Capt. Typho Clone scene (AOTC Spoilers)

[Morbo]

OK, I have *just* returned from seeing AOTC again, and I am 100% convinced that in the scene where Obi-Wan is being shown the clones, and it shows the adult clones eating, that they are, indeed, Capt. Typho, NOT Jango Fett.

I was on board with all the other posts as to why they really were Jango Fett, (I can't seem to find the info in those threads b/c they're too big), but with this viewing fresh in my mind, they are clearly Capt. Typho. Why this is, I have no idea, and it makes zero plot sense, but I can't ignore what I saw with my own eyes.

(One funny "in" scene I noticed this time was that Jango Fett bumps his head as he enters the Slave I right when they leave Kimino - kind of a humorous reference to the famous goof in Star Wars when that Stromtrooper bumps his head on the door, since they're all cloned from Jango...)

[Troy McClure SF]

I thought I saw Jango do something odd when he reached the top of the ramp!

[Mr. Green Fool]

I think it might be more of a reference/in-joke to Chewbacca hitting his head on the fuzzy dice of the Falcon in ANH.

And at the time I assumed the clones were Jango but after seeing pictures and hearing the discussion they do look like Typho.

[jab1]

Uhm, what about the holo-message Obi-Wan sends to the Jedi council that they are cloning a bounty hunter named Jango Fett?

I think the resemblance between Fett and Typho is superficial and only coincidental.

[Morbo]

I'm not saying there's a coincidental resemblance - I'm saying that in that "adult clones eating" scene, there was no mistaking that it was the exact same actor as the guy that played Capt. Typho. You see Jango a couple minutes later, and it clearly is not that actor - it's the other guy, no doubt about it.

Plus, Obi-Wan doesn't actually *see* the faces of the adult clones, he's just told that they were cloned from Jango Fett. He's up on a catwalk; the camera's point of view shows their faces.

[waterj2]

The kids certainly look like Boba. And I thought Typho the first time I saw it, but the second time it didn't really look like him.

[Kilt-wearin' man]

Dooku, you're smoking crack here. It is NOT the same actor who played Typho sitting there eating - it is Temeura Morrison, who played Jango, and it's a lot of him. The two actors have a resemblance to each other, but the clones look NOTHING LIKE TYPHO. I saw that scene too, and that's Temeura Morrison sitting there, not Jay Laga'aia (Typho).

Besides, if Jango wasn't the genetic source, then why was he there, why had he been paid so handsomely, why would he have wanted "one unaltered clone" as part of his payment? Why would he have wanted a clone of someone else to be his son? (yes, the unaltered clone is Boba Fett - the cloning operation had been going on for 10 years, and the unaltered clone was not given accelerated development. Boba's the only 10 year old around.)

[BlackKnight]

A friend of mine has an illegal copy of the movie already. (How? I have no idea. Probably one of those damned file-swapping things.) Anyway, I asked him to do a frame-by-frame look at the relevant scene. He says that although at first glance Typho and the clones look a little similar, it is clear that they are in fact clones of Jango Fett. He said they looked a bit darker, which makes them appear a bit like Typho, but that is probably the lighting and their facial features are definitely Jango's.

[Munch]

Originally posted by Kilt-wearin' man
Besides, if Jango wasn't the genetic source, then why was he there, why had he been paid so handsomely, why would he have wanted "one unaltered clone" as part of his payment? Why would he have wanted a clone of someone else to be his son? (yes, the unaltered clone is Boba Fett - the cloning operation had been going on for 10 years, and the unaltered clone was not given accelerated development. Boba's the only 10 year old around.)

Why exactly do you think that two batches of clones can't be made at a huge hidden cloning facility?

Do I think there are clones of Typho being made? Yes.
Do I think there are clones of Jango being made? Yes.
Do I think the Jango clones are the stormtroopers? Yes.
Do I think that the Typho clones were ordered by Palpatine? Yes.
Do I think that the Jango clones were ordered by Palpatine? Yes.

Jango clones and Typho clones are not mutually exclusive. They could very well exist at the same time.

[El Elvis Rojo]

At first, when I saw the clones eating, I too, thought they looked a lot like Typho. But at that point, the thought that shot through my head was "Oh, so Typho's a Jango clone and is some sort of spy on Amidala, how interesting." Seeing as how they are played by two different actors, I guess my theory is wrong, but I admit, I thought the two looked very similar are well. Of course, they all have Jango's accent, and I don't remember what Typho sounded like, so any more speculation there shouldn't come from me.

One thing though...clone troopers are clones, Stormtroopers are not. To my (limited) knowledge of the Star Wars universe, at the end of the Clone Wars, cloning became somewhat outlawed, or at least, was no longer in practice on a grand scale. Stormtoopers all sound different, they come in all shapes and sizes, and as we've seen, their battle techniques are a lot worse than the clonetroopers'. Stormtroopers are the Empire's answer to "what are we going to do with all these people?" The Empire has a vast enough control over their galaxy, finding people to be in their army is no problem, and the need for clones is made mute. Why wait ten years for a clone army when you can just enlist a large percent of a single planets population into your army. It's not like they have a choice, the Empire says you're in the military now, you're in the military. Clones at this point become a waste of time and resources.

[Kilt-wearin' man]

Originally posted by Munch


Why exactly do you think that two batches of clones can't be made at a huge hidden cloning facility?

Do I think there are clones of Typho being made? Yes.
Do I think there are clones of Jango being made? Yes.
Do I think the Jango clones are the stormtroopers? Yes.
Do I think that the Typho clones were ordered by Palpatine? Yes.
Do I think that the Jango clones were ordered by Palpatine? Yes.

Jango clones and Typho clones are not mutually exclusive. They could very well exist at the same time.

Why do you think there were two batches of clones? It certainly wasn't even hinted at in the movie in any way, shape or form, except in a case of mistaken identity by some viewers. Why do I think that two batches of clones couldn't have been made? Because Jango Fett was given a home at the cloning facility (presumably so each batch of clones would come from the original), an extremely large sum of money, and a little clone of his very own to call "son" and Typho did none of these (in fact, he didn't do much of anything in the movie...). If Typho was a source of clones, then he wouldn't have been out and about in the galaxy, he'd have had a comfy apartment down the hall from Jango. It was stated that the first batch of clones had just become ready for deployment - that statement seems to indicate that no clones had left the planet yet.

Typho was a glorified extra with little relevance to the story - he could've been anyone in the Naboo defense forces who happened to be assigned to the Senator. There is absolutely no reason to believe that any clones of the good captain are wandering around out there except stubbornness on the parts of some people.

All of you Typho-cloners need to watch the movie again. It ain't him. It won't be him, no matter how hard you wish it was. I saw the movie with a couple of dozen friends, and not a single one of us failed to recognize the clones as being Jango. Typho served one and only one purpose in the movie - to be identified as Padme Amidala's security chief, and to be concerned for her safety after the botched asassination attempts. I'll say it again - nothing in the movie even hints at Typho having been cloned. I wish they'd just re-hired the guy who played Panaka and used that character instead, then this whole issue would've been avoided.

[Munch]

All of you Typho-cloners need to watch the movie again. It ain't him. It won't be him, no matter how hard you wish it was. I saw the movie with a couple of dozen friends, and not a single one of us failed to recognize the clones as being Jango. Typho served one and only one purpose in the movie - to be identified as Padme Amidala's security chief, and to be concerned for her safety after the botched asassination attempts. I'll say it again - nothing in the movie even hints at Typho having been cloned. I wish they'd just re-hired the guy who played Panaka and used that character instead, then this whole issue would've been avoided.

You mean the Padme Amidala that had about 6 clones around her in the last episode? Are you suggesting that its incomprehensible that Padme would have another clone around her in the second episode?

There's just too much connection between clones and Naboo. In Episode I, we saw Padme surrounded by decoys who happened to look just like her. Many people contend that the former Senator from Naboo, now Chancellor, Palpatine is Darth Sidious' clone. Personally, I think there's a connection. It is not unreasonable to think that Typho was a clone planted to follow Amidala.

Just because Jango was given an apartment and an unalerted clone does not mean that he was the only one there. Or even that you have to be there for clones to be made. For all we know, Palpatine could have FedExed the clone planet a sample of Typho's DNA and placed an order. "And how many Typho's would you like, Chancellor Palpatine?" "Oh, I don't know, at least enough to fill up a cafeteria."

I saw the movie with a couple of dozen friends, and not a single one of us failed to recognize the clones as being Jango.

That's nice. The theatre I was in all sighed a collective "was that..?" Pictures on theforce.net suggest to me that the cafeteria clone actually looks exactly like Typho, and nothing like Jango.

And now for some more questions:

Do I think that the man escorting Amidala was made into a bunch of clones? No.
Do I think that the man escorting Amidala was a clone? Yes.

[Achernar]

You actually think that Amidala's handmaidens in Episode I were clones somehow? That is ridiculous. They look alike because that's how they were chosen. If you are skeptical that someone who's hiring can not find enough girls that look similar, then realize that the casting agent for Episode I did it! Those girls were played by different actors. They are not supposed to be identical.

[Munch]

Originally posted by Achernar
You actually think that Amidala's handmaidens in Episode I were clones somehow? That is ridiculous. They look alike because that's how they were chosen. If you are skeptical that someone who's hiring can not find enough girls that look similar, then realize that the casting agent for Episode I did it! Those girls were played by different actors. They are not supposed to be identical.

The IMDB begs to differ:

Natalie Portman .... Queen Padmé Amidala/Handmaiden Padmé Naberrie

[Natural-J-Bankie]

Um...Queen Amidala and Handmaiden Padme Naberrie were supposed to be the same actor becuase Queen Amidala was disguising herself as a handmaiden. Thus in the movie they were the same character. The rest of her handmaidens all look slightly different. Check IMDB again for the actors who played the other handmaidens:

Karol Cristina da Silva .... Handmaiden Rabé
Liz Wilson (I) .... Handmaiden Eirtaé (as Friday 'Liz' Wilson)
Candice Orwell .... Handmaiden Yané
Sofia Coppola .... Handmaiden Saché
Keira Knightley .... Handmaiden Sabé (Queen's Decoy)

[Gadarene]

I still say the shot of the adult clones eating looks more like a bunch of Typhos than a bunch of Jangos--and the pictures at theforce.net bears that out, I think. Anyone have a link to that? Hell, maybe Jay Laga'aia was originally cast as Jango, and they shot that particular clone scene before they went with Temeura Morrison. I dunno--the explanation doesn't have to be canon, but the clones look like Typho, not Jango. For one, Morrison is noticeably older than both the clones in that shot and Laga'aia.

[Tars Tarkas]

how about some picture links of handmaidens? i'd be happy to oblidge!! (i used to play a handmaden deck for Young Jedi)

Rabe
Padme
Eirtae
Sache (big picture doesnt work)
Yane
Sabe (real name of decoy queen)


And i say no Typho clones.

[Munch]

Interesting! I had always been under the impression that all the handmaidens looked just like Amidala. Huh.

But I still say Typho clones (or at least that's the guy that plays Typho, and Lucas goofed.)

[sturmhauke]

Let's see about the Typho issue:
Captain Typho (in background)
Jango and Boba Fett on Slave I
the clones eating in the cafeteria scene
Jango and Obi-Wan on Kamino
Look closely. Jango and Typho bear a superficial resemblance, but Typho's jaw and nose are broader than Jango's. Also look at the hairline. The facial features are a little hard to match up, but Jango's hairline is an exact match to the clones'. As for the apparent age difference, well the clones are younger than Jango. I mean, if you're gonna bother, might as well make them young, right?

[Natural-J-Bankie]

Well see that's the thing. There are various groups of clones all at different ages. Jango looks the oldest, and Boba the youngest. There are also children and adults in the clone facilities that are being trained to be clonetroopers. All of them are clones of Jango Fett (at least if we accept the plot as presented). It is reasonable to assume that since they are not the same age, nor have they gon through the same experiences, the clones are not gonna look exactly like Jango.

Yes, Typho and the clones look very similar.

http://www.theforce.net/episode2/cha...pics/typho.jpg
and
http://theforce.net/humor/pics/cloneforks.jpg
and
http://www.starwars.com/bio/temueramorrison.html
and
http://www.starwars.com/bio/jaylagaaia.html
and
http://www.starwars.com/bio/bodietaylor.html

As you can see the pictures don't really seem to prove anything. The screengrabs from Ep. 2 look very alike, yet the cast photos don't look much alike at all. My best guess is that Jay Laga'aia (Typho) was the actor in the cafeteria scene and Bodie Taylor (clone trooper) is the actor in the clone trooper outfit and we never actually see his face on screen. Typho clones make zero sense, so it must be some filming/casting error. Of course the fact that they would use the worng actor in a scene for a big budget movie make zero sense too.

Why the hell didn't they just use Morrison for the clones? My brain is hurting now.

[Max Carnage]

According to Morrison at Star Wars Celebration II, he was the clones.

[Kilt-wearin' man]

THANK YOU, Max!! Straight from the Fett's mouth...and looking at the photo of the clones eating vs Typho, you can see that their jawlines and noses are different - it ain't the same guy. It's Temeura Morrison.

[Munch]

According to Morrison at Star Wars Celebration II, he was the clones.

Yes, that's what absolutely everyone in this thread has been saying.

Kilt and Max, you're not paying attention. I'm not saying that Jango wasn't made into a bunch of clones. I'm saying that Jango is, in fact, the clones. BUT I'M ALSO SUGGESTING THAT THERE ARE TYPHO CLONES AS WELL! Not necessarily part of the army, not necessarily ordered by Sidious (although that's a possibility), I'm merely saying that there is a scene in AOTC wherein there is a group of clones (not necessarily of the attacking variety) that look like Typho.

[Morbo]

Meh. Looking at the pictures in those links, I'm even more convinced that the eating clones are Capt. Typho.

And again, I am fully aware from a plot standpoint how that makes zero sense. For now.

[Kilt-wearin' man]

Munch we're paying attention. You're insisting that Typho has to be a clone despite the evidence that he's not, and despite the fact that there is no reason for him to be and nothing in any Star Wars movie suggests that he is. We're telling you that there were no Typho clones in the movie. Nor were any of the handmaidens clones of Padme Amidala.

As for Captain Typho's genealogy, he is identified in the novelization as Captain Panaka's nephew, but that's the only "background" this character has. He's a minor character who could've been anybody. There is no reason (other than just being stubborn) to believe that he's a clone of anybody or has been cloned by anybody.

Dooku, I don't see how you could be "more convinced" after comparing photos. Look at the noses and jawlines - they definitely don't look like Typho.

Oh, and the clone trooper that Bodie Taylor played was never seen without his full armor on - he's the guy that was taking direct orders from Yoda at the forward command post. I dunno why Temeura Morrison didn't play him as well...

[Gadarene]

And again, I am fully aware from a plot standpoint how that makes zero sense. For now.

Like Natural J, I still say it's a filming/casting error.

[Gadarene]

Or, conversely, an identification error--that is, it's perfectly possible that I'm just wrong, and the clones in that scene are played by Morrison.

[Munch]

There is no reason (other than just being stubborn) to believe that he's a clone of anybody or has been cloned by anybody.

Correct. But only if you believe that the cafeteria clones don't look like Typho. There are some of us who do, and as of yet, there hasn't been a photo that clearly displays those cafeteria clones as not-Typho.

You're insisting that Typho has to be a clone

No, I'm not. That is one possibility out of several that I've offered.

[Max Carnage]

Sigh. I think it'll be better for my sanity if I don't come back to this thread But you sure would think the novelization would say something about Typho clones if the movie found it so important to show them to us. Oh well...

[Max Carnage]

...(I'm pretty sure Morrison meant he would be SEEN as all the clones [sans helmets], but sadly I can't go back and ask him now)

[Morbo]

:uts hands over ears::

"LA LA LA LA I am not listening to Kilt-wearin' man LA LA LA LA"

I wish it were a case of me being stubborn, but for the life of me, I honestly believe they are Typho in that clone eating scene. The picture of Typho in the link isn't the best one for comparison. Go see it again, and be ready to closely examine that scene, as I did. You may change your mind, as I did.

[Morbo]

$#@!*$ Smilies - GRRR!!!!

[Kilt-wearin' man]

<sigh> We're gonna be going through this for three more years, aren't we? Why the hell couldn't Captain Typho have been some blonde guy?

[Knowed Out]

The answer's obvious. The eyepatch is enough of a disguise so no one notices that Typho is a clone of Jango.

[Morbo]

Oh, and I forgot to mention that Amidala's handmaiden was really a clone of that shape-shifting assassin, which is why.....







....only kidding.

[Munch]

Originally posted by Knowed Out
The answer's obvious. The eyepatch is enough of a disguise so no one notices that Typho is a clone of Jango.

Hey, if Clark Kent can distinguish himself from the most recognizable person in the DC universe with a pair of glasses...

[Kilt-wearin' man]

Originally posted by Knowed Out
The answer's obvious. The eyepatch is enough of a disguise so no one notices that Typho is a clone of Jango.

No, an eyepatch wouldn't be enough of a disguise! He'd at least need a pair of eyeglasses, or nobody would buy him as a mild-mannered defense force officer for a major Galactic senator...

[archmichael]

Jeez, this is one of the most ridiculous AOTC thread I've ever read.

To me the guy in the cafeteria doesn't look like Typho or Jango. They obviously needed an actor who would look like a young Temuera Morrison, 20ish and without the scars. But to take the mental leap that the young men in cafeteria didn't look like Jango, so they weren't, or to say they looked like Typho so they were actually clones of Typho? Come, on! Listen to yourselves.

Why the need to embellish or fabricate another story line? The Kaminoans clearly state that all the clones are of Jango Fett. This is nothing more that the sci-fi movie equivalent of trying to find proof of faked moon landings.

You know what? A lot of those Gunguns looked very similar to each other. Could it be that there are differences that my eyes can't differentiate, or could it be that the Gunguns also use clone technology. Possibly purchased from the Kaminoans.

[Natural-J-Bankie]

Originally posted by Kilt-wearin' man
<sigh> We're gonna be going through this for three more years, aren't we? Why the hell couldn't Captain Typho have been some blonde guy?

Sadly, I think this is true. Typho should have been a CG rendered blond female droid to avoid any confusion, because as we all know, all those similar looking aliens (like Greedo and the Rodian working for Chancellor Palpatine - or Sebulba and the Dug in the diner) are all evil clones.

I hope the intro text for Ep. 3 says "Tyhpo is NOT a clone and is NOT related to the cloning plot elements in any way" and settles the issue once and for all.

I think I'm done with this thread.

[Morbo]

I wish I had an evil clone. I could blame him for everything.

Wife: "Did you track in mud all over the----"
Me: "---Evil Clone."

[sturmhauke]

Looking at the pictures again, I see 3 possibilities:

The clone actor is Temuera Morrison, and it's not plain as day because of the way the shot is set up (lighting especially).

The clone actor is Temuera Morrison, and it's not plain as day because the clones and Jango are made to look different ages through some combination of CGI and prosthetics. There exists software to take an image of a face and change its age in either direction.

The clone actor is some uncredited 3rd actor who looks like a younger Temuera Morrison (unlikely).

The clone actor is NOT Jay Laga'aia. Open my 3rd link (cafeteria shot) and Natural-J-Bankie's 1st link (Typho), each in their own window. Adjust the size of the windows and scroll around so that you only see the center clone and Typho, respectively. You should be looking at two heads in nearly identical orientations. If you still aren't convinced, open the two images in a graphics program side by side, and zoom in on various features. The clone's features are more angular and narrower than Typho's. Examine the hairline. The clone has one sharp peak above the forehead, while Typho has two round peaks.

[The Controvert]

Originally posted by El Elvis Rojo
Why wait ten years for a clone army when you can just enlist a large percent of a single planets population into your army. It's not like they have a choice, the Empire says you're in the military now, you're in the military. Clones at this point become a waste of time and resources.

What would you rather have? Clones of a professional bounty hunter, or a bunch of Pauly Shores?

[Morbo]

Adjust the size of the windows and scroll around so that you only see the center clone and Typho, respectively. You should be looking at two heads in nearly identical orientations.

I did exactly this - I placed both head shots in tiny IE windows, then added a third one of Jango Fett, and compared all three. Call me a crack smoker, but Typho goes to prison if that clone is put in a lineup, and Jango Fett does not. Whether or not this was intentional, and I'm farily certain that it was not intentional, there's no way that clone looks anything like Jango, and he looks almost exactly like Typho.

Lucas probably intended them to look like younger and unscarred versions of Jango, but damn - I sure wish he had gone with a blonde guy for Typho, or stuck with Kastagir...

[Silentgoldfish]

Seriously, a lot of you are coming off in this thread like the people that say all asians/blacks/whatevers look the same.

It's ridiculous what some of you are reading into an actor with a bit part looking slightly similiar to one of the main actors.

No sub-plot, no hidden conspiracy, just two Maoris in a movie.

[Morbo]

WHA--? The RACE card?? You can't possibly be serious, can you? Have you looked at the pictures? I would be offended if your statement weren't so utterly absurd.

Oh, and Jay Laga'aia (Capt. Typho) is Samoan. Temuera Morrison (Jango Fett) is Maori. Perhaps they all look the same to you.

Get off your high horse and get over yourself.

[Silentgoldfish]

I'm not on a high horse, I'm just saying that this has got to be the stupidest Star Wars thread ever. I'd bet money that there is absolutely no connection with Capt. Tycho and the clones.

[waterj2]

Also, I think the idea of the scene being accidentally filmed with the wrong actor, as some have proposed, is simply preposterous. I mean, how would that even happen?

[spiceprincess]

As others have pointed out, Lucas is not the master of subtlety and my impression of the cafeteria scene was that ole George was at it again. It seemed that he specifically showed the clone eating close-up. Earlier he had specifically shown Typho and his eye-patch. At the time I was reminded of Palpatine and the Emporer's chin scenes from TPM. I immediately thought that Capt. Typho was a clone of Jango.

How old is Jango supposed to be? And Capt. Typho. Couldn't Capt. Typho be a young Jango clone?

Either that or as someone posted earlier, they took Morrison and touched him up to make him look younger.

[brad_d]

On very close examination, I can see that Typho and Cafeteria Clone aren't played by the same guy. However, I can hardly blame somebody for thinking that they are given only a quick look. And, no, I don't think that's my all-dark-skinned-folk-look-the-same complex speaking there.

To me, Cafeteria Clone and Jango Fett don't look a damn thing alike. However, since there's no credible reason IMO to suspect that CC is a clone of anybody but JF, I'm willing to write it off as something that just couldn't be avoided.

Is it possible that the Cafeteria Clone is a CGI morph between the actors who play Jango and Boba? Boba is noticeably darker in complexion than Jango, as I recall.

[sturmhauke]

Morphing is definitely a possibility.

[random silliness]
Begun this Cafeteria Clone War has. - Yogurt
Aim your spitballs at the nearest Federation Glazed Donut Hole. - a clone prankster
[/random silliness]