First, for the people who are debating as to whether the kid understands the concept of $300 or not - at this age, children’s abilities are quite variable, and ADHD is going to skew this even more.
More importantly, with a kid this age with ADHD, talking about what the kid should be able to do (especially with respect to other kids) is useless to the point of being counter-productive. Flutterby needs to work with what he is able to do, and what he needs to learn to be able to keep up in his school and social life.
Speaking as someone who has ADD (no hyper for me), I think the suggestions for “tough love”, harsher punishment, and military school are very bad ideas.
If there is one problem I face on a daily basis as the result of growing up with ADD, it’s the feeling that I can never accomplish what people expect of me. That feeling is certainly a result of getting in trouble for not being able to do things that people thought I should be able to. If you don’t understand how that works, imagine running a race and having the coach or your parents get mad at you for finishing the race much slower than everyone else did.
If punishment isn’t working, then harsher punishment isn’t the answer. This is not a normal kid whose gotten into a bad habit - he’s a kid with ADHD that is expressing itself (in part) as stealing.
Flutterby - I understand that you are trying to stop the stealing by trying to find out why he stole the items in question, but that may not be the best approach. There’s a certain assumption in this approach that there is some forethought or planning involved in the thefts, and ADHD is just about the opposite of forethought and planning. The real reason why he is stealing is because he has trouble controlling his impulses. If you want to deal with the stealing, find a way to teach him/train him to have more control over his impulses. If you can find a psychologist, that may be what the person does. If it were something I was going to do, I would put him in a situation that would trigger his impulsivity, then let him know that I was going to reward him for controlling his impulses for a certain length of time. For instance, if he really likes popcorn, I’d make a bowl of popcorn, then tell him that he would get a reward if he didn’t touch the popcorn for (say) five minutes. I’d want to get a good idea of how long he was capable of restraining himself initially, and I’d want to get a good idea of what a good reward is - my parents trying behavioral modification with rewarding me with money, but I’ve never been much for money. When they started rewarding me with control (namely, that certain grades allowed me to choose the restaurant we ate at), I did much better.
If you want some insight into the ADHD mind, you might read some of the threads I’ve been starting discussing the disorder with other dopers on the board - here’s a roundup of threads: ADD dopers - what next? - Miscellaneous and Personal Stuff I Must Share - Straight Dope Message Board
I agree strongly that the “scared straight” approach is foolhardy. It didn’t work in the 70’s when it involved exposing delinquents to hard core criminals, it doesn’t work today. DARE has also been an empirical failure as a program.
A psychologist should be able to work with you to develop a behavioral program specific to the concerns of your child.
Also, I struggle to understand the aversion that is often expressed regarding pharmacotherapy for ADHD. This idea that someone should just naturally overcome a disorder that is as pervasively debilitating as ADHD, while eschewing any benefit they might gain from medication on principle alone, is just nonsense.
Yes, because the war on drugs has been a colossal failure. I wasn’t talking about a DARE officer because of anything to do with drugs, though, so I’m not sure why you’re bringing it up. I mentioned it because he would be a police officer who is used to working with kids, and would probably understand the best way to handle the situation.
The reason that I, and possibly others, suggest escalating punishment is because stealing is so freaking serious. If the kid was a roommate or friend or someone else’s child, this would be a dealbreaker for it ever setting foot in my house. If the only thing that gets him to stop is getting yelled at by a cop, so be it. And being brought to the realization that lawbreaking is serious HAS stopped kids from doing stupid shit in the past.
Regardless, it’s just a suggestion. Nothing else has worked yet.
Not really. It’s more because DARE has been a failure. There are certainly individual substance use treatments that have been effective, and the effectiveness of behavioral treatment for things such as stealing may even be better than that again. A cognitive-behavioral strategy should be the first line of intervention for stealing, and it should ideally be delivered by a Ph.D. level clinical psychologist.
I’m not sure that a police officer would be likely to know the best way to handle a situation like this. They are typically not that well-versed in cognitive behavioral therapies, despite how well-intentioned they may be. They are much more likely to bring a juvenile justice mindset to bear on the matter.
These suggestions might well work, and very likely have worked for some children. They clearly don’t work for all kids. Delinquent behavior is quite heterogeneous. I would just like to make sure that the interventions that are the better supported empirically speaking are the first ones tried.
I am glad I found all of you! My 11yr. old ADHD son steals too. He has been on Concerta for about a year and has improved dramatically. He still steals though. I just did the weekly sweep of his room and found lots of contraband. It’s sickening and scary, to be honest. My boy is a great kid, we try to be great parents. We set boundaries. We dole out consequences. We’re doing all the things we should be doing. I really believe he would stop himself if he could.
I know you are frustrated. I am too. I am also angry when he’s standing there saying " I don’t know why I did it". He’s going to end up in prison or something and I will have failed him. I don’t know whether to scream or cry. I have done both. And often
I try to remember that my job here is to teach more and punish less. Its exhausting. My attempts to correct this behavior have not worked with any great success, but I have boiled it all down to this: HE WILL ONLY STOP STEALING IF. . .
He develops some sort of moral code that convinces him stealing is wrong. (his lack of self-control makes this one near impossible)
He is afraid of the consequences.
He doesn’t have the opportunity.
Since I am trying so hard at #1 and nor getting anywhere, I am left with only opportunity and consequence to focus on. I am resentful that I have to babysit an 11yr. old around the clock. I’m angry that I feel my possessions are under seige constantly. I feel guilty that I have to play referee / judge / warden all the time. I know how you feel. I guess we keep going, right? Love him through it, is that what they say to do?
