I think you pretty much nailed it. I don’t go to Subway often, but once they advertised a special limited time sandwich on TV, something like a chicken, bacon, mushroom, ranch sandwich. I went to order it, and they put on chicken and asked what else? I very nicely said "well it says bacon, mushroom, and ranch, so I’d like that! Note I thought it perfectly reasonable that I should choose what else I might want in terms of veggies, etc., but was surprised that they didn’t realize that the sandwich would include the ingredients in its name.
Of course, once I stopped at a Subway on the way home from work and had to stand in line behind about 20 retirees who all were ordering two sandwiches. I ordered one and got a strange look from the employee. I looked all around the store and saw no indication of some kind of two for special, so maybe you had to be on some sort of secret list to find out!
That’s kind of my point; Subway (or at least their marketing department) is creating a difference in their offerings. Some sandwiches are noted as “made to order,” while others – usually a new offering – have a specific listing of ingredients.
If Subway is going to promote a sandwich as having specific ingredients, it’s a reasonable expectation by their customers to be able to order that sandwich by name and receive it exactly that way, without having to instruct Subway employees on how to make it.
And how does the employee know that you don’t want it differently?
If you’re telling me that a younger version of yourself making minimum wage at subway for your summer job wouldn’t make every customer state exactly what they want after the first soccer mom with an I-want-to-speak-to-the-manager haircut makes a scene because you DID make it with the specified ingredients, I think you’d be lying.
Also I think its important that you’re talking directly the person assembling the sandwich WHILE they’re assembling the sandwich, right in front of you, face to face.
At McDonalds, or Wendy’s, or a local custom sandwich shop, you’re most likely talking to someone working the cash register. The onus is clearly on you to specify any deviations from the menu. At Subway, or Chipotle, it’s a shared responsibility, with plenty of opportunity along the way to make changes, and by making you confirm the employee is just holding up their side of the bargain, even if just to cover their own ass so they don’t get yelled at for adding olives like the picture has.
Say I go into Subway and order an advertised sandwich, and the employee says “How do you want that?” I reply, “Just the way it’s advertised; it sounds good to me.”
So far, I have no problem with the interaction … nor, as I understand it, does the OP. It’s when the employee then becomes confused, and doesn’t know how the sandwich is supposed to be made based on the promotion, that I have an issue.
Odds are, I read the description of the sandwich in a flyer, or online, or what have you, and all of the ingredients sounded good to me. That’s what made me decide to order it in the first place.
However, that doesn’t mean I remember every item on the sandwich at that particular moment. What’s more, it’s not MY job to know that. It IS the employee’s job (or the job of the restaurant’s owner or manager to ensure the employees know).
Why wouldn’t they? There would be signs and stuff, “Order it Subway Style!”
Ummm, no. Why would you think that? I’d say it’s more that that is the way it is done at Subway. Other places do things differently. Do you complain that Chick-Fil-A customers are somehow Chick-Fil-A exceptional and can’t handle an option for hamburgers?
And the previous 20 customers that ordered the sandwich did not want those ingredients, and would have “very nicely said” so as well.
Was it a Tuesday?
They do sometimes run things like “Two for Tuesday.” They put these ads in the various circulars that they advertise in, in order to get people into the store. Just as, if there is a coupon for Buy one Get one on jars of pickles at the grocery store, they don’t put the coupon on the shelf in front of the pickles, they aren’t going to advertise the coupons that they used to get people in the door inside the store. So, not so much a “secret list” as a discount that goes out in newspapers, magazines, internet ads, and various other forms of public media.
When I worked at Burger King, we had a standing special that was two for $2.99 on the chicken sandwich on some particular day (I don’t remember which). The Sandwich by itself was 3.19. Now, the special was not advertised in the store, but instead in various media that was distributed to the public. I would find myself a bit surprised when people would order just one chicken sandwich after I had a bunch in a row order the two.
Or they all could have had a specific coupon that had nothing to do with the day, but all went together. Or, as you said they were all retirees, they may have had a coupon that was specific to their retirement community or senior center.
I can’t understand people who can’t understand what Sauron and the OP are saying.
We all know how to make a BMT, or a turkey, or a tuna, or a meatball. We have no problem with “Subway style”. We know the drill. Everyone knows what they like on a conventional sub,hero, grinder, what have you.
it’s the new, specialty, advertised sandwiches. When they are advertised (see Sauron’s post) as having a specific plan, a preferred set of ingredients, one assumes that the “Michelin five star Subway cooking college and test kitchens” have some idea of what combo makes the new sandwich best. They put it right in the ad! If I’ve never had a “Chicken & Bacon Ranch sandwich” I don’t want to screw it up by putting something on that’s going to clash, flavor-wise. On my second time, sure I can change.
Okay, this cracked me up. Yes, sometimes you can tell by the haircut that someone is likely to be “difficult” in a retail or food-service situation. I don’t know exactly what you meant by an “I-want-to-speak-to-the-manager haircut,” but I’m visualizing it as the Kate Gosselin style.
Incidentally, those of you who find the Subway system oppressive should stay away from Which Wich. The first time I went there, their ordering system seemed utterly inscrutable to me. They actually have a video on their website explaining how to order sandwiches there.
Also, I started a thread several years ago on restaurants with confusing or bizarre ordering systems, and yes, Subway did come up. Unfortunately, I screwed up the thread by confusing Which Wich with Togo’s in the OP. :smack:
Looking at their menu at a location somewhat near me, there appear to be eight pre-fab sandwiches that have a specific ingredients list, and there’s a separate menu for “build your own” sandwiches. I’ve never heard of this place, but I guess there’s 13 locations in the Chicagoland area (only one location in the city, though.) I’ll have to pop in and give it a shot one of these days.
The first Which Wich I encountered was in the Los Angeles area, and they had a rotating kiosk with pre-printed sandwich bags set up outdoors near the entrance. That thing stopped me in my tracks, and I stood there a long time looking at the bags and trying to figure out what the hell I was supposed to do. Once I got inside, the order-taker helpfully explained things. I don’t recall what sandwich I ordered, but I remember that it was pretty good.
There is a Which Wich in my town; I haven’t been there, but I’ve noticed that they don’t have the bag thing outside.
I think my post must have been hard to understand. I’m saying Subway’s business model is like selling a single type of minivans only, but changing minor trim items and calling the minivans “Corvette” and “Silverado” and “Impala”.
I think the disconnect is on the other side. I perfectly understand that the first time you ran into this situation, it might have surprised you but after that experience it should be clear to you that regardless of what you see in the advertising and promotions, when you get to a Subway, the sandwich maker is going to expect that you will specify what you want on the sandwich.
And the reason for that should be perfectly clear to you by now. Because of the expectations and habits of the vast majority of customers, it’s not worth the managers’ time to make the sandwich makers memorize any particular set of ingredients.
It’s a high-pressure, fast-moving, repetitive job. Say a sandwich maker makes 6 sandwiches an hour. In a 40-hour work week for 50 weeks let’s call it 12,000 sandwiches.
I would guess that someone like you walking up to them and expecting that the sandwich maker will know the pre-set ingredients for a specific promotional statement won’t show up more than once a month.
That’s 12 out of 12,000 interactions. And I think that’s a generous estimate.
I think it’s far more likely that you will find people complaining about the inclusions of pre-set ingredients if they did it the other way around. It’s simply not worth it to them to change the way they they operate.
It would be a bit odd for me to ask, “What’s in a Turkey Bacon sandwich?”
I would expect a restaurant employee to look at me odd and say, “Well, sir, there’s Turkey and there’s bacon – DUH! And then you can put whatever else you want on top.”
But some names aren’t so clear.
I could imagine “Why is there a slab of beef on my Barbecue Turkey Bacon sandwich?”
And getting the answer, “Because the beef is barbecued Tri-Tip, sliced thin. Plus you have oven-baked turkey and microwaved bacon – plus the extras you specified.”
And realizing aloud, “Oh! I thought the Turkey was barbecued and it also has bacon.”
And a lot of names are even less clear.
Everybody on the planet knows what goes into a Big Mac. There are commercial jingles and shaggy dog stories about it (I’ll post one later in MPSIMS). Two millennia from today, people will still be singing that #$%&* jingle and knowing exactly what goes into a Big Mac even if McDonalds and/or cows no longer exist. But there’s nothing about “Big Mac” that indicates what is in the menu item. And there’s nothing in a “French Godfather” that tells us what’s in the menu item. And the fact that a Reuben is considered well known and standard seems to belie the fact that a lot of people still specify “on Rye” – making it seem that one can have a Reuben on toasted sourdough just as easily and (maybe) achieve equally appetizing results.
I think the issue Asuka is pointing out (and correct me if I’m wrong on this, Asuka) is that there’s a regional or somehow-centralized Subway office that’s arranging for TV ads and window posters for sub sandwiches with specific names – and then the employees of a Subway restaurant within the domain of that centralized office have no clue what should be in the sandwich. If the central office is going to take the trouble to make posters and TV adverts, then it really behooves them to expend just a tiny bit more effort to inform the customer service locations. Send an e-mail or snapchat message or postcard or flyer (Hey! Maybe include it in the package containing the big window poster!) that tells the franchise managers that a new menu item is going to be advertised and they can expect customers to come in wanting to try it and (just for grins and giggles) here’s a list of the key components. That way, when a customer – ANY customer – comes in and says, “I saw an ad for the Subway Sicilian Supreme on the side of a bus this morning and I decided to come in for lunch and try it. What’s on it again?”
And, since the owner/manager is doing his job properly and the employees are getting informed when necessary, they can glance at the printed e-mail that’s taped to the edge of the counter (just below the preparation surface so there’s no chance the paper will fall into the ingredient bins) and recite “It’s a meatball sandwich with diced onions, pepperoni slices, mozzarella and, of course, the marinara sauce that the meatballs come in – plus whatever extras you specify, naturally.”
To which I can reply, “Gosh, I didn’t notice the diced onions when that bus was passing. Onions are too hot for me. Just give me a meatball sandwich with pepperoni and mozzarella.”
“In other words, the Sicilian Supreme without the onions.”
“Yeah, sure. On sourdough, please.”
“Any other extras?”
Why is that so difficult? Is it really too much to ask a district-/regional-/corporate-/somehow-centralized-headquarters to tell the front line customer servers what they are going to be expected to give the customers? Nobody is objecting to the add-your-own-extras model* that Subway uses. Nobody is objecting to the have-it-your-way customization that Burger King introduced and made into a famous (lampoon-able) song. Every restaurant from The Habit to the planet-spanning-golden-arches has conceded that the customers must be allowed to request exceptions and extras they are expected to be repeat customers. The objection is to a central office to fail or neglect to inform the front line when they unveil a new product or campaign that those front line people will be expected to know about.
Customer: “Is your Chicken Ranch Supreme Sub Kosher?”
Clueless manager: “Uhhhh…well…”
Cashier who pays attention at the monthly crew meetings: “Normally yes; it’s just Chicken and Provolone; no ham or bacon. Of course you can add some extras that are not kosher, if you wish.”
I worked at McDonalds back when I was a youngen and there were way too many people who ordered cheeseburgers without cheese. You have to assume everyone is stupid. Because they are. The only explanation we came up with was they were thinking they were getting a “special made” burger so we would make it fresh instead of giving them one that has been under a heat lamp for 2 hours. Nope. We gave them a regular hamburger that had been under the heat lamp for 2 hours.
Fixed quote so it doesn’t mess up my post.
Jersey Mikes having “Mikes Way” is annoying if you don’t want it “Mikes Way” which I don’t. They ask if you want it Mikes Way and I say no that I want everything except lettuce and mayo and with extra pepper relish. They tend say something dumb like, “So Mikes Way with extras.” or “So Mikes Way with more toppings.” or the even dumber, “So, not Mikes Way?”
And of course they then go on to ask if I want every other topping that is “everything except lettuce and mayo” that is not included in “Mikes Way”.
And after they ask if I really want the pepper relish and I say yes I always ask for a couple of little cups of extra relish because that stuff is like crack and just like crack goes good with everything.
I think the disconnect is that some people are way too emotionally invested in Subway. It’s one step up from Solent Green; shuffle in tell them what glop you want on it and eat it under the fluorescent light while you ponder what your younger self would think about the person you’ve become. There’s a reason it’s $5,if I can get out of there without planning my suicide, it’s a win.
Or, you never know, they may have been used to one like all the Mc D’s in my area- which haven’t had hamburgers listed on the actual menu in about 20 years. And whenever I tried to order a hamburger, I got a befuddled look - I can only assume there was no button on the register so they didn’t know how to charge me. So I ended up ordering a cheeseburger with no cheese.
Or, as I’ve said twice now, it’s not worth it for store managers to take the time to force their employees to do that, because so few customers will want that.
If it’s happening every time you go to Subway then how about giving them the benefit of the doubt that they have figured out what is most efficiently serving their customers?
OK, so the “special sandwich” they advertise doesn’t really exist and is a mere placeholder because bread with meat only would look too empty. (IMO, that’s false advertising, but that’s not the issue here.)
Why can’t the sandwich artist say so? I honestly doubt the OP is the only one who’d ask that - I probably would ask as well, since I’d be thinking “hey, that looks tasty, though I wonder what’s in it”.
Why not simply reply to the OPs question with “It’s basically this and that meat, the rest is up to you, the pic’s just an example.” perhaps adding “We don’t get a list of suggestions, sorry”.
Instead of blank stares and confusion.
[edit]No one is expecing a one hour dissertation about how the different flavors react to each other.
Also, just to make sure: the real fault definitlely lies with management/marketing. Someone there didn’t understand their job. Which should be making sure the exchange of money for sandwich goes through as fast and painless as possible.
The poor soul at the counter is merely the one getting all the flak, their fault being perhaps not thinking fast enough to come up with the above suggested answer.