Almost 30, never had a relationship. Any advice?

In My Humble Opinion
1

Y’know, it’s been this way for so long it seems more like the plot for some silly redemption movie than real life. But it is getting rather lonely and I’d like it to change, preferably before I turn 60. I’m just not really sure what I’m doing wrong.

As far as I can tell I’m a pretty ordinary guy, if a little on the uninteresting side. I’m not particularly attractive but I don’t think I’m outright hideous either. I’m sadly still going to school as an undergrad (started late, worked in between, etc.) so I’m sure that’s a turnoff to women who already have their lives figured out and are engaged in a career. But it’s no better for me in the college scene, online, with friends, in activity groups, or in any other realm that I’ve ever tried.

I’ve been turned down by every single woman I’ve ever tried to get close to. At last count that’s some 40+ of them and then I stopped counting because, well, it’s slightly discouraging. You can only blame bad luck for so long before you start internalizing romantic failures as personal ones, yeah?

Anyway, long story short – I was never much of a people-person, but it’s gotten a lot better over the decades. A few years back I asked a similar question here (sorry, can’t find the thread) and got a great bunch of advice from Dopers and I’ve followed most of them and grown a lot and learned a lot, but still no real success with dating. I now have a lot of friends and co-workers and as far as I can tell, people pretty much universally like me – just not in a romantic sort of way. From reaching out socially to getting more in shape to letting go of past baggage, blah blah, I’ve done pretty much all that I can. The only advice I didn’t take was to solicit a prostitute because that just seems like a recipe for further disappointment. And I’d really rather have a relationship – with mutual care for one another – over plain sex.

Here’s an online dating profile that’s mostly current, if you want a better idea of who I am.

If helpful, allow me to briefly recap a few of my latest failures for your critiquing pleasure:

  1. College roommate and I both fell for the same girl, also a roommate. She chose him. No hard feelings or any particular drama in this circumstance. Still on good terms with both.

  2. Few months later, really liked a girl and she seemed to like me. We went to the beach alone at night. She asked to play so we messed around a bit. Asked if I could kiss her, she said no. Took her home after a bit and apologized that it wasn’t that great for her, thought things would be fine (at least as friends) but she refused to talk to me ever again. Still confused about this one – not sure if I did something truly terrible or if she’s just slightly crazy.

  3. Went on a roadtrip with a friend, had a great time, laughed a lot, on the way back she suddenly blurted out “Reply, I really don’t like you like that”. What the hell – I made no romantic overtones of any sort, wasn’t about to either. Not sure why she felt the need for a pre-emptive strike. Later that night she came to my room and gave me a hand-written rock that said something like “When there’s no one else out there, you always have yourself to count on.” Nice, if bizarre and unnecessary, gesture. Friendship didn’t last.

  4. Brief tumultuous sexually-tense friendship with a married polyamorous woman; nothing beyond a kiss happened, thankfully. Things got overcomplicated, I asked if we could just have a regular relationship, she said no and I broke it off. Still platonic friends.

  5. Met a potential roommate on Craigslist. She gave the room to someone else but invited me over a few weeks later to hang out. Spent a few hours talking in the garden and ended up staying overnight. First night was on the couch, then in her bed. Turns out she’s bi but we fool around anyway; no sex, but other enjoyable activities. I thought we might be dating. Then abruptly she tells me she’s not interested and never really talks to me again. Acknowledges my existence when we meet in public but otherwise ignores all communication.

  6. Fell in love with a good friend, feeling wasn’t mutual, dramatic for a few weeks then calmed down, ultimately no hard feelings. Still on good terms.

  7. Repeat #6 with maybe three or four others.

  8. On okcupid (a dating site), messaged some 75-100 women. Maybe 10 replied. One accepted a date (my first one with a complete stranger). It went fine and the company was enjoyable, but there were no sparks for either of us. We both moved on.

Etc.

Point being, it ain’t for a lack of trying. I meet a ton of people and get along fine with the vast majority of them and I’ve asked many of them out as friends and most will accept but it never gets anywhere beyond that.

Anyway, I don’t want to just rant aimlessly. If you have questions I’d be glad to answer them, but otherwise, care to share any advice? This is frustrating, to say the least.

2

Dude, seriously, stop apologizing for yourself.

I’m not sure if you do this in real life, but don’t put your flaws on the forefront. It’s OK to have flaws, there’s just no need to advertise them.

Also, you never ask a woman if you can kiss her. Just do it!

3

I’m not sure I have any advice, but just from reading and having a quick look at your profile I think you sound really lovely! The picture is gorgeous too. If I hadn’t been very much in love for the past 10 years I’d date you! :slight_smile: So chin up, it sounds to me like plain bad luck and nothing on your part.

You say you’ve only been on one date from OK Cupid, so just keep going.

And when following advice that you might get here, be sure you don’t go overboard. However cliched it might be to say it, the most important thing really is to be yourself. Even if you feel completely disheartened, keep going into everything with an open heart and full enthusiasm.

I had a friend who had no luck at all and desperately wanted a girlfriend. Now he’s suddenly fighting them off. I have no idea why, he didn’t change at all. It’s just luck as far as I can tell, and perhaps a sort of snowball-effect: when someone else is attracted to you you become more attractive. I’m not sure it’s something you can realistically fake, but confidence does help.

So get out there, act like you god’s gift to women but stay your kind, romantic, humble, lovely self.

4

I agree with gracer. I’m not on the market, but if I were I would be chasing you. Everything in your profile sounds fun, earthy, and sincere. Your field might be narrow because of the vegan/outdoorsy thing, but you really ought to stick with like-minded people when possible. I find you very appealing. Do you feel shy or awkward when interacting in person? Sometimes people who are very good at expressing themselves on paper aren’t quite as accessible in person.

5

Maybe you’re going for the wrong type of woman. I’ve seen a lot of guys moon after some chick they think is bee-you-taful, only she’s actually as deep as reflection. Maybe you’re too intellectual, or too serious, or too intense, or something else that identifies you as not the regular type of guy. Don’t end up falling for girls looking for some kind of ‘chemistry’ that isn’t there. Find the girl you’d like as a friend, pursue her as a girl friend, and end the relationship if she’s not interested. Don’t fall for the “let’s be friends” thing unless she’s helping you get laid. That’s what friends do. Otherwise she’s a user.

6

You don’t sound uninteresting on your profile and of course you aren’t hideous.

Perhaps you are coming across as desperate? I know from experience that that can be a real turn off. And of course, it’s hard not to come off that way when it’s how you’re feeling, but I’d just suggest you work on ways to be more confident.

Maybe you could try asking one of the girls you’re still friendly with?

Good luck to you. Being lonely really does suck.

7

Um…what? Here’s my advice - stop preying on your friends. It’s creepy and unproductive. Go out and do something you’ve never done before. Volunteer somewhere. Find your area’s local young professionals group, and get involved there. Do not go to any of these events looking to meet women, or with the intention of asking someone out. Once you find an activity you enjoy, and interact normally with the participants, see if there’s anyone you’d be interested in, and if there’s any sort of connection.

I’d say that 90% of this is because your priorities and expectations are completely out of whack. Girls can smell “I’m looking for someone to ask out” a mile away. So stop going into activities with that mindset. Be comfortable in your own skin, doing your own thing. Until you can do that, you’re not going to have much luck.

8

Wow…you seem to be doing better than I am. I’m looking to get back to college - so I’ll be in my early 30s when I get my career going.
As an undergraduate I was a mature student - I wasn’t particularly wizened or Gandalf-esque, but there were a few barriers that stopped me from dating my fellow students -mostly to do with confidence as I always felt like a dreadful underachiever.
Two of my friends - one a man, another a woman - have been single for almost ten years now. The girl is a history fanatic. She dedicated her life to museums, and is pretty content with her lot. She’s confident, witty and intelligent - and I’d imagine most men are terrified of her. Last time we spoke, she told me that she doesn’t really like people touching her affectionately - and, in a way, I understand her completely : Romance can be spine tingling awkward.

The boy is similar, but has problems with honesty - by which I mean, he’s far too honest for his own good. He talks openly about porn - which he watches a lot of -, he’s also spoken about prostitutes in the same kind of pragmatic way you do : as nothing more than a means to an end.

  • I think, as far as sex is concerned, pragmaticism is a dreadful idea. And just like I’m finding with my job hunt, you’re only really desirable once you’ve obtained what you want. In my case, this is a job - once I have a job, I’ll be deemed ‘employable’, and will get more job offers. Once you have a gf, you’ll be ‘datable’. -It doesn’t make sense, but it seems to me people want more than just ‘proof’ that one’s datable/employable. You need to be ‘sought after’ and ‘confident’…and that kind of thing has nothing to do with pragmatics. -Most of the ‘sort after’, confident people I know are odious city boys in suits - they all have hot wives though. Most of my friends are just confidently eccentric - which paid off, after a certain amount of time. It’s desperation that kills chances - people sense it, and before long you can find yourself in a vicious circle.

Anyway…he was a mature student, too - the son a a diplomat from Taiwan, and he’d already travelled the world and spent some time in the army before starting his studies in London. He is/was completely devoid of pretence and spoke openly about anything, to anyone - undergrad students are still children really and I think most students found his honesty a bit too freakish. As such, he was labelled as a lovable weirdo and never got laid. -However, since getting a job, a routine, profession - other than mad physicist - he’s had a few girlfriends. In fact, recently he was complaining about unwanted attention.

I suppose that’s ‘long term’ - I mean you don’t really want to wait till your career unfold to get laid/have a relationship. Perhaps this woman will help :
http://www.ted.com/talks/amy_cuddy_your_body_language_shapes_who_you_are.html

…The idea being : Don’t fake it 'til you make it, fake it 'til you become it!

Other than my pennies worth - which is probably quite useless - all I can say is, I looked at your OKC profile, and you seem like a ‘nice guy’ - but I bet you hate that.

Good luck - I bet you’ll find a nice girl in due time. I’m sorry you’re having to be so patient.

9

Your profile indicates that you are a fairly interesting and genuine guy who knows who he is.

My suspicion: In person, you lack self-confidence and it shows. Such people are usually a drag to be around.

This is what you should work on.
mmm

10

I’m not attracted to your profile at all. But I’m a straight guy so what do you care.

I hate to say it but you are doing something wrong. No way to know from what you are giving us. Someone close to you knows. Ask them. I don’t think I am particularly attractive or special. I don’t have the ability to go into a bar and pick up who I want. But I have been reasonably successful in relationships. If I can do it anyone can. Maybe your expectations are too high? One of my acquaintances who has become old, bitter and alone complains constantly about the evils of women and why they won’t date a nice guy like him. Believe me it is obvious to all his friends.

If I had to guess from what you describe I could see you coming off as desparate or too needy. You seem to set your default position for women at love. Try for fun and see if love happens. I could be wrong about that but its the impression I get.

The whole hippy vegan green thing you are pushing on your profile will narrow your choices. But you do want someone you are compatible with so that might not be a bad thing.

But don’t be discouraged by lack of responses from online dating sites. If you get replies from 1 out of 10 you are doing fantastic. Its usually a lot less than that. And it takes only one.

11

As someone who can sympathize with the OP, I think these two posts may not be as helpful as you’d hoped. Hearing “if only I wasn’t…” gets absolutely maddening after a while.

12

Well, I did indicate I didn’t think I’d be very helpful. I should also add that there are two reason that I mentioned that:

  1. The “problem” is not anything I can deduce from his profile & description of himself. He sounds like a catch. There might be something else, but going by this he is perfectly dateable. It’s not like he’s asking what the problem in his dating life is and then describing how every time he takes his shoes of his date faints from the smell. That way we could give advice on what he might change. But he sounds good to go.

  2. As others have mentioned, confidence is important. If you get turned down all the time it’s easy to start thinking that there is something intrinsically wrong with you, that you are not attractive, that you are unlovable etc. The OP isn’t any of that. He sounds attractive to me. Confidence is attractive, knowing that you are attractive is attractive. Hey, someone (actually, 2 people!) on the internet “would” date you! Show it! :slight_smile:

I get that you get tired of people saying this. Just know that it’s not sympathy, it’s true.

13

Since you’re looking for advice, I’ll move this to our advice forum, IMHO.

twickster, MPSIMS moderator

14

I very much agree with this. When I was freshly separated I heard all the time from my married female friends what a catch I was. But they never had any suggestions about who should catch me. It was very frustrating and not very helpful.

15

But the thing is he has been totally unsuccessful so far. 0 for 30 years. That is not normal for someone who seems to be a regular guy. He is doing something fundementally wrong. Maybe its his choices in women. Maybe its some vibe he is giving off. You can’t know what it is from the information given. You have not met him. You have no idea if you would date him. It is not helpful.

OP I don’t want to beat up on you. You do remind me of a younger version of someone I know. You don’t want to turn into him. Talk to someone in your life that you trust. Someone who will be brutally honest with you. Find out what you are doing wrong. And listen to them. If I had to guess I would say its probably some sort of combination of desperation and picking the wrong/out of your league women. But there is really no way to tell without knowing you. You are not going to get much useful advice here. Talk to people who know you.

16

If I wasn’t almost twice your age…

17

and
one date isn’t enough to decide there are ‘no sparks’.
Unless there were some serious red flags going up I always gave it three dates.

18

I think it’s your single minded pursuit of your ultimate goal that’s getting in your way. When you’re seeking ‘true love’, ‘the one’, in relationships (and seriously, who’s not?), with a driven spirit, it begins to appear that you’re looking for something external to yourself, to complete you.

Others are intuitively turned off by this, sensing that until you’re enough for yourself, no one can really fill that gap. The journey is not to seek true love, the journey is to seek to be worthy of true love.

What if someone had a crystal ball and they could say, with absolute certainty, Reply will not find a mate, in this life. He will have many friends and pleasant times, but not a pair bond. What would your life look like if you knew that information? Would you throw yourself off a roof? Spend decades stuck in depression? Become obnoxiously aggressive and repel people? Chances are, if that really were your future, eventually, you’d be glad to have this information so you wouldn’t waste any more time or energy or disappointment or frustration bothering with it. Chances are, like every individual who faces a life changing injury, you’d find a path to some sort of life that would still interest and engage you. You’d find a way to make a contribution, and you’d find a way to be alright with your fate.

You should try living your life as though this were true. If you’re not destined to pairbond, well, that frees up some time and energy for adventure and challenge in your life. Take up a couple of activities that force you out of your comfort zone. Do something daring. Just for you.

Suddenly you’ll find yourself as a guy who puts off a vibe that he goes out and finds life, doesn’t sit around waiting for life to come to him. Chicks love that! Good Luck!

19

I am only me, but your profile makes it sound like you have extremely high standards and are very romantic-minded, not in the Valentine’s Day way but in the Nathaniel Hawthorne way. It makes me feel like I’d have to act happy in overalls and gumboots mucking in the fields with you (after the 5 a.m. wakeup for yoga practice). It makes me feel like you’d find me intellectually inferior in conversation, and not be interested in the whole domestic marriage/kids/livable housing situation that I want out of life: like all of the safe, normal stuff is off-limits.

In short, I worry that being with you will involve constantly throwing away myself in order to live up to your high-minded ideals.

A lot of perpetual bachelors are that way because they know who they are and what they want, and it’s extremely hard to find a woman who wants the same thing.

But that’s just me, and others in this thread seem to like your profile.

20

You are not that much of an outlier. I’m around your age, and probably half of my girl friends have not been in a serious relationship. It’s not that unusual, especially for a traveller. It’s tough to build relationships on the road. It sounds like you are meeting women and getting some action, and that’s good.

Being in undergrad isn’t a dealbreaker, as long as you have a good story for it. It seems like you do. I’m one of those girls who has my stuff together, and I’d be fine dating someone who doesn’t have his stuff together, as long as he is interesting and not a trainwreck.

I would try to take the focus of “being in a relationship” and think more about “meeting women.” When a woman sees that a guy really, really, really wants to be in a relationship, it scares them because they start feeling like a placeholder rather than an individual. They worry that they are being cast for a role that you’ve already made up in your head, rather than being a part of something that is growing naturally from mutual affection.

A few thoughts on your profile- you look fine. Your profile is a little intimidating to me. When I see it, I think “Wow, I’m really bad at yoga and my spiritual connection to the earth is a little lacking. He probably won’t be in to me” If it is essential that your date is as into yoga, nature and spirituality as you, it’s fine. But if you are open to a wider range of women, you may want to tone it down a bit and bring in a wider variety of interests. The age range also stood out to me. I’m 31, reasonably cute and perfectly dateable (dating a 28 year old now), but I’d feel uncomfortable messaging you as someone on the upper edge of your age range. I’d feel self-conscious about my age and worry that I’m not really what you want…like you’d always be pining away for an undergrad. An age range that goes down to 21 doesn’t communicate to me “looking for a relationship.” It communicates “Looking for a hot girl to bang” or “looking for anything female to get with” or “looking for a young thing to brag about.” I absolutely would not message you or respond to you with your current profile based on that. And realistically, it’s going to be women closer to your age that are going to be interested in relationships. If you can bring yourself to add a couple years on the upper end and bump up the low end a bit, I think you might get more attention.

Keep going with OkCupid. A 10% response rate is actually not that bad. If you get ten messages out a day, that means you should be getting around seven messages back a day and at least one date a week. Most of them will be duds, but at the least it’s good practice.