If at all possible, I would love it if African-Americans could speak on this thread. I am not asking whites or other races to stay off completely, but I would really like to hear what blacks have to say.
In case you are wondering about my “credentials”, as the OP, they are kind of weird.
First, I have a black ancestor, a slave woman who escaped to Canada in the 1850s. I was not even aware of this until I became an adult because my heavily racist father was ashamed of this part of his origin. I find it impossible to say that I am black, because I have no real connection with black culture or identity. Except that I like Diana Ross, but that is probably more the gay part of me. People usually ask if I am Italian or Lebanese because of my tan complexion and straight brown hair. On the other hand, I am proud to be descended from this woman who must have been extraordinarily brave and resourceful to have escaped slavery, and when people ask about my ancestry I mention her with pride. But culturally, I identify as a French Canadian, because that is how I was raised.
I have been gay all my life, and I am now pushing 70. I have been married to the same man for almost 40 years.
And yes, I do seem to detect a streak of homophobia in African-American culture, but I could be wrong, especially since I don’t even live in the US.
There are racial differences. I can’t find a super recent study, but this one from 2011 says 64% of hispanics are supportive, 58% of whites, and 49% of blacks. That’s actually a smaller difference than I would have guessed. If I had to make a total guess I’d say a lot of that is probably accounted for in greater religious membership (perhaps augmented by a different breakdown in the religious affiliation, as alluded to by thelurkinghorror
For this to be a fact, it first has to be a fact that something genetic that only effects black people that forces them to believe in being afraid of something specific. That sounds rather silly.
It’s more accurate to say that their sub culture has a higher than normal or progressive rate of yielding black communities that tend to be afraid of gays…assuming you are referring to homophobia and not actual bigotry against gays. There is a difference.
Otherwise this goes straight to stereotyping. Many American’s have a hard time distinguishing between stereotyping, racism, bias and bigotry. Why I have no clue because we learn those differences in elementary school. Fear can lead to both bias and bigotry. Sub culturally over time, fear can yield the results of all 4 but to what percentage of any given population is just a guess from anyone.
Anyway, if you are gay and you are sensitive to the responses of others, it’s because you are more self conscious based on historic social stigma’s, taboo’s…etc of the things that you grew up with from experience.If you grew up without any awareness of other’s judgements against gays for example, you have a much higher likelihood of not perceiving the same level of negativities toward your sexual preferences. This is why especially the black communities tend to be more sensitive to …well anything slightly negative from their own perspective. A sub conscious over sensitivity can yield to an irrational perspective of something that may not really exist. Your streaks of blacks being homophobic could be based on many reasons from within but to say any particular group of people is also just says that it’s based solely only your observations. Others will have their own, some of it is geologic based on sub culture or beliefs but you’ll never be happy judging others, judging you.
The Wikipedia article, Homophobia in the African American community, has a number of interesting links on the topic, some showing statistics that indicate that homophobia is not seriously worse among American blacks than among other groups, some noting that the perception of black homophobia might be driven by the volume of anti-gay blacks rather than the opinions of the majority.
I never considered Blacks in the US to be more more homophobic than other groups. I think it has more to do more with religion. So if you’re a black or white Protestant, or maybe Mormon, you’ll tend to be against gay marriage and things like that.
I think another factor could be that a lot of high-volume blacks (such as the aforementioned rappers) make it a point of pride to sprinkle their speech with insults which “don’t mean that, man!”. Mofo. Nigger. Cunt. “Oh, but it don’t mean that, man, it’s not an insult, you don’t understand; when I call my bro a mothafucka I don’t mean he fuck his momma!” And when they call someone a faggot, well, it may be descriptive, it may be a homophobic insult, or it may be an apellative which “don’t mean that, man!”
The same happens in other contexts: MMOs, music concerts from people who like to think of themselves as “edgy”, “bad boys”… I jump every time I hear Spanish-language singers calling their public cabrones - srsly? If any of the guys in the public was called a cabrón by some dude they don’t know, that dude would be putting his face at risk, but hey, if it’s the singer of their favorite band it’s “bonding between bros, man, you just don’t understand.”
There was a period in the late 80s / early 90s where a lot of rap songs told the story of a guy meeting what he thinks is a hot woman, getting her home and discovering that it’s actually a man.
This tells me that, for a while in the black community, there was an epidemic of gay men successfully passing themselves off as attractive women and preying on straight guys, hoping that at the point of the big reveal their prey will just shrug and get on with it. No wonder there’s the hate!
But seriously, different cultures nurture or fight intolerance to different extents. The US is still, in general, behind the curve when it comes to gay rights compared to much of the developed world. I think it would be misleading to depict it as American whites being pro-gay and Blacks being anti-gay.
But to try to answer it, one thing is that the black community may have more of a cultural influence from the developing world (e.g. caribbean), where intolerance seems to be more common. Whereas the white community does not have such ties to (intolerant) developing caucasion regions such as the middle east.
Why developing countries tend to be more intolerant is another question.
Is it really specific to Black Americans? How many African countries have laws against homosexuality on their books? (Spoiler alert: 39 of 54. Interestingly, some of the most dangerous and unstable countries, like Congo, Guinea-Bissau and Rwanda have no such laws. Maybe the prevalence of AK-47s in private hands make them more socially progressive?) Robert Mugabe famously claimed that homosexuality was “un-African” and “a white disease.” (There is plenty of evidence that homosexual activity was widespread prior to any European colonization of Africa). Could Black American attitudes just be holdovers from before the Middle Passage?
I don’t think it’s any more homophobic than other genres. If “faggot” is used it is a generic insult, and yes, can be considered insulting to gays (as it is considered something to be avoided). But the most homophobia in “black” music is in reggae/ska/dancehall/dub, which follows Jamaica’s poor record of homophobia. I don’t know enough about some African genres to say if that is the same, but I also think Occam’s razor suggests that it is not very related to black homophobia in the US.
Yeah, Hip-Hop itself is not homophobic or anti-gay. There are rappers within hip-hop that are anti-gay, homophobic, or prejudiced towards gays.
As far as being a reflective of an entire race, I don’t think that’s accurate at all. The most outspoken rapper against gays was a white rapper, Eminem. However, I think you’ll find, that in any culture where aggression and the stereotyped ideal of masculinity are held to the highest esteem, things like homophobia will be prevalent. Within the sub-genre of hip-hop, gangsta rap, homophobic remarks and attitudes are prevalent. Gang culture is very anti-gay, although exceptions are made for lesbianism. But these are all things that are not confined to race, but culture.
I came to post this. Whether those stories are true or just made up BS, I find it interesting that these artists would put something like that in their songs. If they where true haters, it seems like they would keep that stuff on the down low.
I think it was Eazy-E who had a song called “Nobody Move,” where, in the song, he holds up a bank and during the process he attempts to rape a woman only to find out she’s transgender. He then puts the gun up her skirt “because this is one f----- I had to hurt.” Hard to believe this trash was so mainstream at one point in time.
I seriously doubt it. I mean, it’s not like they carried over a crap attitude into a more enlightened area - the attitude towards gays expressed by homophobic African-Americans is the same as the attitude expressed by homophobic European-Americans, which tells me that it’s some shared part that’s been the biggest influence (and mostly the Christian church part of it, although it’s not like NoI and Black Muslims have enlightened attitudes to sexuality)
African nations may be overwhelmingly homophobic today, but they’re hardly reflections of unspoiled African attitudes. And for one African country: “South Africa is the fifth country, the first in Africa, and the second outside Europe, to legalize same-sex marriage”
When black people are homophobic it’s more likely to make the news because of the perceived irony of one minority group being biased against another. When the dominant group is biased against homosexuals that’s perceived as expected and not newsworthy. A lot of the difference is in the reporting.
I’ll help you out: those stories are not true. It’s a particularly infantile brand of humour with a side order of homophobia. It’s not really an explanation for homophobia, I wasn’t being serious.
People usually ask if I am Italian or Lebanese because of my tan complexion and straight brown hair. On the other hand, I am proud to be descended from this woman who must have been extraordinarily brave and resourceful to have escaped slavery, and when people ask about my ancestry I mention her with pride. But culturally, I identify as a French Canadian, because that is how I was raised.