20 year mass grave in my hometown

I don’t know how to pit – I don’t have a vocabulary in any of the languages: Bosnian, Russian or English – but, at the same time, I don’t see where else to put this.

It’s not up for a debate, it’s not a mundane issue, and also, my opinion may not be all that humble because of the brutality and inhumanity contained therein.

I’m talking about another mass grave near my hometown in north-west Bosnia filled with innocent men, women and children killed during summer of 1992.

https://www.facebook.com/mojprijedor/media_set?set=a.601306723260883.1073741828.100001446829280&type=1

There are so many things that bother me about this and the order in which I’ll write about them does not reflect its importance, rather a muddled notion of clarity I might have in my head, ignoring for a second demonstrable incoherence in written English (damn you, articles).

First is a general idea, a blanket statement of sorts, where 20 years have passed since the mass murder of innocent men, women and children. For an operation of such sort, one would think there would be a number of people involved in organizing, executing, collecting and burying innocent men, women and children that you have to wonder how it was possible for Bosnian Serb community in my hometown, for 20 years, to keep a lid on something like this. I don’t think it was a sort of conspiracy of silence where each and every one who was involved or knew about it swore to keep their mouth shut. I don’t think it was a medical condition of sorts, a collective amnesia where with each year people who were involved or knew about it were confused if they dreamed about it or saw it once in a movie. What has happened, most likely, is that everyone who was involved or knew about it is in a mindset that dictates the following – they deserved it and it was a good riddance therefore nothing to feel sorry about and then, as a result of guilt, speak about it. In last 20 years there were found many other mass graves, one of them in 2005 with the dead body of my older brother and others I knew really well. This idea of how is this possible started fermenting over this period of time only to fully mature with this last one that, as per last count has close to a 400 bodies of innocent men, women and children. This is no aberration, not an anomaly – this is who the rest of people in former Yugoslavia have to deal with – SERBS, the animals.

Second thing… my niece, who was two and a half old when her father was murdered, had her share of misery trying to connect the dots of her family’s ill-fated agony and breakdown over the loss, the loss that we put to some closure in 2005 when we finally buried my brother’s remains. I thought I’ve seen everything until I read a letter written by her best friend whose father is most likely in this latest mass grave, a girl who was also two and half years old when her father was murdered along with many others and whose agony may go a few notches down after identification process is complete. It is a heart wrenching letter that confirms to me that it’s not just the dead who don’t have their lives, it is also the living who are forced, by these inhumane acts committed by Serbs, to not inhabit the lives they were destined to but the lives filled with misery and agony.

It’s a pain that trickles down through the generations and it’s very hard to avoid it. It is very hard to deal with it. Irrational anger, depression, lack of empathy and emotional response and other psychological irregularities is the norm in Bosnian diaspora and people who stayed. It takes an effort to act normal and it’s a daily struggle.

In the end, all I can say is God damn you Serbs – you’ll burn in Hell forever, for all the deeds including even a day of your silence, let alone 20 years.

I respect your pain and the need to vent. But I hope at some point you can think about the above line again and to where it leads.

Seconded. I was right with you, OP, up to that sentence.

Hatred breeds hatred, and atrocities breed more atrocities. The chain has to be broken by individuals deciding to put the blame where it belongs - on individuals, not on pre-defined groups. It may be a lot of individuals, it may even be the statistical majority of individuals in that group, but it is not everyone in the group. No group is that uniformly good or bad.

This is why I think that the South Africa Truth and Reconciliation Commission was such a good idea. It gave the opportunity for individuals to acknowledge their guilt and more importantly it put the appropriate individual faces to those crimes.

Go in peace, newcomer, and I pray you to consider what we are saying when your understandable anger is in a more manageable state.
Roddy

No sense in piling on. I hope I can feel differently should I find myself in the OP’s shoes. For now: My condolences for the grief, newcomer. That’s a hollow statement, but the sentiment is there.

There are places on earth I think need to be taken away from everyone who claims them - give 30 days notice, then turn the region to radioactive green glass so that the tribes will stop spending their lives killing someone’s uncle for what their grandfather did to their niece 50 years ago. Some of these “wars” have been going on since the Roman era. Enough. End them. Really END them.

Most of the former Czech/Yugo area would be such a pretty green. Ditto for Palestisrael. Ireland came damn close to being the wrong shade of green. Cyprus. The middle third of Korea.

Nuke 'em till they get over it.

  • stealing *

Amateur Barbarian: Cyrprus? It’s divided…but is there fighting going on? As I understood it, they simply cut the island in half, and live pretty well on either side of the line. Is there sniping? Is there shelling? Are there car bombs?

It’s more like “West Virginia” and “Virginia” than like the Israel/Gaza border…isn’t it?

It’s still an unpleasant diplomatic problem, but, at least to my knowledge, it isn’t violent. Am I wrong here?

The pro tryouts are thataway ---->

Well, if you count the ‘Green Line’, a designated buffer zone operated by United Nations Peacekeeping Forces to prevent tensions and violence as a neat little border akin to Virginia/West Virginia, then fine. Not sure you’d find many Greek or Turkish Cypriots who agree with you.

I’m very sorry newcomer. My daughter was recently reading Maus for school and I said that book gave me nightmares. My son asked why and I said “because it still happens, it wasn’t an anomaly.”

May your community find peace.

I remember that on 9/11/01, when it became obvious that the planes smashing into the WTC towers was an intentional act of terrorism, my first thought pertaining to who might be responsible was “I wonder if this is fallout from US involvement in Bosnia / Serbia”.

I readily agree that the horrors of that war were atrocities, and that the Serbs were the perpetrators.

An important distinction needs to be made between an historical identity (those particular Serbs who participated in the genocidal slaughter and/or approved, tacitly or otherwise, of it) an an ethnic identity (“Serbs bad people”).

In the local newspaper, there is a story of two Serbs who lived in the community near the mass grave who finally, after 21 years, started talking but they remain unknown at this moment as they fear the reprisal from their own.

One notable item from their story is that members of the local community were secretly complaining about the smell that would come out strongly after the rain, especially during snow melting season, asking Serbian authorities to remove the mass grave content somewhere else.

Just imagine for a moment that whole situation, for so many years, those people going about their life only to get irritated for the smell.

THAT is the horror.

That one day two people are assembling cars on the production line down two stations from the other, or taking the same bus to their different offices, or one buying bread in the other’s shop, or going to the parent/teacher meeting at the same school; and a couple of years later the one and others like him are throwing the other and others like the other into an unmarked ditch, looking forward to living without any of those others around and thinking there’s nothing wrong with this picture besides a bad smell.

And that it keeps happening, only the places and the excuses change and the scale varies.

  • Animals* do not do things like this. Man does. Repeatedly.

I recently lost a very dear friend who was a 75 year old Polish man. He fled Poland while it was under martial law. He didn’t hate the Germans who turned his country into a killing field, he didn’t hate the Russions. He had a deep burning hate for the Turks who had killed his people long before he was born.

Matt was a very rational and kind person. He forgave the Nazis, he forgave the Russions, but he was so irrational about his hatred of Turks that I just figured it was genetically imprinted on him.

Hatred shouldn’t last that long, but I guess it does. I hope that your pain will not last as long.

Human nature; “kill them all and never speak of them again” is part of the instinctive human pattern for genocide. It’s seen all over the world; it’s the incidents that haven’t been consigned to historical amnesia like the Holocaust that are the aberration.

Sure they do. Chimps and ants both engage in genocide. It’s not a matter of animals being morally superior; most species simply aren’t capable of it.

Of course that doesn’t let humans off the hook; unlike animals, we know better.

Okay, ha ha. Fine. I used a shitty metaphor.

Could you, like, actually answer my fucking questions? Is there sniping or shelling? Are there car bombs?

Is Cyprus the same kind of hot spot as the others mentioned? Does it need nuking?

I remember reading a book by an anthropologist once (can’t remember exactly what his name is) who noted that if baboons had nuclear weapons, the entire world would probably be destroyed in about 15 minutes.

Probably. From everything I’ve heard baboons are pretty nasty critters.

That’s a pretty foolish thing to say. You could nuke all that land yet the people would still remain and their hatred for one another would remain as well. If you really want to get rid of all that hatred than you would have to commit genocide yourself to get rid of those people.

Just reading about these things without being involved in any way is enraging. I can’t imagine how it feels when you have close relatives amongst the victims. I’m sorry for your loss.

Your post is incredibly offensive and stupid.