I’m not looking for advice here- I’ve already made a decision about this. I’m just curious as to what others’ thoughts on the subject are.
My best friend is a man. We dated 7-8 years ago for a couple of years. We never said “I love you” to each other, but we spent a great deal of time together, were very close friends, and had amazing sex. Then we broke up and didn’t speak to each other for 5 years. A couple of years ago we became friends again. We spend a lot of time together, and talk on the phone several times a day. We are an integral part of each other’s lives.
He treats me *extremely * well. Right now he’s on his way over to take my car for emissions and tags for the year. Last weekend, it was to change the oil. He takes me and sometimes my kids out for dinner several times a month. He has a key to my house. We get along famously, are always laughing and talking about everything under the sun. He knows me inside and out, through the good and the bad, and (still) loves me and accepts me for who I am. Never tries to change anything about me, is just always there for me no matter what, unconditionally. I am the same for him.
Now, he’s in love with me. He doesn’t talk about it or treat me any differently because I don’t share his feelings, but it’s just known between us that he loves me to the ends of the earth. I love him dearly, too, but “not in that way.” He’s my best friend, but I know that I could never have sex with him again. It’s strange, because when we dated several years ago I had mad attraction and lust for him, but now the thought is repulsive to me.
Last weekend, we went for Chinese food. As we got up to leave and he automatically helped me with my coat (he’s so great like that with all the gentlemanly touches that I’ve come to take for granted), the waitress remarked how lucky I am and how it’s so rare for men to do little things like that anymore.
That got me thinking about how well he does treat me, and how perfectly happy he would be to marry me and strive for my happiness for the rest of his life. I would want for nothing and am certain I would be doted on and made to feel special every single day.
For me, the deal-breaker is the sexual attraction. I know that I couldn’t bring myself to have sex with him even with my eyes closed, and I’m not ready to stop having sex yet.
I’m curious as to how many people would marry someone who they got along with so comfortably and completely yet aren’t attracted to.
It’s trite, but my husband is my best friend. A friend with benefits, sure, but sex definitely takes a backseat to the joy that we take in each other’s company outside the bedroom.
OTOH, in the case of the OP, I can’t help but think of his feelings. You talk about all the great stuff he does for you. I’m guessing that, you do lots of great stuff for him that you didn’t include in your post, but all the same I don’t know that I would want to marry someone whose feelings I did not reciprocate fully. Even if he said that he didn’t care, I’d feel like I was taking away his chance to find someone with whom he could have a more fulfilling relationship.
I completely agree that he needs to find someone that feels “that way” about him. But then, I’m seriously looking for a long-term relationship and I date heavily, so I know that this time in our relationship won’t last forever. Right now he fulfills some needs that I have, including deep friendship, and I certainly give back to him and I fulfill some of his needs. Eventually, hopefully, I’ll be in love with someone, and he’ll have to take a backseat. Wait, that sounds cold. Of course, he’ll always be one of my best friends- but we just won’t have the emotional intimacy that we do right now forever.
We’ve talked about this and he totally understands that our friendship will never reach that level, and I honestly believe he doesn’t pretend to be my best friend and do all these things for me in the hopes of winning me over.
Sometimes I really really wish I could make myself be attracted to him. He really knows how to treat a woman and we get along so well.
I’m just wondering if there are people out there that would forsake sexual attraction for emotional intimacy and being treated very well.
My heart is breaking for this man. He’s in for a very, very bad time when you do meet someone else and he has to “take a back seat”. I’m not blaming you, troublmakr, it’s not your fault he’s in love with you, but it’s clear this is not going to end well for him. I strongly suspect it does hurt him that you don’t return his feelings, no matter what he may say. Even if he’s convinced himself that he doesn’t care, I’d bet on the world to come crashing down around him the day you meet someone who rocks your world the way he couldn’t.
As for the question of the OP, the only way I’d ever marry someone as a friend is if I had absolutely no hope whatsoever of finding a long-term romantic partner. However, it would probably take something pretty traumatic to make me give up like that. Maybe so traumatic that marriage would be the least of my problems. So, barring that, if I ever get married, you’ll know it’s because I’ve fallen real hard for her.
This thought has crossed my mind too. I have a male friend who is incredibly sweet to me and treats me a lot better than any other man I’ve met so far has. He has made it clear he would love to have a romantic relationship with me…but I’m trying to keep it friendly because there is no sexual spark on my side of the equation…never has been.
I wish I could fall for him. It would make everything so much easier if I could just be with him, because I have absolute faith he would never cheat on me or such. I have horrible luck with other men and seriously question if I will ever find someone I can be happy with…so sometimes I worry I will look back years from now, still alone, and regret not taking him up on his offer.
BUT…I just can’t get into a relationship where I don’t feel excited about the person in every way. I think it would be too much like “settling”, which isn’t doing either of us a favor.
I definitely agree that we have to be sensitive to how painful it will be for these men if/when we end up in a serious relationship. My approach has been to be very discreet about my own attempts at dating while encouraging him to continue looking for a woman of his own. I definitely don’t want to hurt him…I know how it feels to have one’s heart stomped on and I can’t bear to do it to someone else.
Don’t end up in relationships because you only want to make the other person happy. I mean, wanting to make your partner happy is essential in a healthy relationship, but it has to make you happy too. You like this guy a lot and really enjoy his company, but your post had a tinge of… pity to it. Pity kills a relationship dead, every time, I think.
Trublmakr, I can’t help but wonder - what’s up with the sexual side of things? You mentioned that when you guys dated before, you had amazing sex - what’s different about the guy now that you “can’t even imagine being able to have sex with him, even with your eyes closed?” It just seems to be two big extreme opposites, and I wonder if there’s more to it than that…what changed? Did he gain a ton of weight? Was he in a horrible accident or something?
I think I’m weird. I’ve never in my life had a situation where a guy was perfect and I didn’t fall in love. I’ve always been of the impression, at least with me, that I could fall in love with any sufficiently nice man, given time.
I don’t think I believe in “the one.” I adore my husband. I love him very deeply. Had we never met, I’d love someone else very deeply.
I did marry him as a friend, in a manner of speaking. We loved each other before we ever met in person. I fell in love with pixels, without benefit of any sort of spark. He could have been an actual under-the-bridge troll and I would still have been in love, though perhaps saving some pennies for some cosmetic surgery.
Freejooky, I did have amazing sex with *this * guy, back when we dated several years ago. I don’t know what happened, that I’m not attracted to him any more. I guess it’s just because I was in my mid-20’s then, and I’m in my mid-30’s now, and I’ve had so many different experiences in that time that I’ve changed alot.
He just left. We went out for Chinese food- I’ve had a craving for it- and we spent some time on the couch snuggling and hugging. He started to get too into it and I had to awkwardly break it and gently let him know that it was time to go so I could go to bed. It’s the first time since this whole thing has started with the “just friendship” that I’ve had to do that. It was not comfortable, and it kind of made me realize that spending so much time with him and depending on him so much may be giving him the wrong impression. Hmmm. We’re so solid that I can’t picture anything changing, but then again, I may have to prepare myself for a confrontation.
Maybe, like my friends say, I just want a boyfriend without the sex part. Sex being very important to me, I can’t imagine that’s the case, but it’s something to thing about.
My advice…
If you do not share the feeings you owe it to him as a friend to walk away and let him have a chance elsewhere. If things truly are meant to be you will go after him.
My wife and I have a history of sixteen years of on again off again relationship with a 20 year friendship, so I know where you are coming from. Hell she would be a better source of an answer but I’ll give it my best shot seeing as I can identify from his side of things.
To be brief My wife and I were friends for the longest time and had a few flings and some rough break ups with each other. Only after a long absense did we both truly find that we loved each other and that has lead to what I would consider a very happy marriage.
To me the friendship is important, and any real realtionship can only survive with that. Those who marry in the heat of passion and what they precieve as love without the real friendship, cannot last. But a friendship without love or desire for intimacy is just as doomed.
If one person feels the love and the other does not it is unfair to keep stringing things along. Take time apart. Let the other person have the oppurtunity to go on their own without the illusion something may happen. Damn they need a chance to find happiness that you can not give them. I’m not condemning you as you can not make yourself love or want a person. But I think if you are truly his friend you should do the most painful thing and break the friendship to let him know he has to look elswhere for that type of relationship.
Give it a good long time, you don’t want mistake missing the stability and comforts of the friendship for a feeling of love. If, in that break, you discover you really do feel Love for this person beyond the friendship then go and actively persue them.
The situation you describe sounds unhealthy in that though you may not know it he will not be able to split the frienship from his feelings of Love. They are intertwined and even if he verbally agrees that nothing could happen, he will likely put his love life on hold in the chance for something to happen between the two of you.
You know the cornball saying about if you love something let it go… Well in this case let it go.
It sounds like a recipe for disaster right now. The poor guy thinks things are going well, and to be honest, he must be a saint to have waited this long for the sexual side of things to happen again.
If you really love him, but don’t think you can have a full relationship with him, do the right thing now. Break up. Don’t ruin any chance he has at finding the perfect mate.
I thought your OP was more, “not me, but what do you think” but now it is clear you are contemplating “settling” for a nice guy. You know it is not going to end happily.
Seriously. Lay it on the line and end it now. Anything else is selfish on your part.
Speaking as a guy who’s been in a vaguely similar situation, this latest development does concern me, as I’m sure it does you, trublmakr. I thought I was OK having a “just really great friends relationship” with T, but the snuggling eventually led to my crossing the line. I know I’m projecting and I don’t want to offer you unwanted advice or pretend to be reading his mind, but it sounds like the snuggling is likely to be confusing for him emotionally/subconsciously.
As to the OP, I wouldn’t marry someone I didn’t want to have sex with if I knew she wanted to have sex with me but was sacrificing that desire for the sake of the relationship. Also, I’m not quite to the point in life of giving up on having sex, and I would not feel comfortable going into the marriage with a secret or stated plan to have sex outside the relationship.
I might well be tempted, though, having lived alone nearly all of the 28 years of my adult life. Having an intimate, caring friend around all the time could be nice.
On preview:
I holding back before from saying something like this, kingpengvin, and I don’t think I would have said it as well. I can say that T was reluctant to make her boundaries firm and took along time to get to the point of pushing me away, which I must say made it more painful when she did. But I was definitely better off for it.
It’s just my opinion, but it does come from experience. I’d have my wife give her side of the story, but she gets quite grumpy when I wake her. I’ve known her long enough to avoid that dangerous situation.
Our favorite Movie was When Harry met Sally. It is corny but in many ways the overall situation semed to apply to our history.
I’ll say one thing, when I compare a few of my married friends situations to mine I feel (possibly unjustifyiably) smug in that they like to spend their free time with their “buddies” and talk about time with their spouse as a chore, whereas I could see no one else I’d rather spend an evening with. And that’s after knowing her for almost 20 years. I’m hoping it stays that way for another 40 or more.
It has its advantages… but the Love and intamacy has to be there for both parties.
I don’t really think he thinks things are going well. Tonight I’d had more to drink than I have in a long time, and like almost any man would, I think he thought maybe he’d go for it and see if he had a chance. Tonight’s gropings were not typical by any means between he and I. He really seems to have accepted that we’re not dating and never will be and are solidly classified as “friends.”
Now, however, I’m starting to realize that he does need to stop spending so much time with me and start dating. I don’t think I will like it, and that prolly makes me sound like a bad person- I don’t want you and I don’t want anybody else to have you either- but I’ve just grown so dependent upon his friendship! So that’s something I need to think about and work on. He does deserve to be in the relationship that he desires.
Don’t believe it for a second. As I have said, once he has feelings beyond friendship those become part of his feelings towards the entire relationship. He will not completely accept there is no chance. He will believe that under the right circumstances you may change your views especially if you have had a past.
He will hang out that hope and things will continue with the tension below it.
If you truly value the friendship then you must value your friend’s well being. That means you must make the sacrifice for the both of you.
Maybe because I’m a guy I don’t understand one thing. If you like the guy so much “even as a friend” why not have sex with him and see how it goes? Somehow it seems that many women assume that having sex means that the man will be irrevocably attached emotinally. In fact, it’s been my experience both through personal experience and through observation that men are often no more (and in many cases) less attached after having sex with a girl than we are before. If you “did” the guy a few times (or even once) it would probably mean more to him than you can imagine. Maybe, you would even find that you had an attraction that you didn’t realize. At the very least I’ll bet he could walk with a great deal more self confidence and satisfaction.
I know that you say you’ve changed, but you once found this guy attractive by your own post. Has he changed dramatically? Has he gained a great deal of weight, lost his hair or otherwise become less desireable and the fact that you find this less attractive (or even repulsive) causes you some cognitive dissonance (because deep inside it bothers you to judge people so superficially)? If this is not the reason what is the reason that you don’t find him attractive (you don’t have to answer me, but answer for yourself).
For me this post is personal. When I met my wife it was on the rebound (from the love of my life) and was strictly for casual sex. I wasn’t particularly attracted to her (another difference between men and women since men can make it with a sheep if circumstances warrant) but she really dug me. It’s ironic that ten years (and a hundred pounds) later I am attracted to her, and she less so to me (she was heavy then and is still that way today, I’m the one who gained). I’ll tell you what though even if I wasn’t attracted to her and the love of my life came back and was now a millionaire wanting to make me a kept man, I wouldn’t consider the deal. That’s because my wife is so much more than her physical persona. Not only is she smart, witty, compassionate and a great mother she is the spiritual force which gives me light even when it seems as if the world is a dark cave. She has placed faith in me against all reason and stuck with me though shit that no woman should have to endure. If your guy is anything like my wife then it would be a tragedy for both of you to miss out on the life that it could lead to. Consider one possible alternative. You ditch this guy and instead meet a guy that “gets you hot”. Unfortunately, to him you are primarily someone who “gets him hot” rather than the spritual focal point of all he wants from a woman in this world. Which guy is more likely to cheat on you, put you second to golf, poker ect and be a lousy father to your kids? Which guy do you want at your side when YOUR looks begin to fade in your 40’s or 50’s (as they do for everyone eventually)? To your current man you will be JUST or even MORE beautiful when you are seventy as you are today to some future “guy who makes you hot” you may be little more than a once hot broad who saw her better days many years ago.
Honestly, I think you owe it to this man to be honest and tell him straight out that you don’t have any feelings for him romantically. Otherwise, he just might be thinking there’s a possibility. I understand you say you are “dependent” on this friendship, but quite frankly, that’s a pretty shitty way to treat someone you KNOW has feelings for you. Stop stringing him along.
And no offense, but you really shouldn’t snuggle with him on the sofa right now. If that were me, and some guy I had a crush on was snuggling with me, but only liked me as a friend, it would definitely make me want something more.
Roland, that would be pity sex. No one is going to feel more confident if they realize someone is sleeping with them out of pity.
Guin, I am in no way stringing him along. I’ve been honest and upfront about my feelings for him the whole time. He’d have to be a total idiot to think there was a chance, and he’s not. I’m extremely perceptive and sensitive to other people’s emotions, and there’s not been one hint from him that he’s under the impression there will be something more in the future.
This man has a long history of close friendships with women. His best friend when I met him was a woman, and I know for sure they never slept together. He’s a man that respects and loves women ALOT, be they friends or lovers.
I agree the snuggling was not, in retrospect, very wise. But then again, we’re quite affectionate and we hug alot. We both realize that human beings need to touch other people, and since neither one of us is romantically involved, we fulfill some of that need with each other, but not in a sexual way. Last night I do believe that alchohol was a big factor.
I did have sex with him a few months ago, just to see how it would be. Years ago he was the best I ever had, but now he’s the worst I ever had. Being attracted to someone is VERY important in my sex life- it makes all the difference.
It’s too bad, really, that he’s not the “open marraige” type. He’d be the best husband I could ever hope for, but I just couldn’t have sex with him. I just couldn’t.
