A verse for Collounsbury

I’m reluctant to get further involved in this exercise, but after reading a few more posts I simply have to.

I can handle the morons slithering forth from the slime, passing simplistic knee-jerk judgements, their feeble intellects sagging under the weight of words such as “sycophant”, their output serving the same purpose as always: plumbing the depths of human stupidity and ignorance. I can handle all that, because I expect it from the many that Collounsbury slammed for their assorted bigotry, trolling, willful ignorance, partisan debating, and so forth. Certainly Coll has many enemies bearing (often ideological) grudges, though it would be nice if these people had the rectitude and mental cohesion to meaningfully support their nasty little indictments before Coll was banned and thus helpless to defend himself.

(Sam, you’re the exception here: although I don’t feel you ever made a strong case with your complaints, you usually said what you had to say straight up. Kudos)

What I can’t handle are silly platitudes and simplified explanations such as the following:

Cute, but nonsense. He was banned after he lost his temper with yet another microcephalic fool who was trying to discredit him with unrelated personal attacks and hand-waving devoid of any meaningful content (that not against the rules?). And Coll’s transgression was (for the nth time) a distinctly minor one, the various pundits who have graced us with their snappy unsupported judgements notwithstanding.

True. It’s also true that Coll was in a difficult position himself: released back on to the boards but watched closely while a number of other idiots did as they pleased – he certainly was not the only one infuriated by stupidity. Coll’s temperament is foul, but even fouler IMO is doing nothing about the legions of idiots who do nothing but troll or heave bigotry around on a site with such a noble mission as this one. Revolting.

This isn’t even cute, it’s just tiresome and (deliberately?) oversimplified drivel. The don’t be a jerk rule is regularly broken by a large number of posters, many of them trolls, many of them bigots, many of them adherents of debate styles such as deliberately misrepresenting opponents’ arguments, most of them people who Coll did us the favour of putting down and parceling away so that more respectable information could be given prominence. I’ve never seen Coll deliberately misrepresent or misquote another poster’s argument. Never seen him go trolling, spread hateful bigotry, or substitute cheap propaganda for arguments, techniques many of his opponents are especially fond of and which as far as I am concerned are dire problems. Never seen him tear someone up without good reason and in a manner at the very least oblique to the rules if not in loose accordance with them.
But, most especially, Collounsbury brought a net benefit to these boards. People may justly complain that he is acerbic and unpleasant in style, but just look at his body of work: for every indirect (or even direct) insult he posted there are reams and reams of highly informed and informative arguments on several important topics over which the posters on these boards are largely and embarrassingly ignorant (or, worse, biased). His record speaks for itself – if the particular vermin rejoicing in Coll’s banning had one-tenth the ability to produce informed and balanced arguments there would be no need for the drastic techniques Coll sometimes employed.

Funny, that’s how I feel about your posts sometimes. Doesn’t stop me from appreciating or seriously evaluating what you have to say, and if I purposely don’t read your posts then I make damn sure I keep my trap shut about material that I deliberately skipped over.

More platitudes. Do you think there are any two or even three or four posters whose work combined approaches the level of information and penetration delivered by Collounsbury? Let’s take the Middle East or Islam and look at the contributions by Tomndebb and Tamerlane, two distinguished and knowledgeable posters who are without fail polite and informative. Much as I enjoy reading their posts, I don’t believe they made a fraction of the impact on the fight against ignorance that Collounsbury achieved with his high volume of take-responsibility-for-your-words, anti-weaseling, direct, no-shit, vaguely Cecilian style.
If I may provide a platitude of my own, sometimes you have to take the good with the bad. It seems to me Coll did a lot more good around here than bad, which is more than I can say for a large number of other posters.

umm… yeah, what Abe said.

Oh, the irony!

I haven’t often disagreed with Coll’s POV, I don’t believe in censorship, and I am not a stickler for rules. But if there was ever anyonne begging to be banned, it was he. He had to have known that he was going to be banned. Either that or he is a fool. You can’t have it both ways.

I can understand that many of you regret his exit. But I think we will survive just fine. We can draw on other first-hand observations at other sources without having to endure his endless self-glorification. In my opinion, he is not only arrogant, but also pretentious and tedious.

Ho hum. Yawn. I think I will go and suck on my teeth.

I suspect there may be an element of truth here.

Did the ill-informed gibbons in Great Debates repesent a rotten tooth Col could simply not leave alone? Was his Tourette syndrome a plea to the Modmins to put him out of his misery?

If so, enjoy your peace, friend. Dedication such as yours will always find an outlet for good.

Y’know Abe, I am suprised that you of all people bought into the entire Collounsbury cult. I would think that as a lawyer, you would demand credentials from any “experts”. I imagine you would crucify on cross examination a witness whose “expertise” consisted solely of “Well, I live in the neighborhood, I know what’s going on”. Colls repeatedly refused to post any credentials beyond “I live here so I know more than you ignorant morons”, and then viciously attacked anyone who had the gall to disagree with his bias.

Oh, and BTW, my “feeble intellect” can handle big long words like “sycophant” just fine, thanks. “Cat” and “dog” too, and if I really put my mind to it, I can chew gum almost simultaneously.

Not true. He frequently backed up his assertions with citations from reliable sources, whether journalistic, government, NGO, or academic. Plus his predictions have turned out to be true in a number of significant cases. And if pointing that out makes me a “syncophant,” then it’s an appellation I will accept with great pride.

Precisely.

Wow, that’s an assholish thing to say. So because you didn’t like the guy, you hope he gets sent to prison and raped. How very charming.

dnoorman:

[Administrator Hat ON]

I think “you should be gang raped” is completely inappropriate to say to a fellow poster, even in the Pit. And I particularly frown on gratutious bashing of someone who is unable to defend himself.

[Administrator Hat OFF]

Dave, I’m getting fucking sick of this line from you. I happpened to like Collounsbury. I find (found) his style entertaining, and his knowledge valuable. I don’t mind the profanity; I think it’s funny.

These are viewpoints I arrived at all on my own, with my brain fully functioning. I am not a sycophant or a cultist.

So kindly take your condescending, dismissive bullshit, roll it up tight, and ram it up your ass. Thank you.

Col didn’t just attack people he had disagreements with. He also posted a very unkind message in a completely innocent thread in Cafe Society called “If LOTR were written by someone else…”

There was no MENA discussion going on there. No deep political debating. Nothing terribly controversial at all. Just a bunch of folks hanging out and having fun. Then Col barges in and says, quote:

When is this bloated cliche ever going to get locked up?

If the Mods hadn’t seen fit to close this thread, then who the hell is Collounsbury to come down from On High and dispense His Mighty Wisdom as to the right of this thread to exist? If he didn’t like it, why couldn’t he have left it alone? It isn’t hurting him. I see lots of threads in which I have no interest, no knowledge of the subject being discussed, or I think are just plain silly, but I don’t go barging in and insulting everyone.

Col could just have ignored the thread, like any reasonable person, but instead he had to, as my uncle Tony puts it, “show his ass”. He’s like the one kid who has to piss in the snow so no one can play in it. I’m not sorry to see him go and hope someone more reasonable will arrive to take his place.

6 year olds think the kid who says “poop” in front of the teacher is oh-so clever and daring too. That dosen’t make it so when you look at things from a mature point of view.

All of the people calling for Colls to be unbanned because “He was so knowledgeable” or “It was just his style” or whine “What about other trolls” and in any other way implying that exceptions to the rules should be made simply because they like and/or agree with an insecure loudmouth who gets off on insults in GD and pushing the rules just as far as they can go and then just a bit further are the picture of toadying lackeys. You may or may not fit into that catagory, frankly, I don’t care enough to search your posting history to find out. If the shoe fits, take a hike, otherwise, move along as there is nothing to concern you here.

Unlike your condescending, dismissive bullshit, which I shall of course meditate deeply upon for the next 90 days. :rolleyes: My posts in this thread have been based upon two documented posting styles: Coll’s abrasive one and his apologist’s whining one, begging that he gets another chance. What are your comments based upon? Seems to me it might be a sense of unease because I struck a little close to the mark, hmm?

Bravo, Abe.

There seems to be an attitude floating around that collounsbury was right all the time and the people he abused were ignorant fools. The reality is that he was wrong sometimes and that sometimes he was the ignorant fool (still dishing out abuse, however). He certainly was good at pretending to be superior, but the reality is that he was just as human as everyone else.

Honestly, it does vaguely remind me of a cult.

Collounsbury flavor Kool Aid- “it angries up the blood!”

:wink:

Heh. You said “poop.”

Thanks for the handy dictionary entry by the way. But I’m not in the habit of using words whose meaning I don’t know.

I wonder, though, what influence is Col supposed to have had, and what favors was he in a position to grant? Seems like a waste of toadying to me.

Hmm…okay, I guess you have a point if you’re only referring to the behavior you described, and not just people who find him entertaining. I never said he should be above the rules, or should be unbanned. I’m not a bit surprised by this turn of events, and if I were in the Admin’s shoes, I’d do the same thing. But speaking as a poster, he doesn’t bother me.

Is it okay to be condescending towards condescension? I shall have to ponder that one…

Nope, not a bit of it. I just get irritated when someone pretends to know my motives better than I do.

Really, I still don’t get it.

If Collounsbury was so intelligent, then why didn’t he have enough smarts to stop being such a jackass? Especially after he was warned repeatedly and banned once before?

Either he wasn’t really that intelligent to begin with, or he just didn’t give a rat’s ass.

If you want his knowledge so much, try e-mailing him. Or as someone else suggested, give him a live journal code where he can foam at the mouth all he want.

It’s not like he was THE End All and Be All of knowledge of the Middle East, folks. Yes, he knew his stuff. However, he was unable to share it without being a dick.

And if the mods HAD let him stay, what happens then? We’re going to get all the cries of “favoritism!” from the other side.

Sometimes, being the person who has to enforce the rules sucks.

No, he didn’t have to say it, but you can bet A LOT of us were thinking exactly that. When that black-hole of geekiness was sitting there in Cafe Society, just sucking up all the bandwidth in its wake, it made me want to invent a time machine just so I could go back and kill J.R.R. Tolkien’s father.

Honestly, is that the worst thing you can think of that Coll ever did?

No, there were lots worse, but it was rather characteristic of the stuff he wanted to be allowed to get away with.

Did anyone else notice that the thread that finally got him banned (again), the triggering incident was that someone pointed out that you could read many Arabic news sites in English, and that therefore a knowledge of Arabic is not the sine qua non of an opinion on the Middle East?

Someone questioned his status as the Voice From On High on all matters Middle Eastern, and he reverted to his default mode of personal abuse.

I have said so before. In my experience, genuine experts are not so threatened by differing opinions as to descend into ad hominems so immediately.

Regards,
Shodan

Actually, the worst thing that I recall Coll doing was savaging Sue Duhnym here in the pit. She started a thread about the Taliban (about 6mo before 9-11) and he came in and ripped her to shreds. It was one of the nastiest things I’ve seen on these boards, and was done without cause.

Sure, she expressed disbelief about their situation, but that didn’t mean you had to crush her skull in with the facts. Tamerlane came in a bit later, IIRC, and nicely explained what Coll was screaming about.