Sure. And if you anger is directed at the insurrectionists, that’s great, and even all white supremacists. But the OP isnt. Sure that’s one small part but:
That is bigotry pure and simple.
You’ll pardon me, I hope, for observing that simple hasn’t got a goddamned thing to do with it.
You’ve not actually described any reason that what he’s saying is bigoted. You just seem to be treating it as self-evident. If that is so, why is it that other white people* in this thread don’t see it as such?
The only one of the points you quoted that I can see being interpreted in a bigoted way is the last one. You could possibly read it as saying that every single white person has historically been like this, rather than a comment about the general patterns of our ancestors. But most would interpret it as the latter.
The rest? They’re talking about specific people who act in a certain way, not in any way claiming all white people or all affluent people act in that manner.
In short, nothing said suggests that the OP is disparaging white people in general or supporting discrimination against white people. He appears to be discussing a legitimate phenomenon where the affluent of a majority, who face fewer problems and thus you would expect to be happier, seem to be as angry or moreso than minorities who face real problems. And he’s bringing up that part of this seems to be because they feel the less privileged making gains is somehow a threat to them.
I can’t really disagree with any of it, frankly. And I’m white–am I a self-hating white person?
*I can’t say I know the race of every poster, but I’m fairly confident at least some of the posters in here are white, and I at least know for sure I’m white and do not agree that there is anything bigoted about the OP’s remarks. It punches up, not down.
Naah, mate. Bigotry has to be unreasonable, or prejudiced.
The OP’s kind of observation is just judiced. Or postjudiced, if you would.
@MrDibble. Thank you. I tried to say the same thing, but abandoned my post twice. IMO you nailed the idea succinctly.
Just some of my observations as a white man growing up among other white folk.
I also submit this thread discussing an incident between an Angry White Couple and an Angry White Man that resulted in all of them dead:
AFAIK, it had nothing to do with race. Just three people leading normal lives losing their shit over something stupid.
Concur, although with the caveat that sometimes people in a traditionally privileged group are more aggressive about getting their own way as individuals, because they’ve absorbed the attitude that people like them are entitled to get what they want.
As I’ve said before, though, I think it’s pointless to try to figure out exactly how much of any particular incident is due to the subtle influence of systemic societal bigotry and how much of it is just due to individual character and personality.
I don’t see it as being race related, just simple selfishness.
This country would be a better place if every citizen had to spend a day with a person from a 3rd world country who was truly suffering. We’d all be more content at least.
My daughter vacationed in Nicaragua. Eye opening to say the least.
Hi msmith537,
I’m the OP of that post, it’s over 80 replies long - and if you check there’s no mention of race to
date.
Which is troubling because that means when I read a story about a violent tragedy, I think of the human beings involved, you on the other hand focus on the racial identity of the human beings involved.
Guess what that makes you ?
I going to side with those that say that “white anger” is the same anger that is found among a subset of individuals of all races its just viewed differently. Up until recently white anger was strong and assertive, while black anger was dangerous and animalistic and latino anger was firey.
Similarly on the Karen side of things white women were stern and no nonsense (if directed at the help) or shrewish (if directed at their husbands), while black women were sassy.
But its all really the same anger and assholeishness underneath. I think white anger is more on display than black anger, because blacks have been taught that expressing their anger in public can be dangerous to them.
?? WTF, dude? msmith537 explicitly said in the very post that you replied to that he thought the Snow Shovel Shooting murder/suicide tragedy had nothing to do with race.
(And anyway, there would not automatically be anything racist about considering whether systemic societal racism might have contributed to the mindset of irrationally excessive hostility that the perpetrator and victims of this tragedy exhibited.)
How does a white guy having a discussion about other white people’s behavior make me anything?
Not willfully blind?
And you think angry white males have all abused others? That’s a pretty big assumption, how do you justify it?
Okay, I am only going to say this one more time and then give up.
White anger has a big component of fear of retribution. It is not PERSONAL, any more than the anger is truly personal. It is CULTURAL. It isn’t INDIVIDUAL, it is COLLECTIVE.
Presently we are calling this collective assemblage of group history “white male privilege”, but it is a poor descriptor. What that means is that every white male carries, as a member of that group, all the baggage of history of western civilization with him wherever he goes. It means that he carries all the preferential treatment with him like an invisible skin, as well as the price paid for this treatment, by everyone, including themselves. For those who have reaped the benefits, part of the price is a conscious or (far more usually) unconscious sense that everyone who has historically been shoved aside, demeaned, enslaved, etc. so that white men can be at the top of the pile, desires to displace them, and more than that, punish them for the endless wrongs which have been inflicted. Not mere equality, but vengeance. The less secure in their privilege white men are, I believe, the more they fear this ‘displacement’.
If you respond again with the specious argument that I have to show that every individual angry white male has not only individually wronged an individual other person whom they individually fear is going to demand justice, you will just prove how deliberately obtuse you are being. Unless it isn’t deliberate.
If you cannot grasp that we are never merely atomic minds but always also are part of a collective cultural moment, there is really nothing to be discussed with you.
Okay, I understand what you’re saying now, although I think it’s probably not true.
Modhat: What a cute way to call another poster a racist. Oh wait, no. Don’t do this again.
Insults of other posters belong only in the pit.
This is just a guidance, not a warning. Nothing on your permanent record.
Accept correction I shouldn’t insult other posters.
I was not, for the record, calling anyone a racist. At least not intentionally. So, not being cute.