Wheelchairs aren't people, they are equipment.

[iiandyiiii]

@dropzone

The Pit is no place for hurt feelings. We have MPSIMS for that.

I think the Pit is a place to rant and express anger, among other things.

[dropzone]

No, the Pit is where you open yourself up to contrary opinions. Hugs are for MPSIMS.

[iiandyiiii]

@dropzone

No, the Pit is where you open yourself up to contrary opinions. Hugs are for MPSIMS.

That doesn’t contradict what I said. He can express anger and rant and open himself up to contrary opinions, and you can express them, and then other people can come express opinions contrary to yours. That’s what’s been happening, and it seems appropriate to the Pit, to me.

[dropzone]

I can agree with that, though I’m still bothered when some people don’t agree with me.

[Becky2844]

So as not to seem patronizing I offer this good read to everybody—the autobiography Don’t Worry, He Won’t Get Far on Foot by John Callahan.
I read this years ago when I really, emotionally, needed it and it hit me where it hurt. Got me to thinking and helped change my way of thinking. And the fact that it’s funny as hell didn’t hurt, either.

That is all.
Unless people want to pile on me. Is that anything like an orgy? Is it something I can cross off my bucket list like The Mile High Club?

Really Ambivilid, I don’t don’t like you. And this really is how I talk to everybody.

[dropzone]

@Becky2844

Unless people want to pile on me. Is that anything like an orgy? Is it something I can cross off my bucket list like The Mile High Club?

You’d probably rather not.

I heard Callahan interviewed when the book came on and it’s on my list, someday. I’m a slow reader. An apropos Callahan cartoon: http://aconservativelesbian.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Callahan-people-like-you-are-an-inspiration480x432.jpg

[purplehearingaid]

This happen last week and you’re stilled pissed off about it . :smack:

[Becky2844]

@dropzone

You’d probably rather not.

I heard Callahan interviewed when the book came on and it’s on my list, someday. I’m a slow reader. An apropos Callahan cartoon: http://aconservativelesbian.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/07/Callahan-people-like-you-are-an-inspiration480x432.jpg

Oh gawd dropzone. Yep, that’ll really get 'em running to the bookstores.

[Snowboarder_Bo]

@Ambivalid

Wheelchairs aren’t people, they are equipment.

What about Soylent Green? Soylent Green is still people, right?

[dropzone]

Sadly, no. It’s vegan now.

Soylent (meal replacement)

[Ambivalid]

@iiandyiiii

It seems to me that he did suck it up. He didn’t yell at the woman, or curse her out, or even make a snide remark – he just had the audacity to have feelings and post a rant about those feelings. Can’t blame a man for having feelings.

I’m mean, seriously. Jesus fucking Christ, I was not expecting any sort of criticism for my disapproval expressed in my OP (and that being the real world OP and not the various fictitious OPs being used in place of mine upon which to form many of the opinions here). I guess I shouldn’t be surprised though. It doesn’t matter what I say, I get bashed. If what I’m saying is about me, in any way. Not by everyone but by many who were rubbed the wrong way with my aggressive, combative attitude here when I first arrived; nearly four years ago. And just like poking that shit at me at any and every opportunity.

[kayT]

Well, Ambivalid, I don’t know what you were like when you first came here that torqued everyone off but I do know what dropzone is like now, after being here a long time. As of today, I would a lot rather read what you have to say than what he has to say.

[Becky2844]

I was going to keep quiet now but “…I wasn’t expecting any criticism…” in the Pit?

[Miller]

@dropzone

5. I tell him to suck it up because he will have to live with people who don’t know him underestimating his capabilities, and then being accidentally patronizing the rest of his life. They are basing their assumptions on what they are familiar with. Ambivalid is an outlier when it comes to people in wheelchairs,and more power to him. However, he needs a thicker skin. Patronizing kindness is, after all, better than abuse.

There’s a fucking lesson for you. If you’re in a wheelchair, you should just be grateful people aren’t actively spitting in your face, and if you complain about it, you can look forward to a lecture so fucking sanctimonious it would even embarrass BigT.

But good job on coming into a rant from a guy complaining about being patronized because he’s in a wheelchair, and patronizing him because he’s in a wheelchair. You’re a first class shit-heel, dropzone.

[Guinastasia]

@Ambivalid

Yes, this is basically it. Although there was really no need to throw in that last bit about always holding doors for people. It’s totally, utterly unrelated to this discussion).

Well around here you never know.

[Ambivalid]

@Becky2844

I was going to keep quiet now but “…I wasn’t expecting any criticism…” in the Pit?

I put this in the Pit because it was my rant against dehumanizing treatment I received. What I did not expect was dim-witted, condescending fucking criticism from the very people I came to for a bit of undestanding and tension relief.

I’m sorry I needed to spell that out so clearly and simply for you. I guess I made an assumption about you. Those are never good to make. So lessons learned on both sides.

[russian_heel]

@Leaffan

I suppose I could say the same to you.

I fail to understand why you’re offended when people want to help you.

Most of us have no experience with people in wheelchairs. I don’t know anyone in a wheelchair.

You’re an adult with what most of us would perceive as a disability. We want to help but don’t know exactly where to draw the line. There’s really nothing more to the story. Your dental hygienist was only trying to be helpful. We’re all just human.

Peace.

Well said. What some folks in wheelchairs or with other disabilities need to be aware of is that this situation is uncomfortable (obviously not as uncomfortable as it may be for them) for able-bodied individuals as well. If we hold the door open for someone in wheelchair, will they get offended? But if you don’t, you feel like and look like a creep as an example. But if you do, then you are pointing out to the world that the person in the wheelchair is helpless, and you are heartless bastard.

Its very hard very hard to pretend to ignore the fact that you are in a wheelchair with special needs when in fact it’s an 800 pound gorilla in the room, and that can create awkward situations, through no real fault of anybody.

Maybe accept the nurse or health care worker was just trying to be nice with the 83-year old comment, and when she said “good job” she meant it as a compliment that she is amazed by your mobility which no doubt was not easy to achieve for someone who uses a wheelchair.

Get over it.

[russian_heel]

@Guinastasia

It’s not that she offered him help. It’s that when he said “no thanks, I’m good.” It’s that instead of saying, “okay, cool”, she saw him lift himself into the chair and said, “Oh, good job!” like he was five years old. And then talks about how, “oh, I know that everyone in a wheelchair must need help, you know, because my grandmother was in a wheelchair, and she was old and feeble.” Talking down to the the guy, you know?

It doesn’t take a freaking genius to say, “Hey, do you need help?” Seriously, you don’t have to know someone in a wheelchair to know NOT to talk to them like they’re a kid. I mean, to say things like, “Oh, what a good boy, you handled it all by yourself!!! I’m really proud of you!” C’mon. :dubious:

(For what it’s worth though, I hold doors for everyone. Cuz I’m all polite and shit.)

A nurse talking down to a patient, and treating them like a child? NEVER heard of such a thing!

[Broomstick]

@dropzone

Thick in what way? I’m honestly curious, which I know means that some people will see as a chance to pile on me, but really, what is wrong with this take on the situation?

1. Ambivalid is offered help by a person.

2. He demurs and demonstrates why doesn’t need it.

3. Instead of just saying, “Oh,” the person says something that can be construed as comparing him with her grannie, which is something he had just demonstrated was a false comparison.

4. Ambivalid chooses to take it badly, which can be understood because he gets patronized a lot.

See, what’s amazing is that up until this point you actually get it, then you come up with…

5. I tell him to suck it up because he will have to live with people who don’t know him underestimating his capabilities, and then being accidentally patronizing the rest of his life. They are basing their assumptions on what they are familiar with. Ambivalid is an outlier when it comes to people in wheelchairs,and more power to him. However, he needs a thicker skin.

First of all, telling the disabled to “suck it up” when faced with bigotry - because that’s what the hygienist demonstrated - is bullshit. Do you tell black people to “suck it up” when people assume things about them based solely on the color of their skin?

Second, although yes, Ambilvalid is a bit of outlier because he’s a body-builder, he’s not such an outlier in having good upper body strength and being able to transfer in and out of a chair by himself. People who aren’t elderly/80+/frail who happen to use wheelchairs, and there are a LOT of younger, healthier people in that category, tend to be able to get in and out of them on their own. And before you say “I don’t know that” we are telling you that now so you know.

Patronizing kindness is, after all, better than abuse.

Actually, it can get to the point of abuse. I don’t think so in this case, but I saw that in the case of my mother after her stroke gave her communication difficulties. Hell, I wanted to punch some people in the face, I can only imagine it was worse for her getting the “kindness” treatment.

[Becky2844]

@Ambivalid

I put this in the Pit because it was my rant against dehumanizing treatment I received. What I did not expect was dim-witted, condescending fucking criticism from the very people I came to for a bit of undestanding and tension relief.

I’m sorry I needed to spell that out so clearly and simply for you. I guess I made an assumption about you. Those are never good to make. So lessons learned on both sides.

I think you’re the one who missed the point, Jack.