I’m starting to get pretty serious about my job hunt, so I’m lining up references. The personal ones, no biggie – but the professional ones are a little trickier. I’ve been in my current job for 14 years, and would prefer that we leave my current boss out of it until an actual offer is iminent. Her predecessor was my boss for only a year or two (so, obviously, this was well over ten years ago), and though he’s a nice guy who I’m friendly with, he hasn’t seen me in action with any of my current responsibilities. My boss before that is someone I worked for from '88 to '91 – though he was a reference during my last search, that relationship is a bit outdated now.
I’ve lined up a freelancer I’ve been working closely with for 13 years (pretty much a peer relationship), plus a former underling who still does freelance stuff for me, who I’ve known for 10 years. What do I do for a third professional reference? Do I need a third? Or can I just say “I’ll give you my boss’s name and phone number when you’re just crossing the t’s and dotting the i’s before making an offer”? (NB: I’ve done a lot of hiring in my current job, so I’m not completely clueless – but we’re not usually looking at anyone who’s still in a job they’ve held that long, plus we don’t usually check references until we’ve decided we want to make an offer.)
Hm. My first thought was “no way” (it’s a very small department, and the folks currently below me haven’t been here long enough to have any credibility about describing what I do, let alone how well I do it; and the main person at my level doesn’t like me particularly) – but now that you mention it, there’s one person at roughly my level who a) wouldn’t be surprised to know I was actively looking, and b) wouldn’t rat me out to our boss.
Many big companies do not allow current employees to give references for current or past employees. The ones you gave sound good. Is there anyone in an organization you volunteer for, or something like that? It would not be a technical reference, but it would be good for things like meeting deadlines, responsibility, and leadership.
Do they want a personal reference? I’ve never used one - I can’t see why an employer would care what my mommy or a drinking buddy thought of me.
I think potential employers understand that you need to keep your job search confidential. This eliminates using anyone you currently work with as a professional reference, so just having two should be fine.
References probably aren’t as important as you think. In my massive job getting experience, most companies only check them when they are about to make you an offer. Then, they just make sure that nothing terrible pops up. I refuse to give out references until an offer is close and that isn’t uncommon. You usually don’t need 3 references . Companies realize the limited value of having hand-picked people speak up for you although they try to read between the lines.
I have been at my current job for three months. They hired me without reaching any of my references because I told them to hurry and they were also in a hurry.
My second week on the job, someone from HR called and said they needed to check references "just because we have to. Give us anyone’. I just told them to call one of my new coworkers sitting beside me. That was that.
Send me your resume, an outline of what you’d like me to say, and a fifty-dollar bill, and I’ll tell potential employers that I’ve known you forever, and you’re the best thing since sliced bread.
When I was going through this process, there was no way in hell I would use my supervisor as a reference. So I went to people that I considered my internal clients within the company – but anyone with whom you’ve had a pleasant, productive and hopefully close working relationship will work fine. I also threw in a former coworker and supervisor from a previous company, but my new employers didn’t call them
They did call my colleagues, though, and I know it helped them make their decision to hire me (but as Shagnasty indicates, that only happened when I’d already gotten an informal offer from them). Not all prospective employers may use references, but having them can certainly help.
Hell, if I decide to go that route, my best friend will charge a lot less – and actually have a little plausibility. (He’s a writer, and I’ll occasionally look over and comment on an article for him before he submits it.)
I did that for a roommate several years ago (well, without the $50 charge). We had a seperate phone line for our Internet connection which, of course, nobody ever called, so we gave them that number.
When the phone finally rang, I knew it could only be the potential employer, so I cheerfully answered with “Southern Consulting Services, how may I help you?”
The glowing (almost over-the-top) praise I rattled off seemed to work. My roommate got the job. The guy was more than qualified for it, anyway - he was just completely devoid of professional references.
The hardest part of the process was stifling my laughter when the employer thanked me profusely for giving up my valuable time (which, unbeknownst to her, consisted mostly of smoking dope and playing Nintendo 64 games).
With the exception of the general HR number (that only gives start date, salary level, and position title), I’ve never given out reference names of people I still work with until I have an offer. I think most employers understand that. When I got my current job, they asked if they could contact my then present employer once I had an offer. I said that was okay, provided I did have the offer. They never called.
I would be a bit wary of giving out the names of people who have worked for you as a freelancer or consultant (I wasn’t clear from your posts if they worked for you or just with you). Since those people depend on you for future work, there may be a perception that they’re pressured to give a good reference. I say this because a recent applicant to our company gave out several names of people she’d hired as freelancers and only those names. There was some discussion about how it was wrong of her to put the freelancers in that position.
References are a weird thing anyway. I can see checking up with HR to make sure you really worked where you say you did. But you can’t really call someone’s current boss to get an appraisal of them before giving them an offer. So you’re stuck with the names people give you–and they’re not about to give you the names of people who hated them.
The one peer freelancer would have the same amount of work if I were here or if I weren’t – I’m (in one sense) merely the contact person, someone else would be doing the same things I do if I weren’t here.
The former underling/current freelancer is also someone I consider a friend – when I asked him if I can use him, his response was “about damn time you got the hell out of there.” So, no, I don’t think there would be any weird tit-for-tat dynamic about his being concerned about the work drying up if I were gone.
For current coworkers – I’m not going to put the one guy on the spot by asking him to do it – and, as I said in my OP, I’m not going to give my boss’s name until it’s a total formality. So, for the third, I’m actually thinking fairly seriously about asking my best friend to fudge our relationship a little. One of my listings is as “freelance editor/proofreader, 1987-present,” which is mostly about papering over a couple of gaps in my employment, but also reflects the fact that I occasionally do one-shot jobs, freelance gigs, favors for friends, etc.
Thanks for your responses, everyone – I truly do appreciate getting some outside perspective on this.
