. Your mind forms graphic pictures of yourself, sitting alone in a strip club on your birthday when you’re 65, wheedling girls to let you touch their boobs for $10 before going home to a cramped, dirty apartment to eat stew out of a can in front of the tv. That’s not going to happen, though – it’s just your mind fucking with you. Ignore that shit.
As others have said, now is the time to grab your brain by the scruff of the neck (not literally) and make some changes. If you can manage it, I’d strongly recommend therapy. Even if you’re not clinically depressed, having a supportive neutral person to sort things out with can be incredibly useful. Also, force yourself to start putting yourself in situations where you can meet people. (If your immediate response to this is “no one would want to talk to me”, then you definitely need to see a therapist.) Avoid scenes where people gather in groups, like bars. The first several times, you may not click with anyone or have any fun at all, and you’ll wonder why you’re making yourself miserable. Keep at it – just the act of taking charge of your social life can be very powerful, and can open up opportunities in other areas. Be patient and things will start to turn around.
I have been under the care of various “professionals” for years and years. I may have to fire my therapist soon though. She used to help me a lot, but lately I feel like we’re running over the same ground again and again without getting anywhere. I also see a psychiatrist, who just recommended I increase the dosage of my medication (Luvox, an SSRI).
I take classes, and I go to the gym frequently. I also love to travel, although of necessity I only do so alone. I don’t do these things just to meet people, I do them because I enjoy them. However, I’m open to meeting people through these activities. It just hasn’t ever happened.
Giraffe:
That indeed was exactly my immediate response, to the micron. Yes, I realize intellectually that it’s not correct. No, I don’t know why I feel this way, but part of me is absolutely certain that it’s the truth, and I don’t know how to change it. No, I don’t broadcast my low self-esteem to the rest of the world (except here, evidently), I’ve learned to hide it pretty well.
Shodan:
I don’t think I was implying that I was looking for a long-term relationship in a strip club. I was contemplating substituting the artificial strip-club encounters for the more genuine human contact I don’t get in my normal life.
It seems to me that you actually have a pretty good handle on your situation. You seem really self-aware, and you are actively trying to face what is making you unhappy. You should really be proud of this – it’s a rare person who can fight through a difficult time and do so well.
However, that doesn’t change the fact that even though you’re doing a great job, you’re still not getting anywhere in terms of connecting with people. That’s very discouraging, and it must be very tempting to conclude that it means you are utterly unlikeable and destined to be alone. Don’t.
Rather, you need to change tactics. Get a new therapist, one who will help you with the practical difficulties of changing your life for the better. Shop around until you find someone you connect with.
Keep doing the things you mentioned – travel, gym and taking classes. Those are the activities of a healthy, interesting person. However, add some new activities into the mix which will allow you to directly meet and interact with people socially. Suggestions:
Take ballroom dance classes. I did this (and I was a miserable dancer when I started – prior skill really doesn’t matter), and it is a great way to talk to lots of different people and have a lot of fun. Few classes require a partner – you usually switch partners every few minutes. Go to any dances or social events – you’ll have lots of people from your class to dance with and talk to.
Join a club or social group. Unlike classes, the purpose of these organizations is to interact with other people. Depending on your interests, there can be a ton of options. Book discussion groups, volunteer organizations, etc.
You sound like you’re in a good place to meet people, you just need to put yourself into a situation to find people who you connect with. The goal is not to force a friendship with people you don’t have anything in common with. The goal is to find the people with whom friendship will come easily and naturally (and there are many of these people out there, I promise you). Good luck – it’s hard, but you can do this.
Is it just me, or is it weird to go to strip clubs with your buddies? The times when I went the last thing I would have wanted was my buddies around making fun of me for staring at some woman’s assets.