Yahoo/Geocities Screwing Me. Can they do this?

Factual Questions
1

Ok, as the title says, Yahoo just totally screwed me over and I’m wondering about the legallity of what they did.
So about three years ago I signed up for a free webpage at Yahoo/Geocities. I didn’t use it much until last Friday when I decided to upgrade it to the starter business pack at 11.95/month. So I sign into my account, give them all my information and sign up with no problem. I get a confirmation email and everything seems fine. Except yesterday morning I checked my bank account. Sure enough there’s the 11.95 transaction…but there’s another charge for $124.74…It was done at the exact same time/date as the 11.95. Of course I’m going wtf is going on? I called them yesterday on my lunch and it took nearly my entire lunch for even THEM to figure out what the charge was.
Apparently, at some point, I’d signed up for something called GeoPlus which was $4.95 a month. Well June of 2001 my credit card on file started declining the payments. It’s a credit card I’d closed about then. So anyway, the email they have on file continues to bounce back their emails about the charges. So instead of closing the account they left it open for TWO years. Two years the charges kept accumulating. I had NO idea this was going on. So what happened, when I upgraded Friday, they took my different, updated credit card and just charged the full amount without my consent or without even telling me.
My question is, is this legal? Without being able to contact me or charge the card, they should have closed the account after a few months, right? And I logged onto Yahoo Billing to see the charges last night and all the invoices going back to 6/01 show the payments as being made on each individual month and not a lump payment. I’m really mad about this obviously. They completely drained my account and put me in a bind. I didn’t have time to talk to the more yesterday but I’m calling my bank today to dispute the charge. Do I have any legal standing on this?

2

IANAL, but surely there’s a breach of contract clause in the agreement you signed for using the service.

Even if you can’t prove that you cancelled the service, by not paying for it you were in breach of contract, which - usually - should lead the termination of the agreement after a certain period of time has elapsed. Once the contract has been terminated they can only bill you for the period when the contract was in force (plus any default interest). I think to continue charging you for two years is a bit steep.

Do you have a copy of the agreement?

3

No…no copy. It was from over two years ago when I signed up for the webpage. I’ve got to fill out a dispute form. I mean this is completely wrong… They can’t charge me that and then postdate all the charges and invoices! Argh very mad.

4

If this isn’t settled by the time you get your credit card statement, be sure to notify your bank that you’re disputing that charge. This sounds pretty stinky to me, and I’ll bet if you make a big enough fuss, you can get the charge rescinded.

5

Oh I am disputing it. I’m going to fax the dispute form to my credit union on Friday along with an explanation about what’s going on so Yahoo won’t give them some crap.

6

Is the service still available? Try going to the page where you can sign up for it, and go through the procedure without actually giving it the final okay. At some point there should be a list of terms and conditions that you have to agree to. Maybe it’s the same as when you signed up originally. Then you can cut and paste it into a text file (and maybe post a link to it on here)…

7

I’m also wondering about the legality of charging a different card, when you authorised a debit from that card under a different heading. It’s a bit like someone just reaching into your open wallet as you stand at a shop counter buying something.

Surely if they feel you owed them money they should have sent you a payment demand substantiating their claim. I think to just remove money from your bank account without your express authorisation would require some kind of court enforcement order, otherwise they could just as easily walk into your house and repossess your TV, for example.

8
      • I am rather wondering why you decided to even buy such services from a company as big as Yahoo and as ineffective as Geocities. I kept my local ISP when I got Charter broadband. I don’t use the Charter email for anything and don’t even know if Charter included any web space with the account. I just use the internet access, that is all. If I have a problem with my website or email from the local ISP, I can call the one (!) secretary at my ISP who then connects me with either the one hardware guy or the one web services guy. Or on Saturday there’s a third guy who is kind of both. Or I can drive fifteen minutes to the actual office, and bother them in person.
        ~
9

Ok, I did what you suggested and was able to get the terms of service for the Geoplus thing. I’m not good at legal talk but it looks like to me it says they have the right to cancel the account when payment is not made… here’s the link to the terms.

And as to why I bother with them, I just do. I probably won’t after this though but my ISP changes so much I never bother with using their services.

10

“In addition, Yahoo! may immediately terminate your Premium Services for any failure to follow the Agreement by you. Such termination of your Premium Services may result in the deactivation or deletion of your Yahoo! Geocities web site,…” (emphasis added)

From what I remember from legal environment, a contract is binding unless a clause is met that terminates it (the escape clause). If it said Yahoo will terminate your account, then they would have terminated the contract. As long as they kept upholding thier end of the contract (i.e. providing access to the site) then they can legally keep billing you for it, even if you aren’t paying. It’s thier decision.

About the different credit card numbers, a contract is inherently between two individuals. The contract doesn’t mention the credit card number so since the means of payment aren’t specified, it would be implied that as long as yahoo knows the money is coming from you, they can take it.

Admitidly, legal environment was a long time ago, so take that with a grain of salt.

11

I’m sorry, but this sounds a little rude to me. Questioning the OP’s choice in service providers doesn’t help in resolving the issue with the service provider, and comes across as, “Well, you shouldn’t have done business with them anyway.” I’m not saying you meant it that way; it just strikes me as an inappropriate remark to make right now.

12

Here’s a more detailed version of the clause quoted by philfromfsu (by following the “terms of service” link from the link posted by Yuki):

Having said that, I still think it’s very cheeky to continue billing for two years without so much as a demand for payment and then debiting it without warning. Maybe this kind of behaviour can be construed as not being in the spirit of the law.

It also has a clause about jurisdiction in the event of a dispute. Are there any California lawyers out there?

13

I was actually in California when the account was opened and just recently moved here to Arizona (although it’s back to Cal soon enough). I’ve put through a dispute with my credit union about an unauthorized transaction. I really don’t know what else to do. My student loan payment just bounced because of this too…