I think a lot of folks would advocate this approach to containment. It makes some sense to keep people in a hot spot from leaving and creating new hot spots.
But locking people in a metropolitan area the size of NYC’s isn’t something we’ve ever done in this country before as far as I know. It doesn’t seem very “American” or constitutional. Logistically it also seems like a nightmare. How do you secure the boundary around the quarantine zone? The military? Are we really ready to have a militarized border within the US? You’ve also got to allow interstate commerce, right? People need food and medications. Essential businesses gotta keep running. Some of the people working in those essential businesses may not live in the quarantine zone. If I’m a nurse who lives in South Orange, NJ but I work in Hoboken NJ, are you going to keep me from going to work (assuming Hoboken is in the quarantine zone but South Orange isn’t)?
I agree with Cuomo that it is very weird that Trump is considering a quarantine right now when just four days ago he was saying he wanted things to go back to normal soon. Surely the president can’t seriously believe that NYC is the only hotspot we will have. It’s just the first one. You can’t have a return to normalcy for the US when NYC, its largest city, is shut down.
It’s not really doing that much more than what the governors in these states are doing except limiting their travel outside the region. On its face, it’s not a terrible idea, but it’s incomplete: the outbreak is everywhere now. If he were to implement this on a larger scale, he would at least probably slow down the rate of infection.
But listening to him speak, it seems like he’s throwing this out there to see how people react to it.
Don’t say that word! I don’t want Trump watching that movie and start asking when he can order Operation Clean Sweep on [DEL][COLOR=“Black”]Cedar Creek, Ca[/DEL][/COLOR] New York, NY.
My understanding is that the virus probably isn’t worse in NY state, its more that they test more people. Then again, NYC is a city where a lot of people walk everywhere, which I’m guessing helps with transmission.
But more importantly my impression is Trump is trying to punish blue states he doesn’t like. NY, NJ, CT, MI, etc. have all been on his hit list.
What nonsense. How is he punishing California? NY has as of yesterday 12 times the cases that we do. NYC has extremely dense living conditions and a majority of people who use overcrowded public transportation. Its SMART to not let New Yorkers spread the virus to the rest of us.
I disagree with Cuomo, it’s not ‘weird’… it’s Trump.
It’s exactly the kind of directionless ‘leadership’ he’s been inflicting upon us since he was elected. One day everything is great and the the virus will be gone before you know it, the next it’s “don’t be in groups of more than 10” One day is “we’ll be open by Easter” the next it’s “let’s quarantine 10 million people”.
ETA, it’s not even inherently wrong to cut down on NYC area residents (like me) going outside the area. It’s just not part of an actual plan, he ping pongs around going from one extreme to the other.
Umm, not let New Yorker’s spread the virus to the rest of us?Alabama 531
Alaska 69
Arizona 508
Arkansas 349
California 3777
Colorado 1430
Connecticut 1012
Delaware 143
Florida 2352
Georgia 1714
Hawaii 86
Idaho 189
Illinois 2538
Indiana 645
Iowa 179
Kansas 168
Kentucky 248
Louisiana 2305
Maine 155
Maryland 774
Massachusetts 2417
Michigan 2856
Minnesota 399
Mississippi 579
Missouri 502
Montana 90
Nebraska 73
Nevada 535
New Hampshire 158
New Jersey 6876
New Mexico 136
New York 38977
North Carolina 764
North Dakota 58
Ohio 867
Oklahoma 248
Oregon 316
Pennsylvania 1688
Rhode Island 188
South Carolina 456
South Dakota 46
Tennessee 957
Texas 1396
Utah 402
Vermont 156
Virginia 604
Washington 3207
West Virginia 76
Wisconsin 707
Wyoming 55That ship has already sailed.
I’m not going to quote that post, but those number look, to me, pretty much even percentages of populations. New York has more cases? New York has more PEOPLE. Delaware and Hawaii, with few, are tiny. Alaska is big, but with a sparse population.
Cities with international airports are a little higher, and New York has two (Indiana claims to have one, but it flies to Canada, and that’s about it).
I’m not expecting perfection. What I am expecting is a plan. One that only changes when information exists that indicates the plan isn’t working, or won’t work. Trump’s plan went from everything will blow over before you know it, to a national emergency, to we will reopen for business by Easter, to maybe we should quarantine 10 million people.
He doesn’t have a plan, and if he stumbles on a choice that isn’t wrong, it doesn’t mean he’s doing a good job.
FTR, people around here gotta quit going other places. I have a vacation place in PA, and I’m hearing about NY/NJ folks driving up there to get out of the city, and feeling free to hit the local stores to stock up on supplies. That’s bullshit, stay the hell home unless you’re going to your essential job or buying groceries. We’re supposed to self quarantine for 14 days, you just know these MFers won’t do that.
Closing the subways is the most obvious of plans. Again, its one reason that NY had 37K infections and Cali only 3K. Global warming aside, our car culture is saving lives.
Just three weeks ago, I couldn’t imagine that we’d seriously be talking about mandatory quarantines in the US. I knew the virus was bad, but I guess my imagination just isn’t all that great.
Isn’t NY on somewhat of a testing binge compared to the rest of the country? Even discounting population differences, places that are testing more will have inflated numbers of detected cases.
New york has 12 times the number of cases because they actually test people there. 25% of all tests that have been done in America have been done in NY state. So naturally the number of confirmed cases is higher there. In most of the country you can’t even get a test if you have all the symtpoms.
The living conditions in NYC may contribute but then Boston, DC and other large eastern cities, as well as Chicago, which all have dense urban areas and good public transit systems should see similar numbers.
The cats been out of the bag for a while now. The virus is everywhere, but we aren’t testing for it. No nation to my knowledge is able to test on the level we’d need to test to stop the disease as that would require testing asymptomatic people. A quarantine on NY state isn’t going to stop all the people walking around without symptoms or pre-symptoms infecting other people.
You’re literally burying your head in the sand if your argument is ‘Over in California we aren’t testing people, and we don’t have a lot of positives, so the virus hasn’t hit us yet’.
The only number that matters is probably R.
Different states are at different points on their trajectory for not much other reason than the date when their first infected person arrived. Nowhere is doing better than another if they have the same reproduction rate. They are just waiting a bit longer for the inevitable.
Quarantine only works if either - you have exactly no local cases - even asymptomatic ones - or you are adding quarantine to a total local lockdown, and it is you that are quarantining yourself from all others.
Quarantining NY because it is currently in a bad way and not doing the same for every other state is simply not understanding what the problem is.
I do worry that the idea foremost ideas that come out against quarantine are that it is unconstitutional or un-American. These are badly off point. It seems to say that if the constitution bans a move that will save many many thousands of lives it still must be adhered to, or that tradition American freedoms override life. It is pretty unlikely that your founding fathers had seen a pandemic rip into their own populace. They were concerned to weld together a disparate union.
Travel and population densities have changed the entire world in ways they could never have imagined.
Personally I suspect the USA will be fundamentally changed by this. The trick may be to try to make those changes for the better. But just relying on the current norms to guide how is not going to work.