Absurd Reactions To Transvestites

Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share
1

Am I the only one who witnesses this so frequently?
A couple of months ago, my youngest son and I went to KFC. As we were getting ready to leave, a man dressed as a woman came in and got something to go. As soon as (s)he hit the door, the young man behind the counter started yelling repeatedly and maniacally, “It’s a he-she! It’s a he-she!” I just looked at him in disgust, which he probably took to be disgust at the tranny when it was really directed at his behavior, and we left.

I work in a doctor’s office, and we have a male patient that dresses as a woman and insists that we call him Dorothy. There have been many comments and snickers by my coworkers, some of them even within earshot of the patient.

Tonight, I went to Walgreen’s to get a syringe, as my 7-year-old recently saw fit to stick a piece of paper in his ear and I needed to clean it out. As I was checking out, the cashier asked me if I saw that person over there in the makeup aisle. I craned my neck around to see what she was referring to, and she informed me that the person standing there in a dress looking at makeup was “actually a MAN!” Gasp! Then she so kindly rolled her eyes up to the heavens and benevolently asked God to bless him. I replied that in my opinion, people actually can be born into the wrong body, and maybe that was what was going on with him, that maybe he was actually female in his brain and dressing up and wearing makeup just felt natural to him. Or, of course, maybe he just likes it. She gave me a look that may have insinuated that I was going to hell for believing that.

What is with people? In 2006, a lot of people still think a transvestite is a freak to be pointed at, laughed at, and stared at? Do they not get out much? Do they not realize that there are plenty of men that live as women, and those people still deserve respect and dignity?

That makes me sad. :frowning:

2

I happen to wear nail polish. Yes it’s black. No, I’m not “a gothic”, as many people have asked. It is the only way I have found that stops me biting my nails until they bleed. Obviously, without wearing a sign around my neck saying this, many people assume the worst of my “outlandish” fashions.

I have seen the looks I get, the stares, the doubletakes, the whispers behind hands that are ever so inconspicuous. The outright talking by people who assume that because I have my headphones on my thrash metal is up so loud that I can’t hear what they’re saying. It’s more than likely to be Jewel or Brooke Fraser people… I can hear everything!

And I take it in my stride, because I know why I am doing what I am doing. And while I know it stands out (not that I need the help at 200+cm), I am comfortable enough to not give a … (checks forum)… damn about what they think of me.

I can only give “mad props” to the people who realize that they are doing what they need to be doing to feel “right”, despite the scorn heaped upon them by others.

I must, however, question the need for 10cm high, solid wedge, sparkly silver sandal type shoes. I think that there’s no place in the world for these sorts of shoes, no matter who is wearing them. It just so happens that the last two times I’ve seen people wearing them, it was men. One of whom was dressed otherwise normally (blue jeans, black tshirt, hair tied back in a pony tail).

Here is an example of said shoes, for those who may need to know

3

Me and a couple friends did get a chuckle the other day over a man wearing women’s cloths. In this case, it was a heavy-set, unshaven, balding, middleaged man wearing flip-flops, clamdigger shorts, and a white t-shirt. And under the shirt you could clearly see a lacy black bra. In our defence, the humor didn’t come from “It’s a dude in women’s cloths!” so much as “What sort of self respecting transvestite would go out in public dressed like that?” I mean, shit, we were in San Francisco. You’d have to wear a bag over your head not to see guys in dresses around here.

4

Depending on your state or jurisdiction, your coworkers may be out of compliance with the law. For sure they are not according this patient the dignity that we aspire to accord to any patient. If you’re large enough to have an HR department, ask for a training on sexual minority issues.

5

The company is very small, there is no HR. I suspect that any complaint would be met with derision, and maybe even a questioning of my own orientation. I love the company I work for in every other way, but man there are some small-minded people there. Hell, you often even hear whispers of “She’s a lesbian!” or “He’s gay!” snicker, snicker. Then I’ll point out that my aunt’s a lesbian, and I love her very much. Then there’s the old, old joke about coming out of the closet whenever anyone literally comes out of the closet. It’s not even clever, but still some of them act like it’s the funniest thing they’ve ever heard.
I guess I must spend too much time on The Dope, and it’s a shock (a shock!) to me that the whole world is not tolerant, accepting, and open-minded. I just don’t understand why so many people even care that a man wants to dress in women’s clothes, much less be outraged or find him deserving of public ridicule.

6

I suspect that it’s much the same reason why so many people will listen in rapt fascination to the incoherent ramblings of some dumb broad with rich daddy, or why they should care about the comings and goings of some far distant but well known married couple with some sort of strange, cute(?) nickname. Alright, I don’t understand that either, but they’re bound to be connected.

All I can say, really, is that, as a transvestite, the comments and ridicule go with the territory. It is sad, and at times really hurts, but that’s just a part of life for some of us.

7

Look, I find that sort of behavior weird but i’m of the school that you just don’t degrade other human beings. He might be someone to keep an eye on if you have kids, but other than that it’s just gossip. I don’t have time for that.

8

I would have never guessed there were so many cross dressers in Tuscon AZ. I guess the fact that they can walk about, apparently unafraid for thier lives is something.

9

Yes, all too often people’s gaskets are completely blown by the very existence of trans people. Alice, I’m glad you are in these situations to be an ally to the trans people who are being attacked.

I’m sorry your workplace is such that you feel that a sexual diversity workshop wouldn’t help. Just the fact that you’re responding to these examples of unfairness and offensive overreaction helps the situation.

As a hint, a person who uses a woman’s name in day-to-day life may well identify as a woman and prefer to be addressed using feminine gender pronouns. Has Dorothy given you an indication of preference in pronouns? Using the pronouns and name a person prefers is a great way to make them feel at ease and that you can be counted on as an ally.

10

Are you sure he was a transvestite, and not just a big burly bloke with man-boobs that needed extra ‘support’? :smiley:

11

Statistically, your kids are safer with a transvestite than they are with apparently straight people.

Not that truth is going to be a factor in your judgments.

Tris

12

Er…please explain?

Why would a trans person be someone I have to keep an eye on around my son?

You’re entitled to your opinion that “that sort of behaviour” is “weird”, with which I certainly do not agree, but your unsupported assertion that I might have to watch a trans person around my pre-tee son is - I believe - absurd.

And besides, then Auntie Jo* couldn’t babysit anymore, and he would be sad. He likes her very much, and has no idea that she’s trans. Lesbian, yes, trans, no - and no, not because I think he shouldn’t know, but because all those issues aren’t important to a kid who just knows that he loves it when he gets babysat by someone willing to both buy him ice cream AND rent movies!

Besides, you couldn’t swing a cat where I live without hitting someone GLBT, and even though I’m straight and married, I like that just fine. Most are good neighbours, good friends, good people, just like anyone else. That bears repeating - just like everyone else.

And to the OP, I loudly call people on that sort of boorish, stupid behaviour. It’s just plain dumb and hurtful and mean. And I admit, like you, to puzzlement over why anybody notices or cares.

But I must contribute this: My good (married, straight) friend is lovely, but she doesn’t wear makeup. She dresses appropriately for her job (business suits and heels), but no makeup. On weekends, jeans and no make up. Her mom is very much of the mindset that you shouldn’t leave the house without makeup, pearls, a tweed skirt and a twin-set. And that’s dressing down.

So as they walked down the street in my neighbourhood, her mom pointed out a girl to my friend and said, “See, look at her, that’s how you should dress!” (Twin-set, pearls, tweed skirt, etc.)

Imagine the priceless look on her mom’s face when my friend informed her that that “lovely girl” was, in fact, a bloke. :wink:

Cheers,
G

*Not, obviously, her name

13

You’re kidding, right? Right?

Back when I was a baby queen (okay, I was 20, but I was waaay inexperienced), and my family praised Jesus out of one side of their mouths and condemned me to hell with the other (and after I’d been kicked out of my mother’s house), I hung out with the transvestites (and other assorted characters) at 13th & Walnut in Philly, and I felt safer (those girls could fight when necessary!) and freer to be me with them than I ever did with my family. So, yeah, based on my experience, if I had children, and if I wanted them to grow up in a more tolerant and welcoming world than the one I did, given a choice between transvestites and a great many of the folks in my family, the balance would definitely tip in favor of the transvestites.

BTW, here’s a couple of definitions for “degrade” from dictionary.com: to lower in dignity or estimation; bring into contempt; to lower in character or quality.

You were saying again about not degrading other human beings? :dubious:

14

I don’t wish to defend unreasonable stereotypes or anything, but I don’t think there’s anything particularly unusual about Black Train Song’s response - we often judge the apparent trustworthiness of people by their conformity to some kind of norm (not that I’m saying this is a great idea, because it can easily backfire). Unexpectedly encountering someone who conspicuously diverges from the norm often creates an involuntary sense of mistrust.
Putting gut reactions into words, the guy in the suit and the mother in the floral print dress seem naturally trustworthy, because as far as we can tell, they exist within the same social boundaries as ourselves; The guy in the chiffon dress is an unknown quantity - we can clearly see that he is not constrained by some of the same boundaries as us, and we can’t help fearing that there might be other boundaries by which he is not constrained.

So I think it can be quite a natural reaction, not that this is particularly useful, because axe-murderers can be guys in suits; so I don’t wish to excuse or even support the reaction as reasonable, but I think it’s understandable and natural, and not necessarily attributable to malice or conscious prejudice.

15

Also, the OP is mischaracterizing the bad behavior s/he describes. S/he and others have merely noted rude, crass and ignorant reactions to transvestites. An absurd reaction would be to, say, spank a fish.

I’d also like to cast a vote for giving Black Train Song the benefit of the doubt: s/he dismissed any thought of hostility or mistrust except that involving interactions between an unknown transvestite and one’s children. Most parents are a little paranoid when it comes to their kids, even more so when it comes to their kids + adults they don’t know well, and transvestism undeniably adds a layer of unfamiliarity that does not allay (nor is meant to allay) their fear of the unknown. The fact that it would be a mistake to mistrust a person just because they dress according to a different gender stereotype than we might assign them is one of a panoply of errors of excessive caution, and should be addressed with facts rather than indignation.

For that matter, the OP itself is less clear than it might be, using “transvestite” to describe a range of situations that may not fit the term and which others are far better equipped to define than I. Certainly, the word “tranny,” which belongs, so far as I can tell, to the OP, is regarded as an objectionable epithet by some.

16

Two words: President Bush.

Sorry, I just had to. :wink: But seriously, I think I get where you’re coming from.

I can understand how encountering someone who, by mere appearances, doesn’t seem to exist within the same social boundaries as we do might give us some kind of pause, e.g., “Oh, that’s unusual (in my social sphere),” but it doesn’t follow for me that assuming such a person’s lack of other boundaries (or, as **Black Train Song ** did, assigning the potential for either character or moral failing) is just as natural. IANA psychologist (though I’ve studied it a little), but I just think that making those kinds of judgments about other human beings is borne of stuff other than a natural tendency to fear that which is different. Here, I’m talking about experience, upbringing, societal influence, etc.

And, really, encountering a chiffon-wearing man would, for me, be just as natural as would encountering the guy in the suit or the mother in the floral print dress–whether that’s on the street, at the local Burger King, or on the subway. Hell, even in my synagogue. Well, okay, maybe not in my synagogue, but that’s just because no one–male or female–ever comes to my shul in chiffon. (Mostly granola types up in here!)

The point is this: I’m not going to assume a greater or lesser degree of someone’s trustworthiness or moral turpitude based solely on how closely or not they appear to hew to the “norm” (whatever “norm” might mean to me). I might make determinations about people–and often do–for other reasons, e.g., observed behavior, but to determine that someone is a potential pedophile or thief or rapist or murderer or whatever just because they *on the surface * aren’t just like me is a pretty effed up thing to do. And that’s why **Black Train Song ** was wrong.

Anyway, that’s just my $0.02.

17

I agree; if you’ve thought it through and come to the conclusion that your kids are safe with a complete stranger in a suit, but unsafe with a guy in a dress, then you’re wrong, but I’m talking about situations where gut reaction plays a significant part. When we encounter something unexpected, unsual or inconguous, we instinctively apply extra (possibly entirely unnecessary) caution; that’s pretty much all I was saying.

18

Just park your little fly derriere on the wall and watch the froth fly when the feminst/lesbian seperatist extremists even think they see what might have been an adam’s apple or 5 o’clock shadow anywhere near one of their gatherings.

I consider myself a feminist and a lesbian and there is plenty of room for transfolk in my world. Of course I’m considered by some to be so brainwashed by the patriarchy that I should be pittied or scorned, depending on which direction the wind is blowing.

:rolleyes:

These “sisters” of mine don’t miss a beat, even when confronted with the comparison of virtually VERBATIM arguments made by seperatists to keep transfolk excluded from feminism and arguments made by the RR to keep queerfolk excluded from the “sanctity of marriage”.

Truly mind-boggling.

19

Well… I’m willing to bet that a lot of the people doing eye rolling at the overt rudeness towards trans-gender people by manner-less boobs need to put the “surprise” reaction in some context. Let’s say the 16 year old babysitter you hired on a friend’s recommendation turns out to be a tall, muscular, linebacker sized 16 year old young man wearing a cute sundress and size 13 strappy orange sandals who calls him/herself “Jolene”. She seems like a nice person. and in chatting her up you learn she’s dying to go ballroom dancing like she sees people doing on “Dancing with the Stars”, but she can’t find a partner, and asks you how you get your makeup done so perfectly.

Do you leave him with the kids … or not?

20

I was just giving a talk the other day that discussed (in passing, anyway) the sort of oversampling one has to do to derive robust estimates for small subgroups of the population. Not only are transvestites a relatively small population subgroup, but given the challenges of identifying them, selecting a good sample for a survey would have to be a challenge.

Needless to say, I’d like to see those stats.