The experts disagree or dont know, - as my cites- as opposed to your unsupported opinions- show.
The bulk yes, but even more lend lease to the Allies, even more destroyer escorts vs U-Boots, etc. Materials, but not boots on the ground.
Well, they were- that’s the fact… And historians cannot construct any rational explanation for that.
You really should let this go.
Send some guys to teach the British about lend lease aircraft, and be sure one of them is killed.
Yeah, some 'advisors" fer sure. Those P38’s are tricky, dontchaknow?
Actually, they should have pressed on right after Pearl Harbor.
Pressed on to where and how?
They could have invaded Hawaii and deprived us of our main naval base in the Pacific. What did we have there for defense?
I’m guessing Jasmine is suggesting the Japanese should have tried to invade and occupy Oahu.
But that would have been a bad idea. We’ve already mentioned the logistic problems Japan would have faced supplying Midway. These would have been much worse in Hawaii. There would have been longer distances. Hawaii was a group of islands with a significant population, which would have required a substantial Japanese garrison with much greater needs. And Japan didn’t have a string of bases across the Pacific in December 1941.
Oahu was well defended. Sure many of the planes were gone, but it had lots of shore guns and quite a few troops. And the navy was by no means destroyed.
There were around 30,000 soldiers on the ground (about 25,000 in two Army divisions and the rest Marines), with lots of coastal artillery. Pulling enough troops and transports from their other operations to make an effective attack on 30,000 entrenched troops would be a significant cost. Succeeding at that large of a naval invasion 2000 miles from the nearest major fleet base was unprecedented, and almost certainly beyond Japanese capabilities.
Well, there were 3/4’s of a million people (from memory), though IIRC something like 150k of them were of Japanese descent, if you think that would matter. It’s hard to image a Japanese force in 1941 (or any time) that could have occupied even the main island and overcome that, let alone the military personnel the US had on the island. And then there is the logistical support part, which there is simply no way Japan could have done even if they were completely unopposed in the Pacific, which they weren’t. They didn’t have enough bottoms to supply a garrison on Hawaii large enough to even hold it, let alone use it to do anything.
It took the US years to build the logistics and island supply dumps needed to even consider an invasion of Okinawa, let alone mainland Japan. And this entailed basically destroying the IJN and most of their air craft…and even after that, with Japan on it’s last legs and resorting to sending barely trained children up in suicide planes we still took what would have been massive losses in 1941 to either side.
Tell us again, what was your father’s rank and position in the organization? What particular insight did he have? Was he a high ranking officer among Dugout Doug’s inner core of advisers so he could potentially have some sort of inside knowledge? Or was he a staff driver? Was he enlisted? an NCO?
A low ranking officer? A high ranking officer? You don’t have to out yourself if your father was Lieutenant Colonel Sutherland but where was he in the organization?
In war, the only thing which matches the number of bullets flying is the spread of unsubstantiated rumors, and simply hearing in person from some other guy who heard it three minutes earlier doesn’t give a wild rumor any more weight.
Yamamoto became sick upon hearing the news of the raid and was out for the day IIRC. Other generals also reacted strongly because of the stress of bad news.
When it’s a choice between two options, one well reasoned and understandable given the circumstances and the other a wild, unsubstantiated baseless fifth-hand rumor then you know that anyone else other than you yourself believe the former.
He was a senior sgt on staff. Just FYI, senior NCOs often know more about what is going on than officers. He personally typed some things for Mac and personally ran some dispatches for the General. He sat one room away. He was technically a aide to one of Macs colonels.
While it is true my Dads theory might just be scuttlebutt, it is true that why Mac did what he did is a complete mystery, and tellingly- no inquiry was ever launched. Sure the collapse theory might be the best theory- but they are all just guesses. Mac never told, no investigation was ever held.
If the US public wouldn’t care about the Philippines, but would care about Pearl Harbor, then why not defend the Philippines after Pearl Harbor had been attacked (and a casus belli firmly established? Or is the idea that an attack on the Philippines was expected, and Roosevelt wanted it to look particularly bad, so told McArthur to not prepare for it, and after Pearl Harbor, no one thought that since there was now a definite cause of war that a proper defense wouldn’t interfere with the war?
I didnt say “not prepare” I said “act surprised”. And the Philippines were defended, just that for nine hours Mac did nothing and his staff didnt do much either- that is the mystery. No one knows why.
Yes, if the Philippines were attacked but not Pearl, no doubt FDR would ask for a War. And Congress would likely go along. But with it not being part of the USA, and not a “sneak attack”- how irate would the US public be? Or would they say “just another foreign war”? See, the USA got 100% behind the war due to it being a sneak attack on US lands. Pearl was the very worst thing Japan could have done, short of a attack on the US mainland.
The Phillippines was attacked after Pearl Harbor. Are you suggesting that no one thought that the order to “act surprised” by an attack on the Philippines was no longer relevant? I can believe that such a blunder is possible, but I want to be clear about what you are implying.
Sure, but the shock was deep and again,we dont know why Mac was caught with his pants down.
Thanks.