I’d vote for Obama because in hindsight, he was a pretty decent President. I’d only be sitting out if you paint me in the corner by making me pick one of the two choices you gave (possibly)
Otherwise (and I explicitly said this) I would vote third party, or write in.
But I don’t know a single “Antifa” bully. I’ve heard of the guy in Hamilton, but I don’t know him.
If you’d like me to name violent Trump supporters I’ve seen on the news, I can certainly do that.
You can shut your hole now, bitch.
So, the “research” thing was just a red herring - you’ve already reached your conclusion. Obama era policies platform be damned, too.
You’re making it personal. Am I understanding that right?
Ditto.
:applause:
At this point my “ideal” candidate is anyone who isn’t a corrupt lying Russian asset traitor.
“Voting is a chess move, not a valentine.” -Rebecca Solnit
Donald Trump appreciates your continued support.
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Evidently not. I would research whatever candidates there are going to be on the ticket … and then decide. Whether or not my politics aligned with someone else’s politics would then be a basis to cast a vote. Trump starts off with a much bigger burden in this regard.
Do you honestly believe the things that you write? When did you stop beating your wife?
That is exactly what you just (tried) to do to my line of reasoning.
Believability is a thing. Platform be damned I guess.
And this is where you guys lose me, why would me choosing to vote for someone else helping Trump. As I said earlier, if you guys can’t put forth a candidate that sways voters (like Obama did) that is no fault of the general public. That blames lies squarely with the DNC
And we’re back to where we started: The Oliver Hardy Defense.
“Now look what you made me do!”
Exactly. I feel strongly that everyone’s top priority in the coming election should be defeating Trump, therefore everyone should be committing to unconditionally support the Democratic candidate, no matter who he or she is, and I get very impatient with people who aren’t yet willing to make that commitment. But obviously, voting third party (or not voting at all), although a bad and irresponsible decision IMO, is much LESS bad and irresponsible than actually voting for Trump, and it’s silly to claim that the two decisions are exactly equivalent.
And if we encounter someone who absolutely isn’t going to vote Democrat, and is choosing between Trump and Gary Johnson, then it’s probably not productive to be chastising that person. Rather, encourage them to vote Johnson, because that’s half a win for our side.
Odd thing is, if the parts of the Constitution which guarantee the Sovereignty of the United States is unimportant to Conservatives, why should I listen to them when they stress the same document to argue for the Sovereignty of Guns?
That’s one hell of a straw man there.
No, not really.
The guiding principle behind any sovereign state is the control of ones own political processes. Doesn’t matter if it’s a Communist state, Democratic, Fascist, Kingdom, Empire, Dictatorship, whatever. A sovereign state controls the way the State determines who is going to lead the State’s policy making apparatus. It’s part and parcel of the definition of “sovereign”.
If conservatives… sorry, “Trump Supporters”… decide that it’s OK to invite foreign sovereign states to interfere in our own political processes, in violation of the Constitution, then why should I listen to those same people who argue that the Constitution gives us the right to bear arms? Especially when these same people argue that the Constitution does not give us the right to self-determination for the State?
I get that these people are used to picking and choosing which Bible verse to quote, but the Constitution is only 4 pages long!
I agree that if anyone openly accepts a foreign entity having undue influence over the American election process, that is ceding sovereignty. That’s not a radical thing to suggest, it’s common sense.
I just don’t recall anyone actually doing that. Trump downplaying Russia’s role and believing them over claims from our own intelligence services is stupid and servile. Those who wholly support Trump and everything he does are by extension acting as if America’s sovereignty doesn’t matter as long as they think it’s helping “their guy”.
The Republican Party as a whole doesn’t endorse Trump’s support and trust of Russia. Here’s the first result of a quick Google search for Republicans clashing with him.
Now the fact that anyone in Congress will back the president in excusing Russia is disturbing. But they don’t all blindly follow him. Most career politicians know that this kind of thing will hurt them long term. Nobody wants to be remembered years from now as the “guy who supported Russia when they were our enemy” during reelection.
Painting everyone with a broad brush is inaccurate and weakens what is a legitimate argument about the weasels who really are okay with letting Putin undermine our democratic form of government, when there are people on the “wrong side” who still won’t go along with it. Many of them in fact.
Look, you dumbass, the voters were swayed by a candidate other than your hero. The voters, to the tune of millions more, voted for a candidate other than your hero.
Thank you, Kearsen1 ! You answered the question, unlike most of the Gopsters here … and even got the correct answer! 
It would be rude to now ask you to “show your work.”
“Fiscal conservative.” Here’s what a leading Republican intellectual said recently (when it was noted that Trump has pumped the annual deficit up to a trillion):
This line of thinking is EXACTLY how you got the first 4 years of Trump. This line of thinking is very likely to get you 4 more.