Will the real Joe_Cool ( and Jersey Diamond ) please stand up

I admit that these two threads have left me at a bit of a loss. I’ve met Joe_Cool and Jersey Diamond on two occasions, and I like both of them. Actually, it’s kind of humorous. When I met them last year, for some reason the idea that Jersey was black stuck in my mind. She’s not, and when I tried to explain ( in my bumbling, drunken way-hey it was late at NYC fest) that I had made a mistake, both of them proceded to tease me mercisely about “Joe’s black wife”. From this I got the impression of a couple of pretty cool, fairly laid back people.

On the bords they come off far differently.

So. On one hand I have two people with whom I’ve enjoyed interacting with, people I would be proud and pleased to call friends, on the other I have two…marienettes is the best I can come up with, married to a rule book and absolutely inflexible and unforgiving if anyone says or does anything that they see as challenging (even when it’s not) their chosen way of life.

Never has the dichotimy between RL and the 'net been more aparent.

I don’t know what to make of it. I’ve tried to couch my replies in the linked threads as honest questions, because that’s what I think they are, but they’ve been blown off. I am pretty sure that if I flew to New Mexico and we all sat down and had a few beers and food the conflict would never come up. I LIKE these people, and even though I personally have little use for Christianity as a rule book, I wholeheartedly support the ideas behind it, love one another and everything else will take care of itself, that’s what I think of when I think of what Christianity should be.

JC and JD do not show that on these boards, and it saddens me. I WANT Christians to live their stated beliefs…hell, I want everyone to do that. The core concepts of Christianity are love and acceptance, just read the book, it’s obvious! The fact that these nice people, whom I like and respect IRL, do not seem to be doing that, based only on their posts here at the SDMB saddens me.

Is there a point to all this? Not really. I just regret that people I like espouse such an unforgiving way of life.

I remember meeting Joe_Cool and Jersey Diamond (briefly) at one of the NYC Dopefests. I hadn’t really crossed paths with either of them on the boards, and hadn’t seen too many of their posts. I didn’t see any sort of behavior that would lead me to believe that they’re not cool people. OTOH, certain Dopers (you know who you are) were coming up to me and saying things like, “Stay away from her. She’s some kind of fundie.”

Of course, I don’t let other people make decisions for me in that regard, so I didn’t actively avoid JD.

That said, I’ve since become more familiar with Joe_Cool’s and Jersey Diamond’s POVs. And I’ve seen both of them put out some opinions that have disappointed me in more than a few ways. And I see how some people on the board have responded.

I’m going to say a couple things here that are probably going to get me flamed…

  1. From what I’ve seen, certain people on this board have a bad taste in their mouth from reading posts from these two. And I think that sometimes, certain people are pretty quick to pile on. As much as I disliked Joe_Cool’s POV in the “In Memory of Daryl” thread, I think certain people were so overly concerned with flaming what they considered to be hypocritical behavior that they put words in his mouth.

  2. Sometimes, I think that in general, we at the SDMB concentrate too much on how we think people should feel. In the “A Serious Question for Joe_Cool” thread, I think folks piled on Joe_Cool a little too quickly. I did agree with Jersey Diamond’s post toward the end of the first page of that thread (save for the part about “misguided beliefs,” which I thought was judgmental). Granted, I thought Joe_Cool made some unsubstantiated leaps of logic concerning his argument as to the selfishness of suicide, but certain folks really piled on in that thread, and I think that some of them were closed minded as to what he was really saying.

  3. Sure, there’s a dichotomy between RL and what gets said on Internet message boards. If at the Dopefests, we simply sat around a big table and debated stuff, it wouldn’t be any fun. So instead, we go to places like Red Rock and get thoroughly sloshed. But seriously, there are things that I say here that would never be said to someone face-to-face in real life. On a message board, one has time to carefully organize thoughts, edit one’s language and construct arguments a little more carefully than one can IRL, when one has to think on one’s feet. (Personally, I can’t be that articulate IRL.) I guess the point of all this is that when we have the time to carefully organize our thoughts and have deep, meaningful conversations, we touch on things that would never come up in a face-to-face conversation. What’s the point of this? I dunno - I guess that when it’s time to debate, let’s head over to GD. When it’s time for a beer, let’s go over to Red Rock.

Red Rock, eh? I thought you were still bitter over the destruction of your nice shirt.

OP: What y’all have said is true in many ways. I’m in a interesting position with it though; I met them before I really read any of their posts.

What they have to say here on the Boards I pretty much never see. I don’t avoid them, but I get no enjoyment out of debating religion any more. Live and let live, let folks do as they wish, I say.

Having met them quite a few times IRL, I like them both very much. They are smart, friendly, and like to party. My kind of people.

Personally, I’m willing to leave it at that and let others do the debating.

If I posted stuff on this board that caused a significant number of people to say “Hey, Desmostylus, you sound like a demented 14 year old kid”, it wouldn’t be a huge leap for others to conclude that I was in fact a demented 14 year old kid.

It is simply not enough for someone that knows me in real life to say “I know Desmostylus personally. Desmostylus is not a 14 year old kid.” I would still sound like a demented 14 year old kid.

Same deal if a poster comes across as a hateful, judgemental asshole. It really makes no difference if someone knows the poster IRL and says “that poster isn’t really a hateful, judgemental asshole.”

Given the manner in which it was destroyed, I think it’s safe to say that I’m not bitter.


Just a few observations, maybe.

First, people communicate differently on message boards than they do in conversations. In conversations, you can read body language, you can adjust your responses instantly to clear up miscommunication, etc. On a message board, what you type just hangs there for everybody to see, and you might not even know people are taking your comments badly until hours, or even days have passed.

Secondly, a lot of people on this board tend not to like Christian fundamentalism, and they seem to be really personal in their dislike. Maybe the concept offends them, maybe they have some more personal reason to dislike it, but it’s Jack Chick who gets pitted on here, not Bishop Sprong. Unfortunately, that also can mean that posters who are fundamentalists, as I believe Joe and Jersey are, tend not always to get the benefit of the doubt, and are pigeonholed into categories. This, obviously, makes the people pigeonholed defensive.

I’ll have to rectify that sometime. I regard Spong as the left’s answer to Cal Thomas, not that we really needed an answer. :rolleyes:

Start one in GD, RT! There’s a lot to be said there, not least the difference between his views and what everyone reads his views to be, thanks to his polemic style. And I know Mars Horizon and I would flock to that thread like vultures to a dying cayuse in the desert. :wink:

Yup! :slight_smile:

And pardon the pun, but

[Hi Jack]
You’ve been replaced - my new favorite author is Thich Nhat Hanh.
[/ Bye Jack]

Going Home - Jesus and Buddha as Brothers might be the most profound book on Spirituality I’ve ever read. You’ve certainly chosen a great person to be your favorite author.

Hey, I’ve got an idea - let’s hijack a Joe Cool discussion into a gentle, polite dialog on interfaith learning and understanding.

it would be an amusing juxtaposition :wink:

The people who we have met at straightdope are wonderful people.
There are only three people that I met at the dopefest that ever ‘wanted’ to discuss what we believe. That includes you, weirddave, dalovindj, and cajunman. I think we can agree that it was actually pleasant, although brief.

The problem, here on the board, is that we are attacked or baited in for an attack when we respond to a question.
It’s a lot different in person. People are less likely to be verablly abusive when they are in from of the actual person they are talking to.

Another thing is that the people who hate us most, are the people who go around whispering “don’t talk to them”, or “they are awful people”, when they are totally clueless. They are the ones that have never taken the time to actually talk to us.

I have never been attacked at a dopefest like I have been on this board. Anyone would try to defend themselves when attacked, right?

I don’t get angry when a person doesn’t believe what I believe. I don’t start calling a person names if he doesn’t see my point. That is what happens to us (not always, but a lot of the time).

In my experience here, there are many that disagree with us and say that we are angry and hateful just because we don’t agree. But they are the ones that get angry and call us “fuckstain” and worse if we don’t “come around” to their way of thinking. We need to keep in mind that not everyone will agree with you all the time. That is just a fact.

Just because people don’t like what we believe does not mean we are hateful. For a person to say “don’t talk to them” or “how dare you say something nice to them”, that is hateful.

I am a human being. I wear jeans and t-shirts, I like to dress us and be a girlie girl, I like to have malibu rum now and then, I cry when I watch The Patsy Cline Story, I cry when I see a car accident with injured people, I like to dance, I get mad, (hold on to your horses) I even cried when I did private care for an HIV positive, hospice, gay man for 9 months, when he died. I sat by the side of his bed, and prayed. I hugged his boyfriend and cried with him.

That’s right - the “uncaring fundamentalist” was the only one in my agency that would take on HIV patients.

THespos, I just wanted to add that I only said “misguided beliefs” because I was showing that that could be said about anyone. It was said to me first.

I think the problem is that people think fundamentalist = people carrying around “you’re going to hell” signs. Maybe we need to not generalize.

Not everyone is going to like and agree with me, and not everyone is going to like and agree with you. I don’t let it hurt my feelings to the point that I would slander someone. Maybe that’s the way we should all think.

After being here for awhile, I realized that some people here are very negative and /or bitter because of something in there life. Some have not said that, but it is obvious.
I try to keep that in mind when getting angry, but some of you need to realize that I didn’t do whatever it is that makes you bitter. Don’t take your anger out on me.

Well JD, I think it all comes down to the conversation I had with you and Joe about judging people by something that is said on a MB.
I have no idea what that was, because I was pretty lit up, but you can be sure it was profound, and my honest opinion.

Jersey, then when you think of Daryl, think of the man whose partner you cried with.

Perhaps that will give you some perspective?

But… but… but… does this mean that Joe doesn’t really know anything about Linux in real life?

Love the fundamentalist, hate the fundamentalism.

Of course there’s no chance that perhaps you two behave differently is there, JerseyDiamond? No, it’s just everyone else who acts differently.

You mean Spong is not a Unitarian?

Huh. :wink:

Well now.

I have to say that if I were ever to go to the US, the only people from this message board I would not be interested in meeting would probably be Jersey Diamond and Joe Cool. Because what I know of what they share on this board means I wouldn’t give them the time of day. The aspects of themselves they feel free to share here are not the aspects of people who interest me.

Very nice, JerseyDiamond. Thanks for the insight!

He’s as Unitarian as Ratziger is Lefebvrist (and more’s the pity)! :slight_smile:

Which is about as far as we can take that one without getting hostile about our respective faiths (hint, hint).