When one of your kids is lying

In My Humble Opinion
41

I have a blanket like that. On one side, the fringe just knots up, usually in groups of three. It looks deliberate, but it’s really not. I’ve untangled it, and it tangles again. My husband actually thought that our daughter might be braiding it…but, she’s just six, and doesn’t know how to braid. Fortunately, he didn’t flip out when she told him she didn’t do it! (It would have to be her, right? She’s our only kid :rolleyes:.)

Perhaps it’s just that blanket that’s particularily succeptable? Have you tried switching them around? Or perhaps the blankets in the TV room are used more–more use = more tangling. I never called the store to complain about my blanket (I wouldn’t know who to call–it was a gift), because it’s not that big of a deal to me.

Your children may not be lying to you. It really does “just happen”!

42

These are children. Someone who has a creative personality braided some fringe. You freak out because it doesn’t “hang as nicely as before”. You read them the riot act. You cancelled a ski weekend. Your children cause “unnecessary effort.” Of course your children will not tell you the truth. THEY are sane.

You are getting too upset and having no comprehension of what is normal for children. You value your damned rug over your children’s imagination. I think you have weird expectations of children. I think you need therapy, not your kids. I feel sorry for them as you have obviously scared them away from trusting you. You sound like a parent from hell. Your rug may end up perfect, but your kids will be a mess. Congratulations.

43

I think there is a chance that it is not any of the chilluns, but the “natural” causes described previously. On the contrary, kids that age (I am 18, I still have this crap in my brain) don’t think too well, and often have a very screwed up logic process. I’d make my dad mad, intentionally and unintentionally… one time he got mad for us leaving a few soda cans around. Of course I’d get mad at my father when he’d ground me (very often) and wish that he was dead, but by the next day, I completely forgot about it. Either that or I’d see that I deserved it and move on with my sorry self.

If you feel that one/two/three of them are doing it intentionally because of nervous habit or the likes, I’d ask my kid what was going on in school. A large number of parents aren’t approaching their kids very personally anymore (I’m not making any accusations). Luckily, my dad would ask me what I was doing and such, but because he was gone to work a lot, he’d miss out on some parts of me that my mother would pick up on because she was around more. Approaching your kids individually gives you an edge on dealing with some of their problems.

Likewise, I was not a social butterfly when I was that age. I was a big nerd, and all the kids made fun of me BIG TIME for that. I did not recieve any “professional” councelling, and I believe that I have made a strong comeback. If I were a parent, I wouldn’t go for any professional councelling, but then again, the main child in question (the youngest) seems to be a girl. From what I can tell, girls at that age take many things much more seriously than what is really the case. Again, I suggest YOU approach her personally and ask her what is going on. that’s my two or three cents.

44

I used to have several nervous or fiddling impulses when I was a kid. Once I pulled some leaves off of a plant, once I made a deep scratch in a desk with my fingernails, etc. I also pulled my hair, so much that I had a small bald spot during 6th grade. If my mother had read me the riot act, much less actually cancelled a vacation (!) I would have been scared mindless and certainly would never have confessed. Since I lacked much in the way of logic at that age, I probably would have felt that if this was the reaction spread amongst the three of us, what would happen to me if I alone were the obvious culprit? :eek: Then again, I would also have been angry at what I felt was an unjust reaction to what was essentially a minor crime (ignoring the lying, as the kids won’t see that as the major issue) and I possibly would have done it again just to express my anger.

I also had a couple of little mental illnesses (mild OCD, ADHD, chronic depression) some of which weren’t diagnosed until years later. If you think she’s sick, start checking out counselors. It’s worth the money and effort to make your little girl feel better, if she needs it. And for the record no, I’ve never tortured small animals, but I do like sushi.

The cancelling of the vacation would have been the most frightening part to me. Any kid can yell, but changing plans? That’s an adult’s true power.

45

We’ve just been through something very similar with our older son, who is nine. Well, I suppose we’re not through it yet, but there’s a light at the end of the tunnel, at least. It’s a long story, but he was engaging in some antisocial behavior at school, and destructive behavior both at school and at home.

I’m afraid I have to agree that you overreacted. Worse, you broke what is for me one of the Ten Commandments of Parenting: Thou shalt not intentionally punish an innocent child. My mother used to do that, if my sister and I both denied doing something; she figured that either the guilty party would experience a pang of guilt and confess, or the innocent party would work to keep the guilty one in line in the future. It never worked. The innocent party ended up resenting the disciplinarian instead. If you want my advice, I’d say you should apologize and re-schedule the ski trip.

For flodjunior, we were fortunately able to identify at least some of what was bugging him at school. It’s a rather complicated problem that won’t be solved quickly, but we - flodjunior, his teachers, and his parents - are working together to help him out of it. I can tell you his behavior improved substantially when he realized we were on his side and that the situation wasn’t helpless.

I also know that I had a lot of what was called “nervous energy” back in the Pleistocene when I was a little flod, and I suspect flodjunior does, too. That might be what’s going on with your daughter. I remember more-or-less compulsively braiding any fringes I came across. The only thing that helps here, in my experience both as the kid and the parent, is to make sure that appropriate outlets are available. Flodjunior likes to chew, so I’m trying to make sure there’s gum around for when he’s just gotta chew, and that he gets enough foods that take a lot of chewing - anything from raw vegetables to caramels will do - that the urge doesn’t overwhelm him often. And we don’t fuss over teethmarks on his pencils. Better that than to chew on, and destroy, his kid brother’s toys. A kid who needs to have her hands doing something might enjoy fiddly things like jigsaw puzzles, or might find drawing relaxing, or might be interested in taking up a new hobby like knitting or wood carving.

And me, I’d also put the blankets in a closet for the time being. I realize that means you and your wife will also have to do without them, but it’s just for a cooling-off period. After a week or so they can reappear without fanfare, and hopefully the Phantom Braider will have found another outlet for her energy.

46

You stated my opinion just about perfectly, FranticMad.
Honestly, the fringe doesn’t hang as nicely and its cause to cancel a ski trip? Sheesh.

When i was younger, I would braid things like fringe on blankets, and still do on the blankets I have with fringe on them. I generally unbraid them when I’m done, as it keeps my fingers just as well occupied as braiding them in the first place does…you might suggest that, if it’s just having them braided that annoys you.

But still…yeesh. Braided fringe should -not- be this big of a deal.

47

Dinsdale, are there any new developments?

48

I’ll add simply that I don’t know how your kids are punished or if there is a lot of yelling or hitting in your house (I’m not saying there is), but when I was a kid I learned VERY young that you lie, lie, lie about responsibility for actions. Telling the truth = physical or emotional battering. I am 32 years old and it’s STILL hard for me to admit a mistake, it’s so ingrained in me.

Definately a pick your battles kind of issue, and I want to tell you the truth here. Reading your post made my stomach clench thinking about how your kids felt when confronted with this issue:
"We read the kids the riot act."
"We made it very clear that we were upset, but that we would be even more upset if we found out who did it other than by an admission."

Yikes. I’m not blaming you, but I can tell you this: Years of living in a household full of tension from my parents resulted in my STILL being a very nervous person. As a kid, I jumped a mile when someone approached me. I lied constantly to protect myself from my parents anger/frustration. I worried constantly about being accused of something I didn’t do (which I was, and I coincidently was the youngest), and even now feel guilty for no reason at all.

Please, if you see your household in any of this, talk to someone about it. If your kids seem very nervous or agitated, take them to see a counselor about it, but look at yourself, too.

Take care.

49

I realize this is a minor point late in the proceedings, but how else can you braid things other than in threes?

50

I don’t understand why you think this is a sign of some kind of anxiety or conduct problem.

When I was a kid, I used to braid fringe on blankets in front of the TV. I just like to have something to do with my hands. I still do it occasionally.

I remember when my mom and dad would get angry at me over stuff like this. They’d blow it way out of proportion, get angry, and say things like, “we work hard to make this house nice,” etc. All it taught me was that they cared more about things than they did me. It wasn’t true, but that was how I interpreted their reaction.

My point is, I think you’re all worried about the wrong thing here. You think this behavior is a sign of some major problem with your kid. It’s probably not. But your reaction to it sounds way over the top–and that sends bad messages to kids.

Why not just calm down and say, “Hey, no big deal, but whoever’s doing this, knock it off please. Mom doesn’t like it. If you feel the need to fiddle with something, pick something else.” Then, if it doesn’t stop, just take the blankets away. Don’t provide new ones. Tell the kids–calmly–why they’re gone. Try putting them back after awhile and see what happens. When my parents started doing stuff like this, instead of screaming at me and my sisters, it actually did a lot of good for altering our behavior. The message was: “Hey, want a blanket so you don’t get cold? Don’t knot up the fringe!” As opposed to the original message, which was: “Mom and Dad have a major anger problem! Wow, are they ever jerks! What’s the big deal about the fringe?”

It’s not worth some big blow up or punishment.

51

Dinsdale, Daniel Withrow, Zette, and Q.N. Jones have already said it pretty well for me, but I’ll add to the chorus.

I tend to fiddle with things when I get bored. I could easily see absent-mindedly braiding the fringes of a blanket, especially if I were a bit stressed or nervous because of something else going on in my life. It’s a way to burn off nervous energy, a sort of organized fidgeting, and I might not even be consciously aware that I’m doing it. If I did do something like that and it resulted in the consequences you described, “reading the riot act” and cancelling a trip, when I was a teenager, I also would have been afraid to admit I did it. I hate admitting this, but my father could be somewhat emotionally abusive at times, but still, is that an entirely unreasonable response? Right now, I’m afraid it’s not outside the realm of possibility that your kids think you value those blankets more than them. I remember being convinced as a teenager that my father would rather have a tidy room than a daughter, although again, from what I’ve seen, my situation was worse than your kids.

I’ve got a question for you and a suggestion. Did the kids know they weren’t supposed to braid the fringe? To be precise, did you tell them? It might not be obvious to them, especially if it was something one of them may have done absentmindedly.

Here’s the suggestion. If your youngest does tend to fidget, you might want to get her interested in knitting, crocheting, or some other needlework. As someone who still tends to fidget despite being in her late 30’s, it works for me. You might also want to look in to trichillotomania (sp?), the syndrome where people do tend to pull out their hair compulsively.

It sounds like I was a bit like your youngest in that I also had few or no friends in school, but got on well with adults. For a kid whose different in some way, adults are easier to deal with. Because you’re by definition not an adult, you don’t have to worry about conforming or operating at too high a level. I think basically you don’t have to worry about being judged negatively.

Keep us posted, and good luck,
CJ

52

KneadToKnow - You can make very complex braids with many more strands.Here and here are some examples.

As for the OP - I’d try to approach your youngest as non-confrontationally as possible. If she is a fidgetter and needs to have her hands busy, you might see if there are some sketching/braiding/textile/beading classes she could take nearby. That would put her in a social setting with other kids and teach her how to use her excess energy constructively. Or get some cross-stitch kits - that really doesn’t require instruction and it’s fun. Plus she has something to show for her time. I won’t upbraid you (sorry - I had to do it) as some posters have, but I think you need to take a step back and look at this less emotionally. Perhaps you’ve made it so your daughter is afraid to confess…She might think if you’re willing to punish everyone so severely, even if they haven’t done anything, what might you do to her? No permanent harm has been done - if you can redirect that energy and make it easier for her to communicate, perhaps some good can come from it.

StG

53

Dinsdale you really screwed up and I think you know how.

54

Thanks, StG!

55

Wow…I’ve never seen the rate of unreasonable anger to misdemeanour so skewered before. Yikes.

Look, even if the blankets are knotted together, does it matter? It just seems like such a non issue.

Personally, I think you should listen to your kids. Instead of just lecturing at them, talk to them individually as other posters have suggested. As I recall, weren’t you the poster who thought your daughter was out of line for not wanting to walk home by herself after dark? Don’t take this the wrong way, but I think your kids would benefit if you took their concerns a little more seriously.

56

Er, just wondering if the thread has gone slightly off-track…

IMHO, Dinsdale doesn’t seem to be worrying about the blanket. He is worrying why no one is owning up. If no one is owning up, then it implies that one of the three is lying. The issue is on the lying, not on the tying of the blanket…

Yes, Dinsdale may be over-reacting over the blanket, but I think it’s okayed to be worried when your kids won’t trust you with the truth (which I see as the bigger problem…)

Just my two cent worth…

57

Of course no one is going to own up if owning up for such a little thing is going to lead to a big confrontation.

58

It’s bigger than the blankets and I think Dinsdale has made that point clear.

The fact that he and his wife impressed upon their kids the importance of not twisting the blanket fringes, and one of them went on and twisted them anyway is not something to just shrug off nonchalantly. It was clear that the wife was especially distraught, and it doesn’t matter if she was silly to be upset at such a trifling thing, the kids knew it was hurtful to her and yet one of them persisted. If I were in Dinsdale’s shoes, I’d be mad, too. It’s one thing to be fidgety and creative; it’s another thing to purposely hurt somebody after they told you not to. That’s not cool.

That said, Dinsdale, I think you should reschedule the ski trip for another time in the near future and try to put this thing behind you. I don’t think you should cater to the actions of the miscreant by removing the blankets from the room; that’s something you should do to pets when they have naughty habits, but not for kids that should know better. If the behavior continues but no one comes forward, I think you should just continue to make it known how upsetting this behavior is. But don’t fly off the handle. Tell them how hurtful it is, not because its precious property, but because it is clear that your personal feelings aren’t being valued.

I think eventually the message will get through to whoever is doing it, and either they’ll stop because of the guilt or they’ll stop because they’ll cease to find pleasure in the activity.

59

Well, yeah, but you don’t even know if the kids are the ones doing it. As another poster said, these blankets have a tendency to get knotted up. I think it’s one of those times where you just have to throw it up to fate, you know?

60

I’m one of those kids. Defiance might well be my middle name. Willful. It caused problems between my parents and I until they admitted that I had grown up. (ripe old age of 19 or so, when I got my first job without talking it over with my mom first.) Now, I’m no longer “defiant”, but strong. Not “willful” but determined, focused, purposeful. I’m majoring in chemical engineering and philosophy, and trying to get jobs in professional ethics. So I may be a psychopath, but I’m comfortable with where my obvious psychosis is leading. Some things that are “flaws” in children are really quite respected for adults. Personally, “defiance” is one of them. (Why are children supposed to bow to any authority, but adults are supposed to think before they act on the word of another? When are you supposed to practice standing up for your own thoughts if not when you are small?)

And I’m very glad my parents put up with it. I honestly would have killed myself if I was punished, stifled, limited and relegated to less than furniture in my parent’s lives. It seems like you made the issue, to your kids, about the blanket, rather than about lying. If I were in their shoes I would feel like I was less important than the stupid tv blanket. I wouldn’t see the issue as “one of us kids lied” I’d see it as “My parents are over the deep end” and treat the situation as dealing with any other insane being. Soothing voice, no quick movements.