5 hours and you pick that drivel to reply to?
Once again…
WHAT Lies, corruption, illegal activities, and deceipt??? Again, you may, or may not have valid complaints, but how are the others in this thread to know what they are, if you don’t state them and provide back up documentation for them??
Some facts and proof to back up your accusations, whatever it is that you’re accussing him/them of, would be nice.
Thank you, but I must be honest and say that I don’t agree with much of what *you’*ve posted in this thread.
Frankly, I don’t get the feeling s/he was saddened by it. The impression I get, from the easy way s/he slides it into a rambling, generalized political rant is that it’s “another reason to hate Bush.” And I find *that * wrong.
Christ, you must either be about 15 or unbelievably unobservant, or the fact of hysterical chicken-little morons climbing out of the woodwork shouting “this is the worst president in history!” about every single president we elect would be very, very old hat.
Ummmm…no. That would have been Clinton.
Besides, there isn’t anything else to vote for. The Democrats, and what passes for their platform, is a joke. Gods know i am very unhappy with Bush, but it’s not like the Democrats are pushing a viable option.
And this is the bottom line, when it comes right down to it, we don’t vote because we think that any one candidate is so great, but because he’s the least of the evils from which we’re forced to choose.
well let’s see.
He lied when he said Iraq was a threat.
He lied about their possession of WMD
He lied about supporting our troops (then cutting benefits and hazard pay among other things not to mention failing to equip them properly in the first place.)
He lied about the long term costs of his tax cuts.
He lied and kept others from revealing a 100 billion dollar difference in his new medicare plan.
He lied about virtually every reason for going to war. calling Saddam Hussein a threat to both ourselves and his neighbors as well as lying about the weapons themselves and about Iraqi capabilities such as their “drone” planes and their ability to project biological and chemical munitions to the United States.
He lied about Syrian involvement.
He lied about Iranian involvement
well I could go on and on but maybe we should try a new tact.
Can YOU name anything (program, initiative, war, etc.) that he did NOT offer untruths and misleading rhetoric to support?
Anything?
Let’s see:
The Skipper
American Maid
Quint Essence
Looks like 2 liberal asshats and one conservative asshat. I guess they’re right… this is a left leaning board.
(Oh, and The Skipper, two quick comments:
(1) You believe that Al Franken doesn’t believe Al Qaede even EXISTS? Cite?
(2) Yes, Clinton got a blow job. But that didn’t tie up the country for two years. The hysterical investigation and impeachment trial related to that blowjob is what tied up the country. Granted, it was incredibly stupid for him to do it, and even stupider to weasel around dishonestly about it, but to blame him exclusively for teh morass that resulted is idiotic)
I know where you’re comin’ from there, Bob. Every one of these over the top OP’s drives me a little closer to voting for Bush.
AmericanMaid: I’m very sorry for your friend’s loss, but:
A Humvee is not suited to carrying the type of armour that would be required to protect against an RPG. Tank type vehicles can and do carry such protection. Remember, the Hummer is a replacement for the old Army Jeep. It’s designed for transportation, not combat. I don’t think there’s any way to have transportation vehicles designed for full combat activity.
Well, certainly not be armored and have all the capabilities Humvee’s have…reconnaissance, fast patrols, etc. There are APC’s which are armored and are essentially for transport, but they don’t have nearly the range of capabilities of a Humvee.
Is this part a joke?
Says the guy who thinks Fox News, Bill O’Reilly, Mike Savage, and Sean Hannity are the only news sources worth believing. :rolleyes:
What’s next, an objective report on the benefits of racial segregation from Strom Thurmond?
Christ, doesn’t anyone else realize what a stupid argument this is?
If Bush was involved in the discussion of how to place armor on HMMWVs then I’ll be disappointed, much like I’d be disappointed if Clinton was involved in what navigation systems should be on the CT-43 VIP aircraft that flew Commerce Secretary Ron Brown into a mountain.
Yes, people died in both cases, but should the President really be responsible? If you say yes then you know nothing about leadership.
It’s called delegation, and choosing the right person for the job.
Move on people, and get some rational discussion please.
…
The Skipper made some very valid points. Too bad he had to post some really stupid ones.
Come off it. Even the government has said they do not support this. You are being more Bushista than Bush himself which is a clear sign of fanaticism.
He was definitely coerced but there are troubling signs which indicate it may have been staged by the Israelis. It does not change the nature of the conflict. The Israelis are not all good and the Palestinians are not all bad.
I think you are an asshole.
Yep, I definitely think you are an asshole. Very much an asshole.
The standard version of the HUMVEE uses aluminium, fibreglass, or kevlar door panels from what I’ve researched. This is for the sake of mobility and speed, which are kind of essential to the purpose of the HUMVEE. The decision not to put armored doors on them was NOT that of Bush, nor may it even be wise to do so. Every bit of weight you add on to a vehicle is going to decrease manuverability and quickness. I’m sorry, but these are basic facts of physics and military design, and in any event even if you question the balance between armor/weight on the HUMVEE, this is not fucking Bush’s fault!
The Boston Globe has an interesting article on this. Here are some quotes:
Increasing the weight of a vehicle from 6,000 pounds to 9,800 pounds is a pretty serious business. Without a corresponding engine upgrade, I can’t see how these things would behave that well relative to the lighter, quicker ones.
Given that the main purpose of a land mine is to explode under a vehicle or person, I’m trying to see how much of the armor is going to be that effective anyhow, but I’m not a military designer. Nonetheless, I do know that it does take a serious amount of armor to adequately defend against land mines - possibly more than a HUMVEE engine can really move effectively.
But who is responsible? Bush? Has any sitting president gone line item by line item through any 10,000 page appropriations bill to micromanage things of this small of cost? Would it even be in legislation, or just under general military funding?
“Army Officials” weren’t interested. Does that mean Bush, directly?
(emphasis added)
Armoring the HUMVEES was a trade-off. In the initial parts of a desert war, you need light, fast, troop transports. You also need armored personnel carriers and tanks too. You need a range of vehicles to suit the needs and get the job done.
Reaching for straws like this to show how Bush is history’s greatest monster is not intellectually honest. It’s partisan slurs meant to inflame an ignorant populace, that I would think would have been decried or at least questioned by intelligent persons on “both sides” of the election, but oh well…and it happens way too often here in this forum and on this Board, and I’m tired of it, even though I do dislike and distrust Bush.
Hey, you misogynistic little bedwetting piece of shit, do you want to take this woman on “over analyzing military matters”? Just come on down and pick your topic. Or maybe you want to withdraw that dumbass phrase up there? :mad:
“Bitter”, party of one, your table is ready!
I hate George Bush and what he stands for as much as any other red-blooded American, but Dude, find your “return” key. My attention span can’t take the stream of conscious writing…
Skipper, if you re-read my original post, I said I had just seen Jon Stewart’s stand up routine and passed along a funny line. I actually get my news from CNN, the BBC and NPR thank you very much. Where do you get yours from?
I believe Al Qaeda exists (psst, you spell it this way. No “u”). I have read many articles about their beliefs and history. Plus, I awake and conscious on 9/11. Do you have a cite that Michael Moore and Co. don’t believe in Al Qaeda? From what I’ve read, they do believe.
I do admit that I didn’t like Bush before my co-worker lost her son but her loss fueled my dislike even more. She is still a Bush supporter and Republican. We have very good talks about issues. I think my frustration and this being the Pit made me foam at the mouth a bit. 
However, I firmly believe Spain did not play into terrorist’s hands. They voted out a government that didn’t take 90% of the population’s views into consideration. That’s not kow-towing to terrorists. It’s democracy. You know, that thing we’re trying to set up in Iraq? 
I asked my co-worker about the Humvee issue due to all the data and assertions that have been given in this topic. She says that armoring Humvees does weigh it down a lot. So much so that they cannot be air dropped. The way she explained it, in traditional war there’s tanks in the front and support vehicles behind. That’s the war the U.S. military equipped for in Iraq. But since it’s guerilla warfare over there, that isn’t how fighting exists. There’s no neat lines advancing. Also, she told me that she knows for a fact that the ceramic plates on armored Humvees can hold back an RPG attack.
Skipper, if you apologize for that women crack, there’s no hard feelings.
< adds Quint Essence to the list of liberals too fucking stupid to tell the difference between a rant and a greate debate>
Why don’t you people start these threads in the pit where they belong? For god’s sake… but hey, I do have a new idea for a Great Debate " Why are so many liberal too fucking stupid to tell the dif…" 