David C’s version of Eleanor Rigby is growing on me. I think I actually like the studio version better. (Except the part with the background singers. Ugh.)
On the other hand, Carly’s studio version of Come Together is meh.
I don’t know what is it about Brooke that rubs me the wrong way. Her cheerfulness? It’s not that I feel she isn’t sincere - I think she is - but it still bugs me. (Of course, it could be worse. She could be Kristy Lee.)
[QUOTE=HazelNutCoffee]
David C’s version of Eleanor Rigby is growing on me. I think I actually like the studio version better. (Except the part with the background singers. Ugh.)<snip>
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It’s not just me, then - they sound like chipmunks, don’t they?
It’s more than just bangs. All of the hair on the sides and everything is combed forward.
[QUOTE=wmulax93]
I’m probably still bitter that they didn’t credit Me First and the Gimme Gimmes for the arrangement of “Hello” and the song he sang the week before that.
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I just thought to look this up… and is this the arrangement you’re talking about? If so I see very little similarity to the hauntingly beautiful song that Cook sang…
Totally agree about Arhetcetera v. Cook. Little David A. is a very good singer, but he’s basically a talented child (far moreso than Sanjaya certainly, but a talented child nonetheless). I seriously doubt he has the life experience and the exposure to really understand the meanings of the deeper lyrics he sings. He’s also infinitely more easy listening/Broadway than rock or pop- I can see him making a fantastic Simba in the Broadway version of The Lion King because that’s his voice and his look, and I think he’d be really happy at it.
With Cook (who’s going to be a star regardless of how he finishes in this) not only does he seem to feel his words, you the listener feel them. I think a lot of it has to do with their wildly different backgrounds- Archie as an upper middle class (I’m guessing) kid on the talent show circuit and Cook as self-supporting bartender and front man of a band in nightclubs for years and years.
I agree with just about everything that Sam Stone and Sampiro are saying. I’m not sure I feel that Archuleta is a robot–I think he’s trying really, really hard to feel the emotions of the songs. Remember “Heaven” in Hollywood? I saw a kid trying his damndest, and I’ve seen shades of it since. I don’t know that he’s getting there, though, and I don’t know that it looks good on a teenager. I think his most recent performance fit him very well, and my favorite of his was “Shop Around.” If he picks a slower song, he needs to stop going for these “message” songs and go for something like a love song instead–a teenager like him can pull off those emotions much better. “Imagine” sounds naive coming from a teenager. To me, at least. Otherwise, I’ve got nothing against him and I hope he does well. (The only contestant I dislike at all this year is KLC, but that’s enough hate for the whole season.)
Liberal, I appreciate your grades AND your other contributions to these AI threads. And yes–David Cook has bangs, not a combover!!
He just uses 80% of the hair on his head as bangs.
[QUOTE=featherlou]
It’s not just me, then - they sound like chipmunks, don’t they?
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Hah. Yes. Ugh. Whoever thought they were a good idea should be shot.
They were especially horrid this week. We noticed it most with Carly’s song… we looked at each other and did a “wtf?!” when the backup singers were doing their thing. They sucked!
[QUOTE=Liberal]
IOr why in other cases, things about him are completely made up, like saying that he’s never done an up-tempo song.
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Wow. Isn’t it ironic that the only made-up statment so far is actually this one?
David Cook’s Studio Version of Billie Jean
Listen to that. The guy has amazing power in his voice. He’s way better than what you hear on TV. He may be one of the best rock singers I’ve ever heard. Listen to the angst he manages to put into that - and it fits the song. Angry, frightened, frustrated. You can hear all of that in that performance.
Here’s David Archuleta’s studio recording from the same week.
To me there’s a huge difference. That song just kind of lies there. The inflections he puts in the song don’t enhance it, don’t evoke anything. It’s smooth jazz, or something you might hear at Up With People. There’s no doubt he can sing, though. He’s got a powerful voice. But it’s pretty boring.
So is the kid his or not?
[QUOTE=Sam Stone]
Listen to that. The guy has amazing power in his voice. He’s way better than what you hear on TV. He may be one of the best rock singers I’ve ever heard.
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Just out of curiosity, who are some of the other best rock singers that he ranks among in your opinion? I agree he’s talented, but I see a statement like that and think, “Ok, Freddie Mercury, Brad Delp, Robert Plant, Axl Rose… David Cook?”
I have listened to the studio version of Billie Jean probably 30 times today. I made it to 1:45 of David A.'s studio version from Sam Stone’s link, and I closed the window. I didn’t feel at all compelled to hear the rest of the song. With David Cook’s song, I wanted it to keep going. I was engaged with the story of the song and with the emotions he put into it. David A. might become a great singer some day, but right now he’s just a kid with a good instrument.
Listened to the studio version of Eleanor Rigby, still don’t like it. I really don’t like what he did with the song. It reminds me of how the band Orgy butchered New Order’s Blue Monday. Actually, there are a lot of parallels. Both are overly aggressive on songs that are supposed to be cold, both add choruses where they don’t belong, both miss the point.
[QUOTE=Slacker]
Just out of curiosity, who are some of the other best rock singers that he ranks among in your opinion? I agree he’s talented, but I see a statement like that and think, “Ok, Freddie Mercury, Brad Delp, Robert Plant, Axl Rose… David Cook?”
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Well, hang on. David Cook hasn’t shown the kind of creativity or created the body of work those other singers have, so he’s just not in their class. And rock music is a hard category to judge singers in, because in rock it’s not about whether you are exactly on pitch or can do jazz runs or have a four octave range. It’s all about emotion, power, and song delivery. There are critics who believe John Lennon is one of the best rock singers ever (and so do I), but on a purely technical level he was no match for a lot of other singers.
David Cook has a really powerful, emotional voice. Listen to Billy Jean again. The closest person I’d compare him to would be Eddie Vedder from Pearl Jam, or maybe Scott Weiland from Stone Temple Pilots and Velvet Revolver. Both are singers I like quite a lot, so some of this is just personal bias, I suppose. A lot also depends on the playing field he finds himself on - he’s got a good modern rock voice. I’m not he’d do so well if he moved into other genres. I guess we’ll see on weeks to come.
Brooke White also has it. For the style of music she’s aiming herself at (female singer/songwriter a la Carly Simon or Carole King), she’s got a wonderful voice, because that style of music calls for a voice that can express a wide range of emotion, and she has that. Take her out of that genre and make her sing Pat Benatar or Chrissy Hind, and her voice might come across as twangy and flat. But it really, really fits her chosen style.
[QUOTE=Sam Stone]
David Cook’s Studio Version of Billie Jean
Listen to that. The guy has amazing power in his voice. He’s way better than what you hear on TV. He may be one of the best rock singers I’ve ever heard. Listen to the angst he manages to put into that - and it fits the song. Angry, frightened, frustrated. You can hear all of that in that performance.
Here’s David Archuleta’s studio recording from the same week.
To me there’s a huge difference. That song just kind of lies there. The inflections he puts in the song don’t enhance it, don’t evoke anything. It’s smooth jazz, or something you might hear at Up With People. There’s no doubt he can sing, though. He’s got a powerful voice. But it’s pretty boring.
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Due respect, but that’s a ridiculous comparison for one reason on account of the difference in the songs themselves. What sort of anger, fright, or frustration would even be appropriate for “You’re the Voice”? I can see saying that one is a better song than the other, but not that David didn’t evoke emotions in a smooth jazz number. I did agree that Cook was better than Archuleta that night, and graded them accordingly. But Archuleta, in my opinion, has done better on other nights, which is another reason the comparison is not completely fair.
Coming back to “Imagine” — and nevermind the automatic dismissals from prejudice — but Archuleta did exactly of that song what you’re demanding now. He made it emotional, literally tugging at his own heart as he pleaded for the world to come together. His “brotherhood of man” was as heartfelt an appeal as could be possibly done by a human being. But people (here) aren’t judging the song on those merits; rather, they’re ripping it for having a different melody than the original. But Jesus, if that’s the criterion, then Cook’s version of “Billie Jean” bites the whole wad.
When I grade the singers (and thank you, Millit the Frail) I try to do so dispassionately unless they’ve utterly mangled the song, as when I gave Archuleta a “D” for forgetting lyrics. My criteria for each performance deal with what the singer does with the song he/she has. There’s no way I’m going to conclude that X did worse than Y because X wasn’t as emotional with “I Want to Hold Your hand” as Y was with “Eleanor Rigby”. The song choice itself might be suspect, but even that depends on how well it connected with the audience at the time.
I can understand a person liking Cook’s Vedderisms just because they like that kind of voice more than a purer voice. And I think it’s fair to compare him to Vedder since it is obvious that that is his greatest influence — just as I felt it was fair to compare Amanda to Joplin, whom she seemed to be emulating, and whom she failed miserably to live up to. But Archuleta’s background, as he has said, is a father who loved jazz and a mother who loved Latin bands. Those are his influences, and he deserves credit that his voice — with the purity of Stevie Wonder and the depth of Elton John — fits well.
I also can understand the “I just don’t like him period” sentiment. That’s pretty much how I feel about Kristy Lee Cook. But giving her anything but an “A” for last week would have been ludicrous if for no other reason than simply the choice of song.
So, I agree that Cook’s “Billie Jean” is better than Archuleta’s “You’re the Voice”, but not because of any intrinsic quality of Cook that is superior to Archuleta. Chances are, their fortunes will yet again flip on any given night. Cook will choose a sucky song that few connect with, and Archuleta will pick a winner. When this happens, the diehard Cook fans will excuse it away with this and that mitigating factor while assailing Archuleta with misspellings of his name and expressions of generalized disgust no matter how well he does.
As I say, I’m glad that this year, I don’t really dislike anyone. I think it makes my judgments more fair than they’ve been in the past. I’m not saying I’m better than anyone else here, just that I’m satisfied with my evaluations, that they’re not as prejudicial as they have been before. I’ve acknowledged Archuleta’s musical immaturity, for example, but damn if I’m going to start with that as a premise every time he opens his mouth. If he nails it, I’m going to give him credit for it. Same same with Cook and the others.
For comparison, John Farnham’s original version of “You’re The Voice”. It’s not a complicated song; it’s not fancy and frilly - it’s more of an anthem than anything. David A.'s studio version is technically very well done, and it doesn’t move me at all (I’ve loved John Farnham’s song since the 80’s). Maybe it’s just because he’s doing practically a note-for-note cover. Maybe he needed to change it up more. I don’t know.
As for David Cook being an Eddie Vedder type singer, I normally can’t stand bands like Pearl Jam/Stone Temple Pilots/whatever straight-ahead kind of rock band/singer that substitute emotion for singing ability, but I like David Cook. That speaks more to his individual talent than it does to the type of music he’s singing or the style he’s singing in.
[QUOTE=Liberal]
But people (here) aren’t judging the song on those merits; rather, they’re ripping it for having a different melody than the original. But Jesus, if that’s the criterion, then Cook’s version of “Billie Jean” bites the whole wad.
[/QUOTE]
You’ve just demonstrated that you don’t even remotely understand what people are complaining about with regard to “Imagine”. It’s not that he changed the melody, it’s that he made the melody suck ass. When Syesha changed the melody of “Yesterday” a little bit I didn’t like it as much as the original melody, but I still loved her performance. David A.'s “Imagine” was horrible because the melody that he removed was exceptional and the one he replaced it with was lame as hell. David Cook’s melody changes still sounded good. Syesha’s melody changes still sounded good. David A.'s melody change sounded like crap.
[QUOTE=OpalCat]
You’ve just demonstrated that you don’t even remotely understand what people are complaining about with regard to “Imagine”.
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I think there’s plenty of misunderstanding to go around, frankly. Still, you just finished saying that you don’t care what I think, so I don’t know why you’re bothering to explain this to me. I do understand that you think Archuleta’s melody sucked, but a substantial number of people disagree with you about that — including me. From my point of view, which doesn’t interest you, Archuleta could not have done a melody you would have found acceptable, no matter what it might have been because you find him to be an “emotionally uninvolved singing robot”. How could such a creature ever please you?