How old are your kids Dio? Because some of what you said there rings true for me. Now that the kids are entering teen years though they are more self-reliant there’s little slack to be picked up, unless they need a ride somewhere, etc.
Really? Interesting.
What if I said this: Anyone who considers spending time with their children without having his or her spouse also present as being “stuck with the kids” probably should not have made a family to begin with.
“Puritanical?” I just don’t want to inconvenience my wife or miss out on time with my kids.
I’d say you sound like someone who’s never been stuck with the kids.
Honestly, this is why my wife and I take turns, and we both cut down our outside social lives to some extent.
I just don’t really see it as being NECESSARY that you remove ALL of your social life outside your family. I mean, case in point, my wife has acquired my love for fiddly complex Euro board games, so she comes to board game nights now and we’re all pretty much in agreement that’s “family time” since Mini-Miss is the kind of baby who will sit on the floor with her toys and babble into the conversation happily–no problems there. My wife, similiarly, could not give two shits about Dungeons and Dragons, so I go out once a week for a few hours to play while she stays with the kidlet. Same thing happens on Sunday morning when she has knitting group (which I couldn’t give two shits about)–grabby nine-month-olds, hot tea, and sharp metal things don’t mix well, so we have daddy and baby time while she’s out for a few hours.
It feels like the response of “my family is more important” sidesteps the question of why a few hours a week or a month is so problematic for some people. I understand the “I like them better than you”, but again, that comes off weird–do you only ever have one friend at a time, then, or is there some room for the second-through-tenth place folks?
ETA: “Stuck with the kids” is what happens, IMHO, when you AREN’T getting equal time away from the house as your spouse, or it’s unexpected/unplanned for. If you feel like ANY alone time with your kids without your spouse is “stuck with them”, frankly I’m in agreement with the “why did you have them?” camp.
Well, as Acsenray pointed out, maybe if the idea of spending time alone with your kids is an inconvenience, your priorities are out of whack. I never resented my wife for going out to spend time with her friends, nor did I fell I “missed out” on the experience of spending time with my kids because I occasionally did non-family related activities.
My kids are 11, 6 and 2.
Yes, when they’re older, it will not be such a big deal for one of us to take off somewhere for an afternoon, but right now it’s still a circus.
It’s just work, that’s all. It’s hard to take care of three small children, and it would be irresponsible and insensitive for me not to do my fair share.
Once they are older and not so high maintenance, it won’t be such a big deal, but right now, it’s work.
Maybe it’s a question of your dynamic not being universal–my one cousin’s kids are about that age range, and babysitting them solo for a few hours wasn’t a big deal for me a few years ago.
Three years later with another 8-month-old, yeah, that starts getting complicated.
Might not your “fair share” embrace the concept of both you and your wife getting the opportunity for some time away from the rest of the family?
I don’t see it as necessary, either, but I still think it’s okay if it’s someone’s preference. Also, like I said, for a lot of people it doesn’t have to be a choice. I have plenty of friends and family that enjoy hanging out with both my husband and me. So, if I meet someone who merely tolerates my husband and prefers to spend time with me one-on-one, I’m probably not going to bother with them. I just don’t need that kind of friend; I’d rather spend the time cultivating our other relationships.
See, as I said above, with my wife and I (I wonder how normal this is) it’s not a question of separate groups of friends but separate activities or kid-inappropriate activities. The knitting group, board game group, and D&D group mentioned in my last post share 75% of members in common, it’s just a question of my wife or I not liking one activity or the other.
What if your friend absolutely loves your husband, but occasionally just wants to relate to you one-on-one? Isn’t there a significant difference between interacting with a close friend on a one-on-one basis and interacting as a member of a group?
Yes, this is another thing. Aren’t you still an adult? Don’t you occasionally crave the kind of entertainment that might not be appropriate for a child or, more likely, might bore a child to death? Dare I say? Sitting in a coffee shop and just talking? Or watching a movie that’s inappropriate for or not of interest to a child?
Sweetie, your kids are watching your marriage. They will model future relationships after what they grow up seeing. What kind of lessons are you teaching them, about things like standing up for yourself, about a person’s worth as a human being?
Do you want your daughter to grow up into a control freak like the mother she knows? Do you want your son to marry someone who heaps the same brand of shit onto his head? (Apologies: I don’t know your kids’ gender.) People seek out what’s familiar. If this BS you put up with from your wife is all they know, then, by God, they’re going to seek it out as adults themselves.
Staying together “for the sake of the children” has fucked up many people, permanently. I say that as the product of such a marriage. My parents would have been infinitely better off divorced, and being better people might have made them better parents. As it was, they were shit for parents, in large part because they spent their time controlling each other (or trying to), screaming at each other, and just generally shredding each others’ souls.
Divorcing your controlling wife does not at all equal “leaving your kids.” In fact, from my perspective, it would be the best thing for them.
(Acsenray totally said it was OK for me to hijack his thread. 
)
Why is your wife taking care of the kids “stuck” if you enjoy your family’s company so much? Secondly you sound co-dependant to me if you can’t have a friendship other than your wife (I wouldn’t consider anyone my friend I am not allowed to hang out with alone).
I am engaged and I hope to hell my marriage ends up being a lot more balanced and healthy than one where I need an “excuse” to have a friend, and I’m head over heels in love with my fiance, but a relationship where you cannot spend time alone/with others is very limited and out of balance IMO. I want to, and deserve, a couple nights a month where I can go watch a fight with my guy friends and be crude as hell.
Heh. That’s true. My husband’s beer brewing, for example, is EXTREMELY kid-unfriendly, and that’s fine. Likewise, my fish tanks aren’t really something you want a kid messing with during maintenance time. We don’t even have a kid yet, but this stuff will certainly require switching off.
I’m not actually disagreeing with you; I was trying to explain that sometimes people just decide that it’s not worth it to them to have friends that don’t include their family, and that, in my opinion, there’s nothing wrong with that.
Yes, yes I did. Carry on (provided Leaffan is okay with it).
Exactly. I adore my best friend’s husband and children, and I’m happy to hang out with them. That doesn’t mean that she and I would never want to have an outing that doesn’t include them. There are things we enjoy doing that don’t interest him and aren’t appropriate for kids, so it makes sense for him to stay home with the kids while we go do those things (and she does the same for him of course).
I really, really can’t wrap my head around this “there is nothing I would ever want to be doing that doesn’t include my spouse” thing. It frankly creeps me the fuck out.
ETA that sounds harsher than I intended I’m sure, but really, I’m not snarking I’m asking… there are NO interests that you don’t share with your spouse? You don’t EVER have the urge to have a conversation with a friend that s/he’s not included in? Really?
Sometimes I feel sort of sad I don’t have a family. Reading this thread is not one of those times…
My 11 year old is pretty calm. My 6 year old is a hurricane in human form. My 2 year old is in her terrible twos. It’s not just about them either, there’s also all kinds of other shit that has to be done on the weekends, plus I already work on the weekends, so my time at home is already limited on those days, and when I get done with work, I need to give my wife a break.
I occasionally meet a friend for dinner, if they happen to be in town (like I said, most of my friends live in other states. I’m a transplant here), it’s not like my wife won’t [i[let* me, I just don’t like to very often.