My daughter is depressed & anxious & I don't know how to help her

[astro]

My 22 year old daughter ought to be feeling better than ever. After some struggles in Jr College she pulled her act together, and she's now just entered her Junior year of the local (very desirable) University, she's got a retail job at Macys selling women's clothing, her grades are quite good, she's got a DJ slot on the Thursday night college radio for her avant garde music and...so... life is good right?

Not really, this afternoon she was telling me she has this suffocating generalized anxiety that won't go away and she wakes up feeling tense. She's also unhappy with her body image as she thinks she's too tall at 5'11" and her nose isn't a little dolly button, and she feels like a giant surrounded by these little 5 foot something undergraduate coeds who are 19 and 20 who are like kids to her in their immaturity and fashion sense, and the boys are all boring jocks, and she feels used by her fellow DJ mentor who keeps making her run long distance errands for him, and then criticizes her tastes as being childish.

I told her to focus on the things she can change, to prioritize the things that are within her control, and to let the rest of the worries slide. She told me that I really didn't understand her scenario as this wasn't something she could work her way out of through positive thinking, but is like a wall of low self esteem that blocks her everywhere she turns. I told her I thought she was great, but then she told me I only said that "because I had to" as her father. This got me pretty aggravated as she's been playing the "poor me, I'm not good enough" card since her early teens, and it's rubbed me so raw over time I've got a pretty short temper with that line of thinking at this point.

I told her she's a smart, attractive young woman who was getting things done, and she just needed to stop wallowing in negativity and this self indulgent pity party. I told her people (in general) hated to associate with negative people who were always putting themselves down, and if that's going to be her attitude that people's negative and hostile reactions to her were going to be a self fulfilling prophecy.

She told me I had no clue about her emotional situation and that encouraging her to be self affirming was just annoying her because the sense of anxiety and lack of confidence was something innate and was something she felt she had no control over, and to please just leave her alone.

I have no clue what to do. I had hoped she'd have grown out of this attitude by this point. It's almost like she's getting something out of this self abasing negativity that has no basis in reality.

[twickster]

Stop telling her to control her mood through sheer force of will, and suggest that she see a doctor. Both depression and anxiety can be successfully treated through medication.

[Shakes]

Astro, your doing that classic guy F'd up move.

When she vents, don't try to fix things for her just sit there and listen. (Trust me I know, it's hard sitting there with all the functionality of a brick wall. But whatever, women seem to need it.)

As far as the actual problems she's having; meh, pretty sure this is the norm for most 22yo girls.

[astro]

Originally Posted by Shakes

Astro, your doing that classic guy F'd up move.

When she vents, don't try to fix things for her just sit there and listen. (Trust me I know, it's hard sitting there with all the functionality of a brick wall. But whatever, women seem to need it.)

As far as the actual problems she's having; meh, pretty sure this is the norm for most 22yo girls.

You're right, I should probably just let it go. She's an adult, but even so she's still my little girl and it's real tough just to sit there listening to her talk about her anxiety and self esteem issues without making some proactive suggestions.

[HeyHomie]

I second what twickster said. I started anti-depressant therapy about six months ago, and I can honestly say that I am a new man because of it.

If only I'd had the balls courage to speak up when I first starting noticing symptoms when I was 19ish, I'd be a much more successful person today.

[Elysian]

My dad makes the pro-active suggestions and tells me I'm beautiful. I may shrug it off in front of him but it is much appreciated, and I have the feeling your daughter very much appreciates the things you tell her.

[Captain_Awesome]

Originally Posted by twickster

Stop telling her to control her mood through sheer force of will, and suggest that she see a doctor. Both depression and anxiety can be successfully treated through medication.

Anxiety perhaps, but SSRIs are scientifically dubious, not to say fraudulent, and of little more benefit than placebos.

[racer72]

The folks at NAMI made a big difference in my daughter's life a few years ago when she had some issues she could not handle on her own.

[Haunted]

Wow. I had at least one discussion like this with my Dad when I was younger. I had what turned out to be depression. A crippling, life-destroying biochemical imbalance that almost killed me more than once.

Here's what my Dad said when I tried to talk to him about how I was feeling: You're too smart for that.

Gee, thanks, Dad. All better now.

Take your daughter to a shrink.

[Orr, G.]

I can strongly recommend Burns' Feeling Good Handbook. It's a great intro to cognitive behavioral therapy, and a practical way for her to start gaining control over her mood and breaking away from the feeling that it's something innate. The book looks a bit cheesy from the cover, but the techniques inside are solid and well-tested.

Since the subject is already a sore spot between you and her, you might want to hand her a copy and tell her that this really smart guy online recommended it (a white lie wouldn't be too bad, right?), and otherwise give her some space about the whole thing.

You might find a few sessions with a therapist for yourself to be useful, to help you get a better understanding of what your daughter is going through, and to deal with your "short temper with that line of thinking" which is, while understandable, undoubtedly exacerbating the problem for her. Otherwise, off the top of my head I can recommend any books by Martin Seligman for some insight into depression and anxiety, and how to handle it.

[redtail23]

Therapy.

Face it, Daddy telling her she's great isn't going to do any good. However, a good therapist can help her work through these issues and rebuild her self-esteem and world-view. Look into both Cognitive Behavioral Therapy and regular "talk" therapy.

I'm not a big fan of the medications, although they work great for many people, but a therapist can assist in that area also if needed. But therapy + meds will do a lot more good than just meds.

If this has been going on for a decade, it's obviously not something that's just going to go away - she needs help. Something beyond you gritching at her and telling her to "get over it", which doesn't help at all.

[silvermist]

I was depressed for years. Part of it was the situation I was in but over time your thinking changes your brain chemistry. Antidepressants helped me along with therapy to get my thinking straight.

[Ferret Herder]

Originally Posted by Captain_Awesome

Anxiety perhaps, but SSRIs are scientifically dubious, not to say fraudulent, and of little more benefit than placebos.

There are more antidepressants out there than SSRIs, though. The depressed person's mileage may vary, but Wellbutrin (a norepinephrine and dopamine reuptake inhibitor) was a flippin' wonder drug for me when I was on it.

And yes, CBT may well be a good avenue for her to explore, because it does work on changing those thought and behavior patterns. She may in fact be "getting something" out of her negativity (her version of 'normal', sadly), but it's probably a kind of a feedback loop that she is too mentally exhausted or terrified to stray out of, and she could use some help.

[Heart of Dorkness]

Originally Posted by astro

You're right, I should probably just let it go. She's an adult, but even so she's still my little girl and it's real tough just to sit there listening to her talk about her anxiety and self esteem issues without making some proactive suggestions.

No, I think making proactive suggestions is a good thing - the only problem is that yours weren't. From what you say, it sounds like she's in a classic downward spiral of anxiety and depression. She feels like she's deficient - not good enough, not pretty enough, not successful enough. These are not fun things to feel, and I guarantee, she wants nothing more than to stop feeling them. She seems to realize they are not normal reactions to her life in general, and knows she really shouldn't be feeling this way.

So when you try to cheer her up and point out to her the reasons she should be happy, and ways she should be able to make herself feel better, you only emphasize that she deficient, because she is incapable of doing this thing she should be able to do. When you try to point out that there will be negative consequences if she doesn't change, you're really just salting the wounds. It would be like telling someone who had just been in a horrible accident, "You know, if you don't regain use of your hands, you'll never play piano again."

Bottom line, no one chooses to wake up with anxiety every morning and walk around hating themselves all day. Sure, there are people who are grouchy, antisocial crabs, but they're happy that way, and have no desire to change. She clearly is unhappy the way she is, and so I have to assume that if she could just change her attitude, she would.

I agree with twickster, the best suggestion you can make is for her to see a doctor.

[Minnie Luna]

I was your daughter 11 years ago.

Everything got worse, I had crippling anxiety attacks and did not leave my apartment over the summer previous to my senior year of college other than for class. What did I have to be worried about?, I had a great boyfriend, a great job on campus doing research, a great family and friends.

Therapy and SSRI's pulled me out of it. Get her to a therapist and make an appointment with her regular doc as well so they can work in concert to help her.

I had hoped she'd have grown out of this attitude by this point. It's almost like she's getting something out of this self abasing negativity that has no basis in reality.

Depression and anxiety don't make sense, that is why they are "abnormal" conditions.

As her parent, you can't fix her and make it right. I know you want to, but you need to get her professional help to get this straightened out.

[Shakes]

You guys hyperbole much? Geez..

[Heart of Dorkness]

Hyperbole? Here's what she says:

Originally Posted by astro

[T]his afternoon she was telling me she has this suffocating generalized anxiety that won't go away and she wakes up feeling tense. She's also unhappy with her body image... and she feels used by her fellow DJ mentor... She told me that... this wasn't something she could work her way out of through positive thinking, but is like a wall of low self esteem that blocks her everywhere she turns... she's been playing the "poor me, I'm not good enough" card since her early teens... She told me... that encouraging her to be self affirming was just annoying her because the sense of anxiety and lack of confidence was something innate and was something she felt she had no control over.

1) If you think this is "the norm for most 22yo girls", you know some pretty messed up girls. I've known many, many 22 year-old girls - and have been one, myself - and can tell you this isn't normal for any of them.

2) Regardless of whether it's something normal that everyone goes through or is in fact her own special hell, she's unhappy and wants to change, but she doesn't feel like she can. It seems like the obvious solution, then, is to find someone who can help her change. Can't do something on your own? Get help. Hardly the most radical idea, to me.

[Teaira]

Medication.

I am a 22 year old girl and depression/anxiety nearly KILLED me and my college career. Since starting on Lexapro I have been feeling much better.

Therapy too might help.

[Magiver]

Originally Posted by astro

You're right, I should probably just let it go. She's an adult, but even so she's still my little girl and it's real tough just to sit there listening to her talk about her anxiety and self esteem issues without making some proactive suggestions.

It's not so much a "letting it go" thing as it is a "don't fix it just be a listener" thing. You've officially stepped in it and have to step back. Men hear a problem and want to fix it. Women tell their problems looking for a sympathetic ear. It's hard to be helpful by not trying to fix stuff.

What's worse is that you now have to figure out if she needs active help with depression without letting her know you are trying to fix her problems.

[gigi]

And you don't have to be forceful about medical intervention, but you can bring it up as an option and she may pick up on it. When I was depressed I balked at the idea of inpatient treatment but knowing it was there was a relief, that if I really had to go there was an option that would allow me to just rest and work on this thing. "Do you think it might help to talk to someone?" is a gentle way to introduce the topic, not like she's failed and there's no other help for it. Therapy or a doc she trusts is a safe place.

If she honestly can't see past that wall, she may need professional help to do it. And that's Ok, it doesn't mean she's crazy or a failure.

[Maastricht]

Here's another vote for trying meds. I wasted five years, and changed a lot in my life that didn't need changing, before I found out that I suffered from a stupid chemical imbalance that was perfectly treateable.

[Fuzzy Dunlop]

First, I think talking to a doctor or therapist is the best advice. Maybe it's much worse than you realize. I tried therapy once in college and found it wasn't helpful but obviously a lot of people are pleased with it.

And I've never been a daughter or a father so I don't know if there's a practical way to deliver this tip, but it sounds like at least part of her predicament could be improved by being proactive. For instance, I think your timeline is a bit off - traditional college juniors should be 20 or 21, so she's only got a year or two on the diminutive little coeds she finds so immature and unfashionable.

But so what? If she really doesn't like or relate well to her peers, therapy and drugs, while potentially helpful, won't ultimately resolve that. She could find activities to do with 20 somethings out of college a few years and hopefully feel a lot more fulfilled socially. I wouldn't judge anybody for taking medication or seeing a therapist. The one time I was depressed, in college, it seemed completely unrelated to anything going on around me. But your daughter seems bothered by pretty specific things, so why not fix them?

[sugar and spice]

Her university probably has a mental health/counseling office where she can get an appointment with little or no hassle. This is one route she could take, and one that has worked for me in the past as a first step. She is paying for it via student fees (or you are.)

Also, yeah, realize that you can't talk her out of her problems. Especially if talking to her about her problems makes you angry. It does sound like you two talk and get along -- she tells you about school, grades, her not-button nose, the jerk DJ she has to deal with, etc. These are not things that every 22 year old talks about with her dad. I think you should just ... keep talking to her, and keep listening. If she starts on a self-deprecating spiral then find something else to say besides telling her how she should think/react. If she complains about the jerk DJ then tell her about some asshat you have to deal with at work, that sort of thing. Or just say that you're sorry she's upset. (I can't tell you how many times all I wanted to hear was "I'm sorry you're upset.") Again, you can't solve her problems, but sometimes just having someone to talk to and take your mind off things is enough to make you want to start fresh the next day.

[Duhkecco]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy Dunlop

Maybe it's much worse than you realize.

Maybe it's much less serious than you think.

But your daughter seems bothered by pretty specific things, so why not fix them?

Because it's not the "things" that are the problem -- it's her perception and feelings about those things.

Okay, from the OP:

she's now just entered her Junior year of the local (very desirable) University, she's got a retail job at Macys selling women's clothing, her grades are quite good, she's got a DJ slot on the Thursday night college radio for her avant garde music

In other words, she is very active.

Then:

this afternoon she was telling me she has this suffocating generalized anxiety that won't go away and she wakes up feeling tense.

So, she told you she has this suffocating anxiety. Does she demonstrate it? Hard to be suffocatingly anxious without showing it in some way. Seems to me that she is self-diagnosing and exaggerating in that diagnosis. Or, at least she was exaggerating until you made things worse by dismissing her feelings, and then she was really anxious.

Of course, she can be suffering and not showing it, or she is showing it and you're not noticing. But, she told this today, right? And, because of one conversation today, some posters are suggesting therapy and medication??

She's worried about her body image, she's not getting along with some girls, she thinks boys are boring, and she doesn't like some things that her DJ mentor does or says. How is that any different from every other girl her age, or, for that matter, in many ways the same as practically every adult?

It's quite possible that next week someone will tell her how hot and statuesque she is, and she'll meet a boy or a girl is not boring, and have a laugh with her DJ friend.

Or not. But, here's a suggestion: Listen to what she says and acknowledge her feelings. And, watch for any indication that things are getting worse ... or better.

[Fuzzy Dunlop]

Originally Posted by Duhkecco

Maybe it's much less serious than you think.

So what? God forbid somebody go to an unnecessary doctor appointment?

Originally Posted by Duhkecco

Because it's not the "things" that are the problem -- it's her perception and feelings about those things.

Says some guy on the Internet who never met her? The perception and feelings about the women and men she goes to college with don't have to be wrong just because you say so. Not everybody likes everybody else. Maybe the guys really aren't her type. Maybe the women are a lot less mature than the girl. astro didn't mention anything about having a many of close friends. Having lots of close friends is very important to one's mental health. If she really doesn't like the people she goes to school with, why not meet other people?

[ratatoskK]

astro, if she's telling you these things, then she's telling you she needs professional help. Maybe she's already in therapy and was looking for a way to let you know, and now she feels you've made light of the whole situation. If she's not already in therapy and/or taking medication then she needs to be evaluated. The most helpful thing you can do would be to suggest that she do that, and if she doesn't have access to this help via the student medical services then you should help her find someone. If unsure where to turn then she can start with her personal physician.

[Duhkecco]

Originally Posted by Fuzzy Dunlop

So what? God forbid somebody go to an unnecessary doctor appointment?

Wait, I didn't say that she shouldn't see a doctor. I just don't get why that's the preferred option in this case, or why this is any different from the usual doubts and anxiety that every young person has, and that resolve themselves with no professional intervention.

Or are you suggesting that every instance of teenage angst requires a visit to a doctor?

The perception and feelings about the women and men she goes to college with don't have to be wrong just because you say so. Not everybody likes everybody else.

I didn't say her perception and feelings were "wrong". I said they were the problem, in a very simple sense: Her anxiety is the problem. Otherwise, there'd be no reason to address anything in this thread, or to suggest that she go see a doctor.

Maybe the guys really aren't her type. Maybe the women are a lot less mature than the girl... If she really doesn't like the people she goes to school with, why not meet other people?

She is going to school, she is working at Macy's, and she is a part-time radio DJ. It's pretty obvious that she is exposed to many different people. Where do you suggest she should meet other people that she might like?

[Duhkecco]

Okay, I realize that I'm suggesting that she shouldn't see a doctor. I also realize, though, that I could be wrong.

[Drain Bead]

Originally Posted by astro

I told her she's a smart, attractive young woman who was getting things done, and she just needed to stop wallowing in negativity and this self indulgent pity party. I told her people (in general) hated to associate with negative people who were always putting themselves down, and if that's going to be her attitude that people's negative and hostile reactions to her were going to be a self fulfilling prophecy.

As someone who has a lot of the same tendencies toward anxiety that your daughter has, this is one of the worst possible things you could have said to her. Here's the thing about anxiety--it can drive you to do great things, but you still feel like total shit even if you know you're kicking ass and taking names. There will always be something more you could have or should have done, or something you should have done differently, and you will dwell on these things in ways that normal people will not. To tell someone who thinks like this that they are "self-indulgent" and that "people will not like them" only feeds the insecurities they already have.

Therapy helped me a lot--mainly I learned that perfectionism is evil--I was always a bit of a perfectionist and would give up because I felt like I couldn't do things right or give them the attention that they needed. My therapist explained that a 90% was still an A, and helped me learn to prioritize a lot better. The other thing that is really hard to learn at your daughter's age is that she can't control everything--the only thing you can do is control yourself and your reactions to things. My anxiety is MUCH better now, and although becoming a parent has caused it to flare up a bit, I'm much better now at rolling with the punches than I was.

[Fuzzy Dunlop]

Originally Posted by Duhkecco

Wait, I didn't say that she shouldn't see a doctor. I just don't get why that's the preferred option in this case, or why this is any different from the usual doubts and anxiety that every young person has, and that resolve themselves with no professional intervention.

Or are you suggesting that every instance of teenage angst requires a visit to a doctor?

Because astro's explanation of the situation suggested it was more than teenage angst. Also she's 22. I'm not going to argue about whether some guy on the Internet's description of his daughter warrants a free visit to the college mental health office or not. It's just a little too silly for me.

Originally Posted by Duhkecco

I didn't say her perception and feelings were "wrong". I said they were the problem, in a very simple sense: Her anxiety is the problem. Otherwise, there'd be no reason to address anything in this thread, or to suggest that she go see a doctor.She is going to school, she is working at Macy's, and she is a part-time radio DJ. It's pretty obvious that she is exposed to many different people. Where do you suggest she should meet other people that she might like?

We'll just have to disagree. I think if the girl was just unhappy with her peers and feeling unattractive it'd be worthwhile for her to improve her situation. Instead she's unhappy with her peers and feeling self conscious about her height and nose and suffering from crippling depression and anxiety to boot. I just think it makes sense to address the underlying issues at the same time.

[Sleeps With Butterflies]

Another vote for therapy. I'm sure you're a good dad, but there's only so much you can do.

I hate to see a young woman not appreciating herself and wasting so much time on negativity. Hopefully a good therapist can help her reframe her thinking and start moving in a positive direction.

[Duhkecco]

I'll change my opinion to this: I don't know what the fuck I'm talking about.

[Broomstick]

22 is an age where, to a certain extent, it is normal to have some anxiety, uncertainty, and self-consciousness. It is also an age when mental illness manifests or becomes apparent (they can also start in the teens, but not become noticed until that age - you did that this "stinkin' thinkin' started in her teens, right?).

There are three possibilities here:

1) She's a perfectly normal 22 year old and her anxieties and concerns are at normal levels and she was just venting at you. This is actually a sign of trust and closeness, but the OP, being a man, reacted as a man (he tried to "fix things", point out errors in thinking, etc.) and not as a woman (sympathetic ear, empathic responses, etc.). She may still be working out that men and women do approach things differently and was not expecting the OP's response.

2) She's a mentally healthy 22 year old who has fallen into some bad mental habits. We all have these - someone spends a lifetime not liking their feet, or is disorganized in some aspect of life, or has trouble prioritizing or whatever. Sometimes, a non-related third party is needed to deal with the problem. This is a case where "talk therapy" of some sort may be of benefit, to find ways to interrupt the feedback cycles that maintain this sort of situation, in order to generate positive feedback of healthy behaviors and attitudes. Sometimes people use a "life coach" because it sounds better than "therapist" I guess.

3) She's clinically depressed or has an anxiety disorder or some other mental illness. These are currently believed to stem from actual chemical imbalances in the brain. Telling someone to "think better" or get a better attitude won't fix it as the brain, the organ, isn't quite normal. Telling someone to change this mood/feeling/problem by an act of will is like telling someone with poor vision that if they just try harder they'll be able to see 20/20. They don't need to "try harder", they need glasses. Likewise, for some of these mental disorders we now have medication that helps the brain function more normally. When such a person says that a feeling of worthlessness is "innate" they might be speaking the literal truth - their negative feelings are coming from a chemical imbalance in the brain.

The thing is, none of us here can tell from your post which of these three is the case. From a statistical standpoint, #1 is most common and most likely. #2 is serious, but can be fixed if she wants to change although she may need help with it. #3 is the most serious, and will likely require lifetime maintenance.

The fact she is active, bright, successful, etc. does not eliminate the possibility of depression or anxiety disorder. I know this because my eldest sister was a very high functioning person with clinical depression who was active, successful, and much beloved. She was still depressed. She spent many, many years in therapy and struggled all her life with the problem, although she seldom revealed that to any but her closest relatives and friends.

Next time she brings this up don't try to "fix" the problem, ask her if she's given any thought as to how she'd like things to be different. Suggest a neutral third party, or campus counseling services. Tell her you're glad she feels comfortable sharing this with her, although you are at a loss for how she should proceed. Commiserate with her a little, agree that being all grown up isn't always fun and that the weight of responsibilities and dealing with people can be a drag. If she ASKS DIRECTLY "what should I do" then offer suggestions, but unless you hear that direct question it's more a matter that she's letting you know how she feels than that she's coming to you for solutions. Let her know that you love her and that if she decides that talking to a counselor or getting therapy is the way to go that you'll support her all the way (you will, won't you? You do want your daughter's problems solved, right?) and you won't think less of her. She's an adult now and you respect her ability to make decisions.

I do think the people who are suggesting that this person they have never met resort to medication right off the bat are out of line (my opinion) as evaluating whether or not that is needed is something for a professional to decided after actually seeing and talking to the person in question. I am, however, concerned that she is still feeling bad despite being successful in many ways. As you pointed out, she should be feeling happy, or at least content. Holding a job and getting good grades and being involved in another activity would seem to indicate she DOES have her priorities in order, wouldn't it?

IF she is suffering from a biochemistry problem, such as an anxiety disorder, then it is innate and she really doesn't have control over it. Becoming angry or irritated at her for this is like being angry at a diabetic for not producing enough insulin, or someone with a thyroid problem for having a defective gland.

OK, yes, I have a definite concern and bias here - keep in mind that I don't know your daughter and I'm doing solely on your OP, seasoned with my own concerns and past baggage.

[Dangerosa]

I'm Broomstick's type 3 - and have been since I was your daughter's age. Here are some things about me....

No one can tell when I'm really anxious or depressed until I lose it. I'm really good at hiding my state from the outside world and not burdening people with my own illness. So if I'm saying something to someone, I'm saying "I'm about to lose it."

I'm not always medicated - in fact, generally I function fine without it. Over twenty one years I've been on medication for three periods, never longer than two years. This seems to get my brain chemistry 'rebalanced' and then I go off it for five or ten years. I really dislike medication - not because of side effects - I've never had anything significant - but because I'm one of those people who doesn't like medication on principle.

Anxiety in particular can be dangerous - I get this genetically from both sides of my family - and alcoholism runs deep in the family as well. That is because drinking is such an easy way to self medicate anxiety. It works - it will just ruin your life and then kill you.

I don't get a lot of benefit from therapy - after 23 years of this, I'm pretty self aware. My life is great, I know that intellectually - but my brain can not stop being anxious. Some people, however, do get benefit from therapy, and if your daughter is really ill, my initial approach was a two pronged "therapy and medication" approach. I've done just therapy - and while it keeps me from falling off the edge, its a huge commitment in time and I don't get 'better.' Medication is almost no commitment in time, and I do end up feeling better, not just 'this keeps me from the edge.'

I'm active, bright and successful. I have two wonderful kids and a successful marriage. I have a great career. I have a nice house. I'm financially well off. I'm healthy - with the exception of my brain chemistry occasionally setting me off. My coworkers would be shocked to know how close to the edge I've been around them, and that I'm someone who is "mentally ill."

My biggest fear is that I'm not self aware enough to medicate before I lose it. It hasn't happened yet, but I really don't want to ever end up in lockdown. That would end the illusion I'm able to maintain with the outside world. But medication really, sincerely, is a lifesaver. Without it, I'd probably have followed the alcohol path, because the anxiety and depression is intolerable when it is bad. When I was younger, it would have been the suicide path.

I have no idea what your daughter's state is, but I think if she is communicating a lot of anxiety to you, its worth it for you to suggest she see a mental health professional and be supportive of the idea. It takes a lot for us "active, bright, successful" people to admit we need help - and sometimes what we need is permission from the people who think we are most perfect to be imperfect and get help.

[RedBloom]

I started having depression in my teens, and it grew worse in my 20's. People's advice? Get over it. Gain some confidence. Quit feeling sorry for yourself. Be positive. All of that cliche bullshit.

I met my husband 8 years ago, and after dating for awhile came right out and told me "This is not normal, you are sick and it's NOT YOUR FAULT". Those words made me cry, the first time someone aknowledged my pain and finally treated it like something more than pity. I saw my doctor, got on medicine, and I have been 90% better ever since. God bless that man!

[Cat Whisperer]

OP, I'm a co-leader of a local anxiety support group. If you'd like to discuss this with me, please PM me. One thing I'll say here is that your daughter is right about one thing - if you don't have anxiety issues, you probably don't understand what she is dealing with (which is not a criticism of you, just a fact of life).

Better yet, have your daughter PM me.

[Rico]

Astro, where are you located? PM me if you don't wish to put it on the public board.

[astro]

I shared the thread with my daughter last night so she can evaluate the advice given. I thank everyone for their suggestions, it generally helps to get another perspective on things.

[Lakai]

Broomstick summed up your situation pretty well.

She could be depressed and anxious, or it's possible she's only exaggerating. You can still have anxiety problems even if you have a job and you're very active. I worry about the fact that she's feeling tense in the morning. Most people just worry about things before they go to sleep and then feel better in the morning. If your mental issues stay with you through the night, then it could be a serious problem.

The best solution would be for her to talk to someone who knows a lot about depression and anxiety so that he or she can determine how bad her problem is. If she feels that it's ruining her life then I think she should definitely see someone.

I would still be cautious with the doctors who are quick with the prescriptions. Make sure she finds someone who actually listens to her problems and doesn't just try to fix her through trial and error.

[Anne Neville]

Originally Posted by Duhkecco

Then:So, she told you she has this suffocating anxiety. Does she demonstrate it? Hard to be suffocatingly anxious without showing it in some way.

The anxiety could only show up in certain situations. Also, some of us get decent at hiding it, especially from someone who doesn't want to see it. It really isn't that hard with most people to hide things they don't want to see from them. No parent (except ones who have something like Munchausen syndrome by proxy) wants to see something serious wrong with their kid.

[Small Hen]

"You shouldn't be feeling this way, you're a smart girl."

God, I hate those words. I hate them because there's not an ounce of malice behind them, and I feel bad that they don't help. I hate them because hearing them is like asking for help and having a door shut in your face.

I told my father, at the height of my academic success, that I felt like I couldn't bear the anxiety that plagued me day to day. That I was falling apart. He told me the above. I realized that, hard as it was for me to tell him that, it wasn't enough. He wasn't going to help. Maybe he couldn't deal with my problems on top of his already stressful life. Maybe he just didn't understand why people can't feel the way they should.

I found other ways to cope. Deeply unhealthy ways, some of them dangerous. Now I have other problems. I've learned not to talk about them. If your daughter, who is not prone to histronics, tells you that something is hurting her, please listen. Find out what she feels she needs, then help her aquire it. You could be saving her.

[Guinastasia]

BTW, seeing a doctor doesn't automatically mean medication. Just take things one step at a time. And even if she does need them, it's not an automatic death sentence. Depression, however, can be.


(I believe Craig Ferguson had a monologue about people who bash anti-depressants and those who need them.)

[Jeff Lichtman]

If your daughter is really suffering from depression, no amount of lecturing about "wallowing in negativity" and "self-indulgent pity parties" will help. Depression means she isn't in control of her feelings - she is literally incapable of being happy. Insisting that she should be positive or upbeat will only make her feel worse.

You can think of depression as a condition that takes over one's emotions and makes everything seem sad or pointless. Assuming your daughter really is clinically depressed, both of you need to understand that it's the condition that is making her feel this way. For her, she should know that, with treatment, she can start feeling better. You should know that lecturing her won't help, any more than it would help someone with a broken leg to tell him he should get up and walk because it shouldn't be broken.

[lavenderviolet]

For someone with genuine clinical depression, SSRIs absolutely can be lifesaving.
That being said, I am definitely not a fan of labeling every negative mood someone has as "depression" and putting everyone on SSRIs at the drop of a hat (which is something I think happens a lot with family doctors, who often don't have the time, interest, or training to thoroughly evaluate patients who come in with a mood disorder).
Anti-depressants lift clinically depressed people to a normal baseline. SSRIs don't make people who aren't truly depressed any happier, and like all other medications they do have side effects that could make someone who doesn't need them feel worse instead of better. For depression caused by the situation the person is in or issues like body image/poor self confidence, counseling may very well be the better answer.

For that reason, if I were facing this situation, my first step would be to encourage her to be evaluated by a psychologist or psychiatrist who has the training to be able to ferret out if these emotions she are having are due to a true mental illness like depression or anxiety d/o, or if instead she would benefit from counseling about how to cope with situations she finds stressful/anxiety-inducing and how to think about herself in a more positive way.
Hope things get better soon.

[HelloKitty]

I just wanted to say that I think astro is a good dad for being concerned about his daughter and wanting to help her any way he can. So many daughters and fathers don't have relationships like this.

Kudos to you astro, here's hoping she feels better soon and gets the help she needs.

[Markxxx]

You're daughter is having typical problems but you didn't tell her this. You should've pointed out what she's going through is really what everyone else is going through too.

First of all does she have generalized anxiety disorder? Perhaps, there are meds that help with that. But meds are not an end all treatment. They only help you cope.

For instance, I was TERRIFIED to fly. I took Paxil and I was able to do so. Now Paxil didn't change me in anyway, but it got rid of enough panic so I could get on the plane. The point is I still had to face my fears and suck it up. Paxil helped. Now I don't need any meds at all to fly. It's not my favourite thing, but I can do it.

I can't tell you how much in life I missed out on because I was terrified to fly.

So meds aren't bad, but you still need to learn to cope.

Your daughter has a nice life and there is a thing called self actualization. And the fact the stuff she fretts over point out she is self-actualized.

She may need a break, drop out of school for a semester, or better yet, take one semester and take only ONE class. (Some fear if they drop out of school even for one semester they won't go back).

The have volunteer. This is great for young people. When you see people much worse off than you it puts a new light on your problems. For example if I told anyone about my life they'd be like "Wow Mark you have it really tough." And I do, but you know what, there are a lot of people even worse off than me. That's the thing about life, it can always get worse.

What this will do is give your daughter perspective

Now there is one thing about perspective that confuses people, they often think having perspective will solve their problems. You know it doesn't.

Seeing paralyzed veterans, or children that are ill or elderly people that no one cares about anymore, doesn't help me one bit to solving any of my problems. But it helps me cope.

In generalized anxiety one starts catastrophizing. For instance, you daughter may say "My nose isn't right, the guy I like won't like me, I'll never fall in love, never find anyone..." Of course that's not so, but it is what is happening.

I am a gay male, now I have a six pack. Would you believe one time a guy said to me, "You got a nice body, but I like washborad abs. If you can get washboard abs, then I'd like to go out with you."

That's the truth. I was like "Oh god, it's not enough, not to be fat, it's not enough to have a good body, it's not even enough to have six pack abs, now you have to washboard abs?"

I had to actually laugh at this. But if I was younger without such life experience, I could see myself saying "Oh I better hit the gym even harder."

What I would strongly recommend for your daughter is a mental health checkup. If she has insurance, make an appointment with a therapist. She'll get a inital interview and they'll be able to see if something's wrong.

If she doesn't contact your local county health department, they usually have sliding scale fees.

[Mosier]

You had me at 5' 11". Hubba hubba.

Sorry for the useless post.

[Zebra]

Originally Posted by astro

I shared the thread with my daughter last night so she can evaluate the advice given. I thank everyone for their suggestions, it generally helps to get another perspective on things.

I thought you may be doing this. I couldn't imagine posting that OP without getting the overwhelming response of 'see a doctor or two'.

[The Second Stone]

Please get her to see a licensed medical doctor. This is very important. The kind of depression you describe is very common and treatable. Look for a doctor that talks about a combination of anti-depressant drugs, exercise and talk therapy.

[Shirley Ujest]

Originally Posted by astro

. She's also unhappy with her body image as she thinks she's too tall at 5'11" and her nose isn't a little dolly button, and she feels like a giant surrounded by these little 5 foot something undergraduate coeds who are 19 and 20 who are like kids to her in their immaturity and fashion sense, and the boys are all boring jocks,

The short girls wish they had her height. My two best friends in HS were/are 5'11 and 6'. I'm 5'3. Their pants were always floods and I always had to hem my pants. They hated their height and were so self conscious about it and I could never understand this. They could see over the crowd and I could run like a terrier through the crowd. Make it work for you. Play to your strengths.

You cannot change your tallness so you might as well own it and wear it with confidence. Confidence is sexy.

and she feels used by her fellow DJ mentor who keeps making her run long distance errands for him, and then criticizes her tastes as being childish.

Anyone who criticizes someone's taste like that is a douche and is very insecure. If he is a mentor, I'd go find another mentor. A mentor should offer guidance and helpful commentments, not tear her down. However, life isn't about rainbows and sunshine. She has to learn to deal with all personality types as well. You learn more from a bad boss than a good one.



[rant]

One more thing: EVERY WOMAN IS UNHAPPY WITH HER BODY IMAGE. If you were subjected to wafer-thin models in every magazine, wafer-thin actresses in every movie, wafer thin-singers singing in every video, wafer-thin TV news-barbiedolls 'reading' the news on every farking channel, Wafer-thin sport-twinkies reporting from the sidelines during halftime events and EVERYONE OF THEM LOOKS FANTASTIC IN THEIR CLOTHING YOU WOULD HAVE SELF ESTEEM ISSUES TOO.

The fashion industry feeds the dieting fad industry which feeds the cosmetic surgery industry which feeds the fashion industry. They message they all send is YOU ARE NOT GOOD ENOUGH. The fashion mags/women's mags ( 99% of them) HATE WOMEN and constantly reaffirm the negative shit ( fat thighes are BAD/ if you are not in a relationship you SUCK). I won't even get into about Reality TV-whores. They reaffirm the absolute worst about our sex, men and humanity in general.


[/rant]