If someone can’t take being mocked they are a very poor advocate for the cause. If the mockery is in fact gratuituous and indiscriminate, the people will eventually weary of it and it will be ineffective.
Mockery is a very effective tool for silencing those who should not be allowed to have a voice. When mockery does not succeed, harassment and threats are used – many antifeminists have been doxxed and harassed.
Many men and some women understand that in USA 2015 there is significant discrimination against men – male victims face severe discrimination, men are discriminated in divorce cases, male offenders get 61% longer sentence for the same crime, male bashing is very acceptable in the media.
Mary Daly refused to let men in her class (she taught at Boston University). Sally Miller Gearhart (professor at San Francisco University in the 70’s) wrote in her 1982 anthology, Reweaving the Web of Life: Feminism and Nonviolence: "The proportion of men must be reduced to and maintained at approximately 10% of the human race.”.
Andrea Dworkin said: “Under patriarchy, every woman’s son is her potential betrayer and also the inevitable rapist or exploiter of another woman,” among other things.
Robin Morgan said, "I feel that man-hating is an honorable and viable political act, that the oppressed have a right to class-hatred against the class that is oppressing them.” She also said the goal of feminism was not “being equal, but to assume the power.”
The rot of misandry in feminism goes back further than just the 3rd wave.
I must be incredibly and miraculously lucky in my personal dealings and readings with feminists and feminism – I’ve encountered virtually zero misandry from fellow feminists. I’m sure there are some feminists who are bigoted against men, but I must have really dodged a bullet (or a million bullets, based on some of your assertions about feminism) by only encountering and dealing with feminists who don’t say or do misandrous (misandrynous?) things.
I didn’t see her (or him) saying that. Since what she actually said is there, why are you putting words in her mouth?
“Constructive challenges”? Are those the only kind that are allowed?
Or are they the only ones you’re willing to take seriously?
Attacking the person is pathetic substitute for attacking the argument. You’ve already said that shaming me doesn’t work - yet here you are working at it again. I have to assume you think, maybe, eventually, it will work.
You’re strawmannirg her argument, which is an especially dishonest tactic.
I’m glad to see, though, that you’re finally acknowledging Tithonus’s actual point - that their willingness to expose themselves to feminist shaming tactics demonstrates their commitment to what they’re saying.
There’s a lot that’s “beyond rational discourse” for you, isn’t there?
Really? What are they?
Being old has its own disadvantages - for example, getting set in your ways. Becoming incapable of absorbing new information. Resisting change. You might remember observing that, back when you were young.
You know LinusK, you have a very salient point here. Providing constructive criticism requires respect, and you have shown you have none in this case. And it’s impossible to respect something you think is fundamentally a poisonous weed that should be destroyed root and branch.
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It can be pointless and pedantic to play what some of us call “Oppression Olympics,” but in this case the discrepancy between this UN group’s complaints and the real suffering of women is too great to ignore. In a world afflicted by female genital mutilation, forced marriages and acid attacks on girls whose only crime is wanting an education, the UN has chosen to focus on the professional whinging of privileged and mendacious western activists.
The UN has always been a joke, but in this case, by providing a platform for such ludicrously entitled windbags, they have provided us all with the punchline themselves.
The underlined part pretty much sums it up for me.
Social groups are not randomly chosen from the population. People associate with other people like them most of the time, when they can.
Or, to put things another way, how many times have you or people in your circle of friends catcalled a random woman on the sidewalk? To what extent does that number inform your opinion of the degree to which catcalling is or isn’t a problem in need of addressing?
And what opinion do you have, in the general case, of the argument “Well, neither I nor anyone whose opinion I care about has complained about this, so clearly it’s just a tiny minority of people doing, if it’s really a problem at all.”?
When I was younger, quite frequently (including myself). This was part of forming my opinion that catcalling is wrong and is a problem in need of addressing.
That’s not what I’m saying – I was responding to an assertion that misandry is part of the root of feminism. I don’t believe that it is at all.